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Replaced 2 Transaxles and the HV Battery and Still Not Working... advice please.

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by phideltgt, Jan 9, 2012.

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  1. cwerdna

    cwerdna Senior Member

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    The rest of the above is also at http://autoshop101.com/forms/Hybrid15.pdf.
     
    #61 cwerdna, Jan 30, 2012
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  2. phideltgt

    phideltgt Junior Member

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    I towed the Prius tonight with my Step Dad's help. 12v was at 12.3v prior to starting. Prius went into D and in ready mode. Although I had to try a few times to get into D. It would only go into neutral. So, turned it on/off twice. Third time it went into D and Ready. I towed it 20 ft and had to stop in order to get him on his cell phone. In that 20 ft I could hear the ICE turning. Once we tried to restart it wouldn't go into D. The 12v was at 11.8v. So, I put a fully charged truck battery in parrell. It went into D and ready. I didn't hear the ICE turn at all during the second tow. We towed it about 2 miles and got up to 28 mph. I did not see any sign of charging on the MFD at any time. When we left the HV was on 1 bar and that's where it was when we returned. Halfway during the second tow I noticed that 'ready' was not on anymore, although still in D. So, I stopped the tow to restart to see if I could tow it in 'Ready' as well as D. In trying to restart it would only go into neutral, even with the other fully charged battery in parrell. So, towed it home it neutral. It sits now on a trickle charge. I think we can agree the 12v is weak. But, even still I don't think the tow worked or would have worked. My next step is going to be to measure the volts on the HV battery.
     
    #62 phideltgt, Jan 30, 2012
  3. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    You need either clips for your leads, or linesmans gloves that insulate to 1000V.

    Also, you have the polarity correct, but you need to attach to the posts where the frame wires connect. They are at the other end of the copper bus bars in the photo, and were not connected because this picture was taken with the battery out of the car. Otherwise, the leads are hot all the time, and this is even more dangerous.

    But, before tearing everything apart, hook up your code reader and see what it says. It may not give you all code, but many readers will report all P0xxx codes, and many HV fault codes are P0Axx.
     
    #63 seilerts, Jan 30, 2012
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  4. andyprius

    andyprius Senior Member

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    I don't follow you Ed, +100 V on one leg and + 100 V on the other leg, means the meter will read nothing. :)
     
    #64 andyprius, Jan 31, 2012
  5. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    Voltage is all relative. If there is +100V on one leg and -100V on another you will still read 200V or -200V between the 2 probes. But if you have 100V (referenced to ground) on the ground terminal of the battery there are much worse issues.
     
    #65 2k1Toaster, Jan 31, 2012
  6. phideltgt

    phideltgt Junior Member

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    No DTCs showed on my universal scanner. However, on Dec 9th when the dealer looked at the car they reported the following...

    "Findings: Master Warning Light; Check Engine Light on; DTC P0A80 Replace HV Battery Pack; P0A0F Info. Code 238 Engine failed to start; P3000 Info. codes 123 & 388 HV Battery system failure."

    Dealer interpreted this for me as you have a bad trans and a bad HV battery (bad cell). So, I replaced the transmission (Dec 28th). After the trans install I took it back to the shop that put in the refurbished battery (on Dec 5th) for a battery replacement. They said, nope all cells are fine.

    Any further interpretation of the codes would be very helpful.
     
    #66 phideltgt, Jan 31, 2012
  7. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    0A80- Battery pack needs replaced (1 bad cell usually)
    3000-123 Battery computer tells HV ECU that battery is bad.
    0A0F-238 Fails to start

    3000-388 May be due to low SoC. Here's from the manual: Repeated engine start checks may cause the SOC to drop, resulting in DTC P3000-388 being set. In this case, charge the HV battery using the THS charger.
     
    #67 seilerts, Jan 31, 2012
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  8. andyprius

    andyprius Senior Member

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    You mis-read my post Ed.
     
    #68 andyprius, Jan 31, 2012
  9. UKCLASSICPRIUS

    UKCLASSICPRIUS Member

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    whats the total volts in your hv pack?

    have you thought about the invertor atall?

    Have you tried getting any DTC's? or proper codes read? what was the condition of the car when on 9th dec you had it read with those errors? where they pending?
     
    #69 UKCLASSICPRIUS, Feb 2, 2012
  10. phideltgt

    phideltgt Junior Member

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    hv battery charge.jpg

    The voltage on the main battery is 198.6V. Attached is a picture. Does that mean it has an issue? Sorry for not getting back sooner. I suppose I had to build up some bravery to test the HV battery. Thank you.
     
    #70 phideltgt, Feb 11, 2012
  11. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    198.6V is quite low considering the "nominal" voltage is 201.6V (7.2V x 28 modules) and the battery voltage usually will be 10-20% above the nominal voltage if the battery is working right.

    If you remove the battery cover and measure the voltage of each of the 28 modules, you will probably find at least one module whose voltage is substantially below the others. That module is the one with a problem.
     
    #71 Patrick Wong, Feb 11, 2012
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  12. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    Potentially. But this car has also been without ICE power for a long time so the pack has been running low without any recharging. It may just be low.
     
    #72 2k1Toaster, Feb 11, 2012
  13. uart

    uart Senior Member

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    It's definitely lower than it should be. That corresponds to an average of 1.18volts per cell (7.1V /module). This would typically correspond to 20% or less charge, though it could be just one bad module.
     
    #73 uart, Feb 11, 2012
  14. phideltgt

    phideltgt Junior Member

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    Tested and retested each module making sure to touch the tip of each bolt. The voltage of each module from passenger side to drivers side goes... 6.76, 7.26, 7.24, 7.19, 7.17, 7.13, 7.06, 7.09, 7.11, 7.09, 7.06, 7.08, 7.10, 7.04, 6.96, 6.93, 7.09, 6.99, 7.06, 7.09, 7.11, 7.11, 7.12, 7.13, 7.18, 7.20, 7.24, 6.99

    Here are some pictures of what looks like some corrosion.
    battery 1.jpg
    battery 2.jpg
    battery 3.jpg
     
    #74 phideltgt, Feb 14, 2012
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  15. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    Those are all over the place. Anything less than 7V is at 0% SoC. This is what I would expect to see from a battery that sat for over a year.

    Since you have it down this far, buy a charger or two. Drain each module to 6V. Then add 5 amp hours of charge. If you buy the charger listed below, I can help you with the settings.

    I do not recommend taking this to a dealer and using the HV charger, because there are imbalances inside module pairs that the car will not be able to resolve (e.g. 6.76V and 7.26V is a >20% SoC difference).

    Dynam Supermate DC6 Doublpower Balance Charger (Blue)
     
    #75 seilerts, Feb 14, 2012
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  16. 2009Prius

    2009Prius A Wimpy DIYer

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    Wow that looks like a nice inexpensive charger to fix the HV battery. Looking forward to the result.
     
    #76 2009Prius, Feb 14, 2012
  17. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    +1. That battery is beyond Toyota's "repair" (i.e. HV Charge) limits. They will tell you to replace it.

    Hopefully it isn't too badly discharged and abused and will spring back to life. You need a CCCV charger which that link appears to be.
     
    #77 2k1Toaster, Feb 14, 2012
  18. phideltgt

    phideltgt Junior Member

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    Thank you for the direction and support. Good to know I have a back-up plan. I purchased the battery refurbished from a local independent Toyota repair shop in December '11. So, I'm going to see what they will do.
     
    #78 phideltgt, Feb 15, 2012
  19. phideltgt

    phideltgt Junior Member

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    Dropped it off lastnight at the shop. I pulled it onto a tow dolly with a come along and towed it. To get it off, I put on the parking brake on the prius and drove the truck forward a few feet and the front wheels came down the drive ramps. Worked nicely. So, we'll see what they say.
     
    #79 phideltgt, Feb 16, 2012
  20. phideltgt

    phideltgt Junior Member

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    Talked to the shop… They said that they put the car on a lift and it would run due to having no load on the drive train. The combustion engine was able to come on after putting it in drive with no load on the drive train. They let it run for a few hours to allow the system to charge itself. ‘I’m told’ the main battery is up to a 70% charge now.

    However, the ICE does not come on at all when attempting to drive while on the ground. The main battery drains very quickly when driving on the ground and the car drives very rough (it bucks).

    They think that there is something internal to the transaxle that is causing too much drag and that it isn’t operating correctly. This is the 2nd one I’ve put in. I’ve asked to come in and have this demonstrated for me - probably will be Monday. I will also check the main battery charge (while there) as well as each module charge b/c I’m not sure that once a module is bad (less than 7v) it can fully come back or not cause problems in the future.
     
    #80 phideltgt, Feb 23, 2012
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