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3rd Hybrid Battery?

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by mwcb89, Apr 14, 2012.

  1. mwcb89

    mwcb89 New Member

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    Hi there, I'm new to this site...(hope I posted this in the right place)

    My sister just purchased a 2006 prius partly because I loved my 2005 prius so much and partly because they are generally just great cars.

    Unfortunately we have been having some problems.

    History:
    According to the CarFax, this car got it's battery replaced in 2007 (when the car only had 200 miles on it). This car was mainly used up north New Jersey and New York. Then it was shipped here to Florida and my sister bought it with about 123,000 miles on it.

    The problem:
    A few days ago, my sister starts the car and gets three warning lights. The master light, the brake light, and the check engine light. We try and take it to Toyota, but on the way there it just refused to go over 15mph(It moved, but it was like driving through mud). We had to get it towed.

    Toyota claims that the entire Hybrid battery is dead and needs to be replaced for $3,300. Yikes...We knew there were other options (like buying a used battery) that wouldn't be that expensive. So we had the car towed to a mechanic recommended to us. [Question: Can you replace cells in prius batteries? Our mechanic says you can only do that in hondas?]

    We purchased a battery from Gagel Auto Parts (Super nice people, and a 6 month guarantee for parts). Our mechanic claimed the battery was completely useless.(?) The people at Gagel were immediately apologetic (and confused because they had tested the battery before they sent it) and refunded us and shipped the battery back to them (still waiting to here what they say).

    So the question:
    How can a prius have gone through 3 hybrid batteries before 125k miles? Doesn't it make sense that something else must be going wrong with the car? Our mechanic says everything is perfectly fine, but I'm skeptical. I'm pretty sure this mechanic and Toyota just run the codes and don't actually ever inspect the car thoroughly.

    Obviously the battery is going to have to be replaced now, but how long will it last if something else is actually wrong? Has anyone had this sort of problem? Does anyone know a mechanic (In, around, or near Tampa?) who actually knows or specializes in hybrids?

    Thanks! :D
     
  2. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    I'll bite.

    It's very unusual for a Prius to need ONE replacement HV battery. So the car you refer to had a new one at 200 miles. Very unusual but maybe just a faulty one that got through the quality control net.

    Can a HV battery fail at 125k miles? An odd one or two in the same way the odd one or two car engines fail prematurely at that mileage.

    Excessive heat over long periods of time can kill the HV battery. I understand Florida is hot. Equally it could be something like the cooling fan getting blocked up - does your sister carry dogs in the car? Does she often leave things on the back seat such as a coat, that could block the cooling vent?

    I trust you've checked the simple things like whether the 12v battery is good? If they fail (usually about 5 years old or so) they throw all sorts of weird faults as they don't provide enough power to correctly run the internal computers. It would be the first thing to check/replace and is cheaper than the full HV battery replacement if it is the 12v.

    It might be helpful to give details of your sisters car - how long has she owned it, what sort of servicing its had etc etc.
     
  3. mwcb89

    mwcb89 New Member

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    I agree, one could of just gotten through quality control.

    The car has only been in Florida for a few months maximum and my sister just bought it 2/3 weeks ago. She doesn't own any dogs, and hasn't even had the chance to put anything in the car because its so new. :p
    We actually didn't check the 12v battery...I might give the mechanic a call about that, but I'm assuming he would have checked that? (maybe not..)

    So details...she has owned it for less than 3 weeks. She got an full syn oil change at Toyota a few days after she purchased it (where they said everything in the car was fine she just needed new tires). A week and a half later, it was dead, and Toyota told us we needed a new battery.
     
  4. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    It is possible that your mechanic was unfamiliar with how the interlock (orange plug) works. If not installed, or if the fuse inside is blown, the battery will read 0V at the terminals. Usually people that sell used batteries are not in the habit of sending out bad ones.

    Nearest good hybrid shop to Tampa is Mellor's in Melbourne: mellor's automotive
     
  5. uart

    uart Senior Member

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    Re the battery replaced in 2007 at just 200 miles. Are you sure this wasn't the 12V battery? It seems extremely unusual to see one replaced that young, perhaps they mistakenly entered it as the hybrid battery.

    Also 200 miles for a 2006 model in 2007 seems unusual (unless it was a 2006 model purchased in 2007). In either case it suggests that this Prius was left sitting unused for some time in 2006/2007, which might well cause the 12V battery to drain and need replacing.
     
  6. mwcb89

    mwcb89 New Member

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    Ok, I'll ask him about that orange plug as well. I've heard of Mellor's and I might give them a call to ask what they think (they are a bit far from here though)
     
  7. Britprius

    Britprius Senior Member

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    I would say that since the car has done 123,000 miles on the battery it is most unlikely that a problem with the car is causing HV batteries to fail, but at that mileage it would not be so unlikely that the battery just died. The replacement battery is just a red herring until the sellers get back to you about it's condition. If it is ok then you have some other problem but my guess is the HV safety link was not installed properly by your mechanic.
     
  8. mwcb89

    mwcb89 New Member

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    The carfax didn't specify what battery, so maybe you are right, it could just be the 12v.
     
  9. mwcb89

    mwcb89 New Member

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    Ok, well that would be good if it was just that battery's time to go and wasn't something worse. I will post what the battery seller says once I get it. What is the HV safety link and what does it do?
     
  10. uart

    uart Senior Member

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    Ok, well in that case it's a huge assumption to say that it was the hybrid battery.

    At this stage I'd say ignore what happened in 2007 and treat this as a single hybrid battery failure. Also, it's quite possible (even likely) that the car was actually sold because the previous owner detected early signs of the hybrid battery failure.
     
  11. css28

    css28 Senior Member

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    See this: Hybrid Vehicle Safety Hazards
     
  12. mwcb89

    mwcb89 New Member

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    Ok, yeah I agree. So maybe they just replaced the 12v and maybe it was just this current battery's time, and maybe this new battery was just faulty and a new one would fix it. Hope so!

    Still wish I knew more about the problem, or at least wish I had a mechanic who really understood what was going on. I dislike the vague answers and brush offs, but I'll keep at it until I know what is going on for sure...
     
  13. GrumpyCabbie

    GrumpyCabbie Senior Member

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    This isn't as simple as a case of the rear hatch not closing correctly leaving the interior light on running the 12v flat and destroying it, could it?

    Haven't there been reports of the gen2 having this issue in the past?
     
  14. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    One thing that slipped through: why would an '06 car only have 200 miles on it in '07? That lack of use would for sure cause a 12V battery failure.
     
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  15. uart

    uart Senior Member

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    ...

     
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  16. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    okay, multiple things slipped through the cracks in my brain yesterday
     
  17. JimN

    JimN Let the games begin!

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    Register the VIN at Toyota Owners Official Website: Service Coupons, Owners Manuals, Service Scheduling and More to get the vehicle's dealer service history. Before buying a used car it is a good idea to check up on it through the manufacturer's website.

    As I remember the MY in 2006 started in the Fall & there weren't any leftover 2006's on the lots in January 2007. The 200 miles & the timeframe are suspect.

    if this car is from NJ the hybrid warranty is 10 years/150000 miles.

    A bad 12v battery will cause the car to not start, or at least not start easily. A failed 12v will not cause the car to ride at 15mph.

    I suspect a deeper issue, perhaps title washing. North Jersey has had some serious flooding within the last few years. This car may have been a flood victim. If so, this isn't a warranty or wear problem, it's an abuse problem.
     
  18. jdenenberg

    jdenenberg EE Professor

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    Since the car has been shipped to and registered in another state (Florida), I believe that the HV battery warranty reverts to the 100Mile/8Year non-carb rules.

    JeffD
     
  19. mwcb89

    mwcb89 New Member

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    Update and Solution!

    You guys are the best! :D Turns out the 12v was bad. Replacing it fixed the issue (with the previously thought to be bad hybrid battery replacement)

    I'm a little disappointed that the mechanic didn't think to check that battery, and he way overcharged us on it. He charged us $300 dollars for the 12v! :eek:

    This was absolutely ridiculous, but he installed it without telling me and said that taking it out and putting a new one in would cost me more. :mad:

    So do you think that this issue most likely originated with the 12v and since that one works with all the computers (or so i'm told) then that probably effected the hybrid? Not completely sure how all this works in the end...

    Is there a way to check the 12v on occasion so something like this doesn't happen again?

    Thanks!
     
  20. uart

    uart Senior Member

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    So just to make it clear, you now have a new 12V battery and the new hybrid battery (the rebuilt one that your mechanic initially thought was faulty - but turned out to just be his incompetence). Is that a correct summary mwcb89?