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EBH too wimpy at 400W?

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Fuel Economy' started by Rstaton, Apr 14, 2011.

  1. Rstaton

    Rstaton New Member

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    According to my estimation, it would take about 1.3kwh to heat the engine block significantly.  But the heaters I saw for sale are rated 400W.  I would think this is too little power, since you would have to leave it running 3+ hours to transfer enough energy.  Meanwhile the engine is also cooling off during that period, throwing away the heat you've put in.

    What about a 1500W heater with a thermostat to avoid overheating?  Then if you connect a timer that starts it running 1 hour before you normally leave, then you're set.

    My calculations are based on a thermal mass equivalent to 55L of water and a 20C temperature rise.  This requires 1100 kcal, which converts to 4.6 Mj, which converts to 1.28 kwh.

    I estimated 55L very roughly by imagining the engine is approx. 12" X 12" X 24", and assuming it has the same thermal mass as water.  Am I making any major errors?

    Does anyone have complaints about their EBH?
     
  2. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    I think 400 watts is about right. Someone over at CleanMPG did extensive testing, measuring coolant temps after different times. Just rough summary, with an average 4 cylinder vehicle and a 400 watt heater, temp were raised maybe 35 degrees centigrade, with 80~90 percent of the raise happening in the first hour, and a more gradual raise to level by the end of hour two.

    We're using the 400 watt Toyota heater on ours, 2 hours works fine, yielding a warmed block. The object is not to raise the engine to near operating temperature, just to get it on it's way, make it behave more like a summer warm-up.
     
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  3. Rstaton

    Rstaton New Member

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    Well, that sounds encouraging. My commute is 2 miles, so the engine is warming up the whole time, which ruins the MPG.
     
  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    2 miles? Ouch. Considering walking/biking, at least in nice weather ;)

    I know: what's the car for?
     
  5. cproaudio

    cproaudio Speedlock Overrider

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    wow only 2 miles? That's not even far enough to get 40+mpg. A high power electric bike would fit your commute perfectly. You can get one for a couple grand that can do 40+mph for 10 mile range.
     
  6. Rstaton

    Rstaton New Member

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    Well, it turns out this is a bad neighborhood. I don't want to risk being out and vulnerable. I'll probably just move to where my commute is more than 2 miles.
     
  7. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    That's too bad. I was actually thinking it might be something like that. Anyway, a few more thoughts on the Toyota Block Heater:

    Our previous Civic Hybrid's block heater immersed directly in the coolant. The heater element replaces the stock engine block coolant drain bolt, kind of a drain bolt with leads.

    Whenever it was plugged in, within 30 seconds you would hear a sort of ping/hiss sound, like a kettle put on a heating element. Reassuring.

    The Prius Block Heater, OTOH, fits into a cylinder that's in the coolant zone, but the heater itself is not directly immersed. There's a heat conductive gel, to help.

    When you plug it in, there is no sound, no audible feedback. But give it a couple of hours, and then feel some of the hoses and you'll see it's working. Another check: the resistance across plug prongs should be around 30~40 ohms, if it's ok (infinite, and you have a break).

    The part's around $50. Installed set me back $400~. Still, almost worth it: I've heard install is a bit of a struggle. I believe the install location is reachable from below, through the oil maintenance flap.

    I've heard it's also a bit tricky getting the gel on the heater core, and then getting it into the cylinder. One trick is to leave a groove in the layer of gel, so air can vent easier as you put it in.

    Also, assuming you're going to have the plug coming out through the grill of the front bumper, do a double zip-tie connection at the slats, with just enough hanging out. And try to find an extension cord with easy pull-out, just in case you forget.

    I've managed to chew up one plug so far, not following the above.