Mosque at Ground Zero?

you want a better reason? here's a better reason.

If you live and New York City, and you think that this will endanger you or your family because the bigots on one side and the terrorists on the other side will clash and violence will erupt on the street, does that make you a bigot? or does that make you a concerned citizen?

how would you explain this one? you're a muslim, but you have come out against this project. Are you a bigot against your own kind? you know as well as I do that if there are non-muslims supporting the mosque-thing, then there are bound to be muslims against it. It's a two-way street.

 

OK, OK, you convinced me. The 9/11 hijackers were all Muslim, so we shouldn't build any sort of Islamic cultural center anywhere near Ground Zero.

However, that doesn't go near enough to be sensitive to New Yorkers. All the hijackers were male, so we should make sure there isn't a men's restroom anywhere within five miles of Ground Zero. To argue otherwise would be supporting terrorism.

 

i just posed a couple of scenerios and I was hoping you could explain them. But, sounds like you're over-reacted a bit.

 

Humm, lets see, if Catholics are against a Protestant church being built, does that mean any christian against the Protestant church is a Catholic?

The muslim sect that is trying to build the cultural center is not Sunni or Shiite, the two majority sects, the ones most associated with radical Islam, the sect is Sufism, kind of like Catholic and Protestant in explanation. The Sufism sect is not liked by Sunni or Shiite sects very well, yet they are all based on Islam, and the sect is attacked & persecuted in the Middle East and Asia because they don't follow radical Islam.

So in conclusion, would there be muslims against the center, I wouldn't doubt that at all, the sect is not liked by the majority of muslims, does that make the muslims that don't want the center bigots, I would think so.

 

No way, you get a trip to NYC.

 

so, i should get to go too since i actually made the post #300 right?:tea:

 

i think if we all throw in a quid you'll have it!

 

again. Since this is such an educational thread, I thought I would attempt to clarify that it's not exactly correct to refer to Sufis or Sufism as if it were a single sect or a branch of Islam. It is not the same as saying someone is Sunni, Shia, Protestant or Catholic. It's more of an attitude or philosophy, based on a belief in having a mystical or direct experience of the divine, through a wide variety of groups and practices.

In the Muslim world, they are usually acting nominally within the boundaries of the local culture (so as to avoid charges of heresy), so that a person could be nominally a Sunni or Shia, and still be a Sufi, participating in various chanting, singing, whirling, dancing and other meditative practices. For that reason, some people even say Sufism predates Islam, since there have been mystics in the deserts and mountains from time immemorial.

There are a multitude of different sufi groups, usually derived from a particular lineage of teachers/mystics, and each with their own unique culture, beliefs and practices. The more liberal attitudes Sufis tend to have towards dogma, and other cultures, beliefs and religions, is a natural outgrowth of their mystical beliefs and experiences. As a result, there are even universalist sufi groups in the West that include people from many religions.

For anyone interested, Wikipedia has this fairly good article on classical Sufism:

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sufism"]Sufism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

How about a round-rip taxi ride to the Muslim cultural center/mosque
nearest you?

Sort of a busman's holiday.

 

Stev0 it appears your mind is made up and no amount of reasoning can persuade you that 70%+ of New Yorkers and an almost equal percentage of American's are not bigots and there is an issue of insensitivity here?

Personally I think this is an issue driven by a political agenda that wishes this type of divisiveness as it detracts from other issues not being addressed such as the economy and jobs, it's as simple as that. Otherwise why hasn't the Greek Orthodox Church which has petitioned NYC for almost ten years received their permit to rebuild?

 

No. Just open a gallery next door selling images of "GOD" ie Mohamed.

 

this will help explain Radical Islam

*this is about understanding where RADICAL islam came from and how it effects the world*

Moderate Muslims are not Radical Muslims.


facts do not equal bigotry

"talk among yourselves. I'm getting verklempt""




watch it all!!!!!
get ready to block a lot of cookies

part1
[ame="http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=be2_1282982561"]LiveLeak.com - Radical Islam (1 Of 7)[/ame]

part 2
[ame="http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4b1_1282982613"]LiveLeak.com - Radical Islam (2 Of 7)[/ame]

part 3
[ame="http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=88e_1282982612"]LiveLeak.com - Radical Islam (3 Of 7)[/ame]

part 4
[ame="http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=11a_1282982611"]LiveLeak.com - Radical Islam (4 Of 7)[/ame]

part 5
[ame="http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=7b6_1282982602"]LiveLeak.com - Radical Islam (5 Of 7)[/ame]

part 6
[ame="http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=70d_1282982602"]LiveLeak.com - Radical Islam (6 Of 7)[/ame]

part 7
[ame="http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=8bf_1282982756"]LiveLeak.com - Radical Islam (7 Of 7)[/ame]

 

lol, now that's just wrong.

 

I totally agree there is an issue of insensitivity. 70% of those polled are insensitive. You poll 70 wolves and 30 sheep and you'll get the exact same figures.

And yes, I am willing to listen to any argument - just one will do - that has nothing to do with bigotry ("We don't want them towel-heads next to us, they are insensitive!" doesn't count). I STILL have yet to hear one.

OK, I do agree Radical Muslims are dangerous whacked-out lunatics.

Of course, so are radical Christians, radical Jews, even radical Atheists.

Fortunately, the Burlington Coat Factory Cultural Center has nothing to so with that.

 

You are aware that you aren't making it better, while you are correct, unless you can lower the explanation down to a level that the haters can understand, you don't gain any ground, they can't separate things if you tell them there is no difference and try to group it all into one.

 

could have swore I offered two scenarios that you still haven't addressed. You just sort of flew off the handle. If you "have yet to hear one" it's because you choose not to.

 

Would these be mad hatters from Alice?



Tom

 

LOL, that must be it!

 

The day religion goes away, the world will be a much better place.