Prius II w/ aftermarket HU or Prius III w/ JBL?

Buy the II and then get the new JBL MS-8.

Like many have said before Sound Quality is not about the number of speakers or the max watts, it's about presence, staging and frequency response.

Some recent comments from a Prius owner:

Source Crutchfield

There is also a very long and interesting thread about that product at DIYMA Forum JBL's MS-8 processor

I've just ordered mine yesterday and I'll let you know how it does in a week or so.

 

You are so right, listening to FM with the compressed bitrate is not so good. SAT is somewhat better but a good CD and it's incredible.
I was told even the new CD's are recorded at a lower bitrate? It's all about $$ "how much can we fit with low quality"

It's not worth putting out the $$$ for a good system unless you always listen to CD's.

 

Wrong stock wires are 18guage which can handle up to 500 watts RMS. JBL wires are sometimes 16awg which can handle up to 1000W RMS. I can guarantee you that you can not hear the difference between the stock JBL speaker wires and the 14 awg monster crap wires.

You're told wrong. All audio CDs are red book standard. 2ch 16bit linear PCM 44.1khz 1411.2kbit/s If it isn't your CD player will not play it. What you should have been told was that the source that goes into the CD recording is from a lower bitrate source such as lossy compression source like MP3s.

Volt rating on head units are at it's maximum undistorted output. Will an 8 volt head unit work with stock JBL amp? YES! so as long as you turn the HU beyond the JBL's rated input voltage. All head units's preouts are not class A. They don't putout its maximum voltage the moment you turn it on. Class A amps are the least efficient amps out there. That's why they don't make them anymore. 4V preout hooked up to a speaker is loud enough to listen by itself. A true 4v deck has enogh power drive a regular speaker to 90+db. If you're decks preout can't do that, then it's not a true 4V preout.

 

The aftermarket arena feeds on the "fear" that OEM stuff is inferior. I love the 24 DAC processor or whatever. For a loud interior of a car (Prius ain't no Lexus LS!), these specs are 99.999999999999999999999999999% worthless...and is only used by high schoolers in a pissing match! What matters much much more is the tuning and the balance of the sound.

Now, if you have a home stereo or theater system, then yeah, i can see the benefits of the above specs. In a car, you're just pissing money into the ocean. So, yeah, ajc, keep quoting those specs and the people-in-the-know will just laugh their butts off...while going to the bank with your money!

 

Is it me or does this MS-8 sounds like the OEM JBL amplifier in the Prius?? 8 channels of amplification...wattage is probably similar...it does all the processing internally...same company. But, the OEM JBL system is not surround sound. If not, then i am sure that the OEM JBL amp or Mark Levinson (or Harman Kardon) amp are all based on this technology. That is the key to car audio system...proper tuning and speaker placement plays a vital role.

 

Do not listen to this guy thai because he has no idea what he is talking about.
The JBL system is not worth the extra $1000, get the II and put in an aftermarket system. Just do a search on JBL and you will find most members don't think the JBL system is that great.

 

ajc, i think that this thread pretty much proves that you have no idea what you're talking about!

Please search for me...tell me how many people thinks that the JBL system is crap...i am dying to see this for myself! Also, tell me how many people have upgraded the JBL system. As for the magazines and car websites, they all pretty much think that the JBL system in the Camry and Prius to be quite good.

 

k.. could u guys take this pissin match outside.. you're not adding anything to the discussion.

Sam

 

It's not that difficult to do a search, but in your case it is. Do your own search and when you get the facts I think we will not hear from you anymore.

 

ajc--In the few weeks I've been looking in this forum I've come to value your opinion, expertise and experience more then one of the other posters in this thread.

That said the JBL/Toyota approach maximizes the sound quality while using lower cost components.

Assume the OP can get the III for $800 more then the II. Assume the OP is going to pay for professional installation, only way to have an apples to apples comparison.

Let's use installcard pricing. National. Let's the person purchase hardware at internet pricing. Cost to install a bluetooth receiver is $100, cost to install a pair of speakers is $55, component speakers is $85. I can't find the cost to install a SAT, probably at least $50. Total install cost (without an amp) is at least $300. Maybe the installer will include the cost to install the steering wheel adapter, otherwise add another $50.

$20 for dash kit, $10 for a wiring harness and $50 for a steering wheel adapter.

That leaves $420 for the HU, a pair of component speakers for the front and a pair of regular speakers for the back and a SAT receiver.. Can you beat the JBL system for that price? NO. You'll have to settle for keeping the stock speakers. That gives you around $500 for the HU and SAT.

You can't match the price of the JBL system. Posters who knock the JBL system plan to use the money saved toward the cost of a better system.

Thai is right, you can't get a better aftermarket sound system for the price of the JBL. I don't agree with the rest of his "points". No question a customer who's willing to spend more can get a better system.

My reading suggests people who think the JBL system is "crap" are willing to spend a lot more then $800 to get better quality. People who do their own installation can offset some of the increased cost.

edited to add--If you shop places like 6th Avenue (NY area) have deals on older models, sometimes including installation. You might get your price point but probably not improve the quality.

 

We can get there. No need to put in steering wheel controls or rear speakers. Add in a little for sound deadening around the door speakers. It should sound better and have better ipod/iphone connectivity. It will sound even better if you spend more. If you want the steering wheel controls, you may want the blue tooth ones that come with the JBL.

Yep, if I was spending the same amount I would have gotten the JBL. I wanted a back up camera and even better sound. So add on an amp ($170), an inexpensive subwoofer($200), a camera ($70) which if I had them installed would add $185 to installation. If you want to add audacity on a non-alpine that is anouther $400. This along with a more expensive head unit and speakers. I don't have steering wheel controls and don't miss them. I may add rear speakers but the system sounds good now. If its rear speakers I may go with a 3 way component set up front with a custom mounting pod, and mount the current front components in the rear. Either way I have better features and sound than the JBL with nav (needed for back up camera) for less money than that would cost.

 

MS-8's purpose is to let you continue to use your head unit and use different amps and speakers. If you don't have nav your are better off getting rid of the head unit. Adding the new processor to the same bad components isn't going to get you as much as getting the JBL in the first place. $800 is a lot of money to keep one of these toyota head units, but may be worth it if you want ATP or Solar roof and must pay for toyota's nav to get it.

Remember toyota makes the yaris and the Lexus GS based on generally the same car technology. The different components make a difference. You can only tune so far, after that you need better components to make a better product.

I don't know anyone that records digitally at low bitrates. I've mastered a few cds for my own and friends bands from tapes off the mixing boards, but that is live music. You can do apple lossless compression which is the same as cd quality. You're in a car so most things compressed to 256 kbps will likely sound the same as cd quality. I've ripped the bulk of my music at 320 and can not tell the difference on my better home stereo.

 

What is wrong with the stock headunit? Since the MS-8 is also an amplifier (8 channel amp), then one can easily get a cheapo aftermarket speaker (infinity reference for instance)...and let MS8 do its thing. The MS8 should easily drive the Infinitys. But, yeah, i agree with you...if you're going the MS8 route, then might as well get JBL option (prius III).

For those who want to upgrade the JBL system or make a big aftermarket system without being on a tight budget, then i would still recommend MS8 or Audyssey units for proper tuning. MS8 can do things that not many people (if at all) can do with their ears and 7-band equalizer. Audyssey has done cool things with my home theater...i can only imagine what it (and MS8) can do in a car!

 

MS8 is $800. You can pick up the eclipse unit that ajc has for $300 which has has bundled blue tooth for phone and music, ipod and usb integration, and line outs so cleaner signal than the stock units speaker out, and better dacs. You can use it as is, or add an alpine 660 processor $450 if you must have autoequalization and active crossovers. Or you can tune it with a reference cd, mic and computer manually, so future upgradable if you don't want to spend the money now. The MS-8 strength is it can undo all the processing that factory systems like the jbl do. Or you can get an alpine head unit that isn't quite as good, get the alpine inexpensive eq add on, and 45w/ch amp and still come out ahead, this will give you passive not active crossovers, but passive can sound as good or better.

Shawnb tried to get an alpine audyssey unit to work with his V with atp, the alpine rep spent days and could not get it to undo what the jbl amp was doing, I assume since jbl makes both they can work together. There is a dsp in the stock system, and the ms-8 needs to undo all the calculations first before it can equalize for the car. If you don't have nav and are ok with the non factory look, it is much easier to start with a clean signal than a processed one.

 

austingreen...ahh, i see! I see your point about it.

My guess is that if someone were to upgrade the JBL, then he/she would just gut the whole system. But, i guess ATP users are kinda stuck.

Is Imprint (Audyssey) cheaper than MS-8? I see some Alpine headunit with Imprint around $300? But, i figured that there is more to this or something??

 

Well the EISA thinks it's good enough for "2010-2011 Best Product of the Year" for the in-car electronics category.

source

And don't forget, you can have the best components (speakers, HU, cables...) but if they are tuned like crap they will sound like crap .

Just do a quick search and you'll see what wins SQ competition. It's not the most expensive setup but the one with the best tune and since the MS-8 is precisely a tuning DSP you'll see why it's that important in a "good" sounding system.

 

Yeah, i like the idea behind MS8 and Audyssey. I too have heard really bad sounds coming from the best of parts. This is why i disagree with AJC about much of what he said.

 

You can do small improvements if you need to keep the JBL, but it is much easier if you change everything.

This technology should not be very expensive, especially if you use a laptop to help tune it. The inexpensive imprint units will tune the frequencies. They won't modify time delays for component speakers or create active crossovers. Alpine also does not allow you to use the tuning as a starting point and modify it. The aftermarket alpine units also contain circuitry to try and undo what the factory system is doing, but people report this is buggy. I don't know anyone that has used an MS-8, but it will likely be able to undo the effects of the factory system in a much better way. MS-8 allows you to have it self tune, then modify the tunings and includes amplifiers. Pioneer seems to be one of the few companies that is making an affordable ($1200) audiophile CD/digital head unit. They allow for active crossovers of up to 3 way components and autotuning. But they don't put the tech in any of their navigation head units.