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Spark plugs shot at 38,000 miles

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Zembu, Oct 11, 2011.

  1. Zembu

    Zembu Junior Member

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    So in the middle of a road trip 9 days ago my check engine light came on. I was 2 hours into an 8 hour round trip day trip. I was close to a Toyota dealer so I went there for a diagnosis. They said my MAF bank 1 sensor 1 needed replacing but they didn't have the part so couldn't do the fix but I'd be okay to complete my trip. They collected their $100 and sent me on my way with no warning lights on.

    30 minutes later the check engine returns and I'm unable to accelerate. I stop the car for a bit and then am able to continue my trip. I have one other incident where when I was traveling at a low speed, I lost all power. I was able to drive home 4 hours with the check engine light on but no further issues with the exception that I got less than 20 miles a gallon for the trip.

    Took my car to a local Toyota dealer. They independently diagnosed that the same sensor needed replacing. They also told me that my spark plugs were shot. According to the service rep, they looked like they were from a car with over 100,000 miles.

    Is this possible given the description above from the first time my check engine light came on?

    Just posting to find out if anyone has ever had something similar happen in relation to the spark plugs or if it seems legit. I've already asked to have the old parts returned to me so I'll get to see the plugs for myself but not until after I'm out $600 plus for the plugs and sensor replacement.
     
  2. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    What codes were listed on your receipts?

    I don't have my warranty booklet in front of me but I'd think that some of those parts might be covered by the 5 year/60K powertrain warranty or possibly an emissions warranty.
     
  3. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    That sounds really wacky. If your odo reading is 38,000 miles the engine was on maybe 20,000 of those miles and not running hard at all unless you beat the crap out of the car.
    Been on this forum for four years and the plugs have been a non issue in this car. Never seen a post complaining of bad plugs unless the windshield tray gasket was bad and during a rainstorm or car wash allowed water to leak onto the top of the engine and leak into a spark plug well and short out the ignitor. Seen alot of those.
    I'd like to see those plugs and much more importantly we'd all like to see the codes it threw. Give us the codes.
    Btw I have 39,000 on my 07 and the car runs like new so very interested in your outcome.
     
  4. Zembu

    Zembu Junior Member

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    P0171, p2195, p3190, poaof

    My understanding is that the p2195 code is what lead to the Bank 1 Sensor 1 replacement recommendation.

    I haven't picked my car up yet so I'll be sure to ask about warranty coverage. I know the 3 year/36,000 is out of the question. I don't think the plugs will be covered under powertrain.
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    did you buy the car new?
     
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  6. Zembu

    Zembu Junior Member

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    Yes, I'm the original owner. I've followed the service schedule. The car is not used for commuting with about half the miles coming from longer trips (3-4 hour drives).

    Just before all this started, I had my front brakes replaced, back brakes adjusted, and battery replaced.

    The cynic in me thinks that when the battery was replaced they messed something up but I really have no proof of that except for the coincidence of the check engine light coming on in the first real drive after having that work done.
     
  7. richard schumacher

    richard schumacher shortbus driver

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    How much Diesel fuel was put into it?
     
  8. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    Having the front brakes replaced at or before 38K miles on a Prius is HIGHLY fishy and unusual. Unless you're slamming on the brakes and thus preventing regen, your brakes should last a LONG time.

    Many folks here have gone >100K miles on the original brakes. I'm still on the originals at ~57K miles. The 2nd gens at Advanced Vehicle Testing Activity - Hybrid Electric Vehicles never had their brakes replaced before they stopped testing the cars at 160K miles. The article linked to from http://priuschat.com/forums/prius-h...ery-reliable-vancouver-yellow-cab-update.html also indicates VERY long brake life.
     
  9. Zembu

    Zembu Junior Member

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    I've read a few times about that kind of thing related somewhat to these types of problems but I didn't but diesel in my car. I'm not an idiot.

    Now that doesn't mean that the gas station I filled up at before my trip didn't sell me sub-par gas. It is a place I don't usually buy from but I have no way to know at this point. It certainly is something I considered as a possibility but there is no way for me to know. And more importantly there is no way I can hold that station accountable.
     
  10. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    Parsing the tea leaves...

    P0171 System too lean
    P2195 O2 sensor system stuck lean

    This can be caused by a dirty MAF sensor. If MAF was completely inop, there is a code for that.

    P3190 Poor engine power
    P0A0F Engine failed to start

    These are symptomatic of an engine oil overfill.

    File a complaint with Toyota if this is not all fixed under warranty. Find a different dealer.
     
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  11. Eoin

    Eoin Active Member

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    Irridium spark plugs should last 100,000 miles. And brakes should be good for almost that.
     
  12. dhanson865

    dhanson865 Expert and Devil's advocate

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    I guess it's possible that the dealer tech that worked on your car during the road trip swapped out the spark plugs? Putting some old plugs in your car and taking your good plugs to put in another car? Doesn't make much sense as cheap as spark plugs are but it is possible since they had your car.

    I'm assuming you didn't stand there and watch their work the whole time.

    If you did watch and know that didn't happen then we can laugh this off as preposterous but I'm throwing it out there.

    “When you have eliminated all which is impossible, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.” Sherlock Holmes
     
  13. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    Now your saying you had the front brakes replaced at 38K.
    Thats a total rip off. I have the same mileage on my car and the brakes are
    like new and used so infreq. there somewhat rusted.
    Whoever is servicing this car is flat out cheating you imho.
    I wouldn't trust anything whoever is servicing this car says including the codes.
    There just throwing out well know car parts names to you.
    Brakes
    Sparkplugs

    Which is stupid because these specific parts last forever on a hybrid.

    Give us the name of the dealer please. And pics of the sparkplugs.
     
  14. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    If I was the owner I would be tempted to take the car home sans sensor replacement, clean the MAF and throttle body myself, and see what happens.

    I have no explanation for brake replacement after 38k highway miles. My front brake pads are down a couple of mm after 140k miles, in mixed highway and city driving.

    Assuming OP is being straight with us, I too would find a different mechanic.
     
  15. Zembu

    Zembu Junior Member

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    On the brakes, I do think they needed replacing. I could feel that something was up with the brakes and I tend to drive my car hard. If anything the reaction to the brake replacement here tells me I need to adjust my driving habits.

    The brake recommendation was initiated by Darcars Toyota of Silver Spring, MD who I don't trust. I took my car to Lee's Auto Service in NE DC. I small shop with people I trust and they confirmed the brakes needed replacing.

    The spark plug recommendation was from Jim Coleman Toyota of Bethesda, MD. I just picked the car up after having the plugs and af sensor replaced. Car was running fine for the 8 mile drive home which included some highway driving.

    Looks like I'll be on a trip this weekend so I'll find out real soon if this resolved all my issues. As to exactly why and how this all happened, I'm left with a couple possibilities thanks to the replies here but no one thing that I can point at and say, "That's it!"

    Picture of the plugs to follow after I've made 5 posts.
     
  16. Zembu

    Zembu Junior Member

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    Picture of the plugs:

    [​IMG]
     
  17. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    look okay from that angle?
     
  18. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    The only conspiracy theory that I have is an oil overfill caused all this, and the dealership is in CYA mode.
     
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  19. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    That's not the end of the spark plug were interested in. Spin 'em around and put some light on them.
    But from what I can see they just look sooty and the pintle looks real good.

    I'm going with Seilerts on this one.

    And how hard are you driving the car?
     
  20. Zembu

    Zembu Junior Member

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    A couple more photos.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I've now checked my oil thanks to another thread here and it does appear that it is overfilled. I repeated it multiple times with 5 minutes in between and each time the oil is half as much over the second dot as the space between the 2 dots.

    My question is what now? I assume I should not drive the car if I don't have to as I could end up with the same thing happening to me that happened the last time I went on a 4 hour drive. Should I go back to the dealer that did the oil change (Darcars, Silver Spring, MD) 4 weeks ago and have them take out the excess oil? ask them to refund me the cost of the oil change and reimburse me for the cost of the other repairs that were done at another dealer because of issue that were generated by my oil being overfilled?

    Should I also go back to the dealer that just replaced my spark plugs (Jim Coleman, Bethesda, MD) and complain that it wasn't really needed and ask for my money back?

    Should I get the excess oil removed elsewhere and complain directly to Toyota?

    Any advice on the best way to handle this now would be greatly appreciated.

    As to the question of how hard I'm driving my car, I tend to accelerate aggressively and stop hard. I'm not gentle with my brakes.