Is the ICE kicking on in EV mode?

Has anyone tried to do a minimized 0-60 time that does nto use the ICE? What do you think it would be? How about the energy used? (Trackyside maybe you can measure just HV battery level before and after?)

 

Nope - the same. it's just that my first order analysis predicts, what with a 7500 Leaf credit and a couple of kids I won't have 2500 tax liability left!

I ran the numbers through my 2011 turbo tax as a "what if"... If my wife wants the car I'll run the numbers more carefully.

 

The question is how much electricity is needed to substitute for gas? Substitution does not equal saving. Prius PHV electricity consumption is 29 kWh/100mi but Volt's is 36 kWh/100mi. How much more gas will the Volt burn for long trips at 37 MPG vs 50 MPG?

In term of fuel efficiency (either fuel), Prius PHV is the winner despite being a midsize. Total system efficiency and low emission are the goals of Prius PHV. I understand that Volt's goal is to use as little gas as possible regardless of electricity or gas efficiency.

 

Prius PHV can switch between HV and EV mode so you can divide your commute for either gas or electric. With the Leaf available to you as well, your user selectable choices are plenty.

 

Here we go again adding the free electric miles. The real gas MPG on gas mile is 35 MPG on voltstats.net.

Electricity is not free nor gasoline. We need to minimize the usage of both. Prius PHV balances and optimizes both fuel but Volt does not. Volt is bias toward EV and compromise gas efficiency and interior volume. Great, if it fits your commute. Sux, if you want a balanced vehicle that takes accounts of many variable and designed to maximize both fuel efficiency.

Gas engine kicking in extends the EV range. It does not matter because two power sources are united and works as one synergy drive. Volt doesn't have synergy drive.

 

Is there a way to run the front defroster without engaging the ICE? I have the temp turned down all the way, but the ICE still turns on any time I run defrost.

 

As you have said, "Electricity is not free nor gasoline."

I think you meant 29 kWh/100mi (not 19) but, in any case, you need to remember the mile worth of gasoline (0.022 gallons that substituted for electricity) in the blended EPA test result.

If that estimate were somehow all-electric then the PiP's efficiency would have been closer to 32kWh/100mi.

 

The stats on voltstats.net are not annualized in a balanced way. The numbers are heavily weighted towards new Volts that began tracking their mileage in the Fall and Winter when mileage is reduced for all cars and especially plugins if the engine is run primarily for added heat generation.

In addition, the voltstats.net results are automatically reported based on OnStar data and may be skewed artificially lower under some conditions (like drivers optimizing their mpg using "mountain mode" in some situations).

We will have to wait for another year or two of results before we can compare to similar numbers reported on sites such as fuely.

 

USB, I have a feeling you would prefer it if Toyota turned on the ice more easily, so that it could get 19kwh/100 miles on the test and you could continue to claim this false efficiency gain. The higher efficiency is just the matter of including gasoline energy, your comparing different tests still doesn't make much sense. Toyota's improvement so that the phv stays in electric mode more, seems to be liked by the phv customers.

Isn't that the point to use less gas. I would say electric would be close to 33kwh/100miles. Does it really matter that it is here versus 29kwh/100miles. The prius phv substitutes about 10 epa electric miles for gasoline, and many greatly exceed that. The difference in electric consumption on a charge between these 2 figures of consumption is about 400 watts, about the amount of electricity I use to run my plasma tv for about an hour

Its great that this thread sets out the parameters to help maximize electric use. Hopefully fully armed phv drivers drive around 12 miles on 3.2kwh of electricity if they are in mild climates:rockon:

Why does this have to be prius phv versus volt? Its great that both sets of drivers are substituting electricity for gasoline. I would say the voltstats are pretty fair, but prius phv because of self reporting will over report mpg.

 

I wouldnt think so normally, but is there any heat when the defroster is on even though your temp is on Low? I've used the AC without ICE, havent needed the defroster yet.

As a side note, I noticed the EV range go down around 0.5 miles when turning on the fan.

 

I've found some peculiarities with the ICE coming on. I have driven 99.9% in EV the last two weeks, but once I turned on the AC before moving the PIP and the ICE came on! Another two times I just turned on just the fan, no heat or AC, and the ICE came on! On other occasions I was moving and turned on the AC or fan and the PIP stayed in pure EV.
I left the dealership with a full tank of gas and still have a full tank of gas. Oh well I can use it in the lawn mower this summer.

 

Absolutely fantastic!

 

No it is not true, it is a fanboi presenting incorrect/misleading data. Not even with the typo fix is it correct.

It should be (29kWh+ .2 gallons of gas)/100miles, which is 95MPGe. The volt is 94MPGe so total energy used is nearly the same, except the volt can achieve 94MPGe for 35 miles, the Pip for 11.

One cannot just take the electric part of the 100mile and compare it to a Volt, just as one cannot take the .2 gallons over 100 miles, conclude that the Prius PHV does 500 MPG and hence is better than any other ICE. If you blend fuels, you must consider the total energy in combination, not just one or the other.

The Prius PHV uses gas in those 11 miles exactly because the ICE kick in even in EV mode.. the whole point of this thread.

 

Yup, sorry for the typo. It should be 29 kWh/100mi.

Prius PHV blend in 50 MPG gas engine for high power / high speed conditions. Despite that, electricity consumption remains at 29 kWh/100mi.

The point was not about efficiency (MPGe). We are talking about consumption and how EV range is extended with the ICE helping hand.

In term of efficiency, we'll have to look at well-to-wheel analysis, not just vehicle efficiency (EPA label). We have done it and Prius PHV is the more efficient vehicle.

 

That figure is if you'll drive the Volt without recharging at 37 MPG. That's not realistic and nobody is going to do that.

EPA has Beyond Tailpipe Emission calculator that combines 35 EV miles and the rest of the miles with gasoline usage. They used the statistics figure from SAE J2841 which is 64% EV and 36% gas. The same ratio was supposedly used to get 60 MPGe composite figure from 94 MPGe (EV) and 37 MPG (HV).

From that, Volt's tailpipe and upstream emission for electricity and gasoline composite figure is 260 gram/mile for the national average.

 

That's a gas-only hybrid mode comparison that ignores the plugin battery. It just reflects EPA combined mpg estimates of 50 vs. 37. It does not include the "utility factor" of EV vs. hybrid mode.