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Japan hit by 8.9 earthquake w/tsunami

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by Trebuchet, Mar 11, 2011.

  1. Trebuchet

    Trebuchet Senior Member

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    Death toll now 16,000 plus, way beyond what I thought. Is the crisis overblown or being downplayed hard to tell because as far as I know only various non-Japanese experts and TEPCO employees are onsite.
     
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  2. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    That is dead + missing combined. I'm seeing confirmed dead figures not quite yet to 7000.
    Well within my expectations. Watching nearly-live video barely an hour after the quake, I couldn't imagine the toll staying under 10,000. Made it hard to sleep that night, wondering what size the coming morning tsunami on our coast would reach.

    And considering our own preparations, it would have been far worse if it happened in the subduction zone just off our coast. Which it will, some decade.
     
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  3. tpfun

    tpfun New Member

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    The US is ready to help.

    quote: TOKYO – ... the government acknowledged it was slow to respond to the disasters that the prime minister called a "great test for the Japanese people."
    ...
    Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano admitted that Japan was not prepared for what happened.
    ...
    While Tokyo has welcomed international help for the natural disasters, the government initially balked at assistance with the nuclear crisis. That reluctance softened as the problems at Fukushima multiplied.
    On Friday, though, Edano said Tokyo was asking Washington for help and that the two were discussing the specifics of the problem.
    AP
     
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  4. amm0bob

    amm0bob Permanently Junior...

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    The signs in town tell us there's about 8 minutes until the first tsunami wave hits Brookings... that's just enough time to scamper up the hillside on a little motorbike.
     
  5. amm0bob

    amm0bob Permanently Junior...

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    There is nothing they could have done any better than what they have IMO... this wasn't a usual quake and tsunami event... this one was off the charts.
     
  6. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    For those wishing to improve their geological knowledge of earthquakes w/o too much pain:

    https://webapps.utsc.utoronto.ca/ose/uploads/JAPAN.pdf

    The author's prognosis for Tokyo over the long term is not cheerful. I did not know it was so much built on sediments sensitive to liquifaction.

    Anyway, evidence is abundant and still accumulating that extremely powerful events have occurred in deep past. That if repeated in today's built world would (will) be quite disruptive. No, we cannot spend enough to completely protect everyone against every foreseeable event. However it seems very likely (to me at least) that the current approach of making as much profit as possible, using previous generation technology, and polluting until some government organization tells you it's time to stop... well this does not appear to be the optimal approach either.

    In no way is this a specific attack on Japan. Unfortunately it is far more general. It challenges humans (especially wealthy ones) to envision a better future, and work towards achievng that. Even if it costs serious money. To not do so makes civilization appear, well, uncivilized.

    And yet, that path towards techno-nirvana, all holding hands and singing kumbaya will not commence tomorrow. Instead we will face many more future quakes, tsunamis, core mini-melts, floods, droughts, and all the rest of it. And we shall say "what a tragedy; we had no way of knowing..."

    We didn't eh?
     
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  7. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Is the place small enough to avoid extreme traffic jams on the way out? If not, how well does that motorbike weave through stop-and-go traffic?

    Within the Puget Sound zone, nearly all disaster planning is based around 'shelter in place' because we don't have the road capacity to evacuate the urban areas in any reasonable timeframe. But tsunamis are not as high on the planning list here as on the outer coast.
    They can always do better. This was well within the theoretical charts, just off the chart of normal experience.

    For earthquake and tsunami defenses, we and the rest of the world can make improvements by merely copying them. But since they are already the leaders, they must be more inventive in order to raise the bar.

    For nuclear power safety, this event has exposed a lot of previous sniping and criticism about that plant and its outdated designs. Even though modern designs are greatly improved, a deep engineering analysis of these incidents is essential to gauge what failed, what worked, and what is needed in existing plants and future designs. Just as in commercial airline crashes, each tragedy needs to be distilled into learning experiences and design knowledge and improved operating practices for everybody else.
     
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  8. tpfun

    tpfun New Member

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    US responds with aid.

    quote: It's emblematic of the massive U.S. response to the Japanese disaster. The Defense Department is dedicating so many service members to the relief effort that it's having to pull others out to make room...
    More than 17,000 of the roughly 49,000 U.S. service members in Japan have been assigned to the relief effort, the Defense Department said Friday, transporting tons of humanitarian supplies, clearing debris from flattened streets and neighborhoods, and providing high-pressure water pumps that are being used to help cool the critically damaged nuclear reactors at the Fukushima Dia-ichi plant.
    As US military pitches in, families fret back home - World news - Asia-Pacific - msnbc.com
     
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  9. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

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    Was watching BBC News at the office today. Those in the most stricken areas are still cold, and barely eating. Their government had better get on the ball
     
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  10. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    They are still doing better than the US did with Katrina...
     
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  11. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    I think I finally figured out why some of the people around here don't believe the Japanese government, media, and the scientists on the ground there.

    When there is an evacuation of 100k+ people in a large radius like what happened people expect it is because something bad is going to happen. They do not trust that the government would evacuate people just because there is a threat of something maybe happening. Therefore, if evacuated, then the plant will explode and they just aren't telling us. The more I hear people talk about distrusting government and "why else would they have put in an evacuation zone" it makes more sense why people are so hysterical over nothing. People around here are distrustful of government and fearful of science, so when the government makes a decision based off of science, the world is obviously ending...
     
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  12. Trebuchet

    Trebuchet Senior Member

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    Saying it's nothing makes very little sense to me. :confused:
     
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  13. amm0bob

    amm0bob Permanently Junior...

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    [​IMG]
     
  14. spiderman

    spiderman wretched

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    Those that trust the government have obviously never worked for the government.
     
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  15. tpfun

    tpfun New Member

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    Tap water affected

    quote:
    Tokyo (CNN) -- Despite being urged not to hoard bottled water, residents of Japan's capital on Wednesday snapped it up in droves after testing showed radioactive material in tap water at levels unsafe for infants.
    The city's water agency said the spike was likely caused by problems at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant, located 240 kilometers (150 miles) away. Earlier Wednesday, Tokyo government officials advised residents not to give tap water to infants or use it in formula after tests at a purification plant detected higher levels of radioactive iodine.
    Bottled water scarce in Japan after tap water tests unsafe for infants - CNN.com
     
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  16. a_gray_prius

    a_gray_prius Rare Non-Old-Blowhard Priuschat Member

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    Chernobyl Cleanup Survivor's Message for Japan: 'Run Away as Quickly as Possible'

     
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  17. SPEEDEAMON

    SPEEDEAMON Professional Car Nut

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    Although I agree with Manzurova, the handling of Chernobyl by the Russian Gov't at the time is a lot different from that of Japan.
    At least they're trying to do all they can, sacrificing their exposure and not running away. The brave men working while their radiation meters are beeping warning sounds is heart wrenching to watch.
     
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  18. tpfun

    tpfun New Member

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    Japan finally confirms US guidelines

    quote:
    Radiation could affect people outside 30km zone
    Chief Cabinet Secretary Yukio Edano says computer forecasts show that radiation leaking from a nuclear plant could pose a hazard to people outside its 30-kilometer zone.

    Edano said at a news conference on Wednesday that a computer forecast system has shown that radiation levels in some areas outside the 30-kilometer zone would exceed 100 millisieverts, which is the level that could affect the human thyroid if a person is exposed to it outdoors for 24 hours.


    NHK WORLD English
     
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  19. a_gray_prius

    a_gray_prius Rare Non-Old-Blowhard Priuschat Member

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    This is really heart wrenching:
    Fukushima Fifty: First pictures emerge from inside Japan's stricken nuclear power plant | Mail Online

    On top of what looks like a (likely criminal) cover up at Hitachi of flaws in Reactor #4 (who knows what other flaws exist):
    Fukushima Engineer Says He Helped Cover Up Flaw at Dai-Ichi Reactor No. 4 - Bloomberg
     
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  20. stanmcq

    stanmcq StanMcQ

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    Not good...
     
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