EPA on Volt: 93 MPGe electric, 37 mpg gas-only, 60mpg combined

78% of the commute one way on a typical day is 20 miles or less (40 miles or less round trip). Of course there are other trips than a typical commute. That data was collected in 2001.



Source

 

The Volts at the shows are fully loaded, the $41k Volt is the base model with cloth seats and few luxuries, like the $23k Prius III I would imagine! As far as I know, Audi's and Beemers come wrapped in leather and goodies even at the entry level prices!

 

It depends on supply and demand. When you have a full waiting list and people paying sticker price or higher, every car coming off the line will be fully loaded to maximize profit.

 

Good point!

Question to everyone:
Will Nissan be able to produce enough Leafs to keep up with demand, or will Nissan be maxed out; allowing the Volt to help get more Americans plugging in? And will Toyota's 13 mile plug-in save the world from oil?

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All depends on the price of gas. Since the end of September here, gas has gone up 30 cents per gallon! This during the period where gas prices have usually fallen after summer demand has faded. The Leaf should sell all Nissan can make if the preorders turn into actual sales. The Volt has big orders from the Govt. and GE, wonder if we'll be able to see those sales numbers separated from those sold to actual private customers! The PHEV Prius will sell very well, especially if the price is in the $27k range. Save us from oil? Doubt it! SUV's and big trucks will outsell em all for many more years!

 

Nissan will be maxed out for the first two years until they get American production going. They can expand to other regions or dump the cars on hertz if any do not sell. After American production is at full blast, I doubt they will sell anything close to full production, but I would be happy to be proven wrong.

I do think PHEV makes more sense than full electrification. It just makes sense to put a bigger battery and a plug in these hybrids. It won't save the world from oil, but the world doesn't really need saving. They will reduce oil consumption, but I wouldn't expect any measurable impact for 5 years.

For those that think it is all about the price of oil, oil has traditionally sold in the range of $20-$25 /bbl adjusted for inflation. It is now over $80, so it is historically high, just lower than 2008 when market manipulation was taking place. The price could go to half or double, but I would bet we will stay between $65-$100/bbl for the next couple of years unless there is oil blackmail or some other financial manipulation scheme. At these price many marginal researves can be profitably produced. Electrification is needed for the long run though. At these prices oil imports are a huge drain on the economy and electric substitution makes economic sense.

 

A most interesting chart. I had privately scoffed at the 13 mile range of Toyota's plug-in Prius. ... I thought, why bother? But the chart suggest that greater than 51% of the commuting public can be accommodated on EV alone one way. In time, there will be charging stations at work and along the street, so the Toyota plug-in makes a lot more sense than I had realized.

Also, makes me wonder if Chevy is paying a too hefty price, in terms of complexity, weight, expensive battery, deminished seating, and small trunk ..... and purchase price, for a significantly reduced commuting population. Leaf, OTOH, with only EV power, can appeal not only to commuters, but Saturday jaunts, visits with Grandma in the surburbs and etc.

I have still not read anything that deters me from thinking if I were in the market ... which I am not, I would strongly consider a plug-in Prius; a Cruze, or a Leaf.

 

I know you shouldn't laugh at someone elses misfortune, but with this picture I'm finding it very hard not to!

Can imagine his grinning face as he passed five cars on the straight before having the grin wiped from his face as he lost it on the wet bend.

 

I am reminded of a story I once read about the Soviet nuclear bomb. It seems Beria had a Gulog of scientists working to purify uranium 235. One day, a Soviet task master came in and with great pride laid down a sample and said,"See, Comrade! We have achieved higher purity than the Americans!"

The chief soviet scientist looked at the sample and back at the commissar who had sweated this sample out of his workers and said, "But the Americans achieved only the purity needed for a bomb."

I'm also reminded of the King County report, now two years old, that plug-in Prius in fleet usage don't achieve the mileage claimed by the advocates. I know this is heresy but two years ago, the plug-in advocates where claiming '100 MPG' yet I read the report and the lower mileage achieved in fleet use made sense.

IMHO, GM is the Soviet Commissar who was so proud that his plug-in has 'beaten' the competition but lost sight of the real requirement. He wasted time and resources over purifying U-235. Not to worry (for our GM friends,) I think they may 'see the light.' . . . Wait, this is GM, right? Seriously, don't underestimate their ability to understand what is going on . . . in some rare and sad to say, at risk cases.

I read enough of the "Plug-in" Prius forum to understand what is going on. Sad to say, after being criticized for "Spammed Advertisements" I lost interest in sharing my insights and stopped following that 'dead end' forum. Darn shame but that is not my problem.

So I won't rule out GM's engineering team . . . they have some bright minds. As for their management . . . well there has been one thankful purge. The question is do they need another . . I don't know.

Bob Wilson

 

I agree, there are "bright minds" in the GM Engineering Department. But historically, they seem to loose their direction (Corvair, Vega, Chevette, Toranodo among a few) along the way. I suspect, GM tends to become too political?..... perhaps yielding too much to the UAW? or congress?

I have no doubt the Volt will sell .... the government and GE will assure that .... It will be interesting reading how it fares with the driving public. I suspect we will discover it has been over promised, over hyped ................ and certainly, overpriced.

 

Some of GM's higher up's went to Aptera. Where'd THEIR delivery dates go?

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