OK TOYOTA, Now give us our diesel hybrid.

STILL having unit confusion. An Energy/Time storage device?

The batteries don't seem capable of such a big jump either, which is WHY people are doubting them so much.

 

Re: the Volvo
Put enough battery capacity to run the car about 75% of the test route on battery, and the MPG will calculate out to around 120. <<shrug>>

 

The person that asked it ALREADY knew it. It was a rhetorical question, in order to point out to you, your unit confusion.

 

Same thing is true about battery power and running in hybrid mode which is why the larger battery capacity of Volvo's battery for EV likely also boosts the hybrid mode mileage and explains the Volvo Diesel V60's 117 mpg rating when running in hybrid mode. Diesel engine would give about a 25% boost in mileage.

 

Why do you guys not just compare to the diesel hybrid which is actually out? The Peugeot 3008 diesel hybrid.

 

Wayne Gerdes - CleanMPG - Sept. 6, 2010

2011 Peugeot 3008 HYbrid4 – 4WD Crossover with a 62 mpgUS combined rating on the NEDC. Approximately 51 mpgUS combined on our own 08 EPA.

 

They seem scared to death of the Diesels in general. As though putting a Diesel in a Prius is heresy. What is the 308 Diesel Hybrid's mpg?

 

Hardly, unless 'hybrid' mode is 'blended' mode in which the traction battery is being depleted while supplying ~ 75% of the energy.

The oft quoted 25% fuel economy improvement of diesel over a conventional car will not stack on top of hybridization, because they both solve the partial power problem. I expect a diesel hybrid to have about an 8% improvement over a petrol hybrid in fuel economy -- simply reflecting the higher energy/volume of diesel. The CO2/distance ratings will be quite similar. IMO this is why diesel-hybrids are few and far between.

 

Hybrid mode would be non plug in mode. I often deplete my battery but it has to recharge via driving so no free lunch. Volvo press release did say 117 mpg in Diesel hybrid mode. Ability to store more electrical energy would explain the higher miles per gallon.

 

Between you and Volvo, it is impossible to know what is actually being talked about.

 

As explained many times already, no it wouldn't. You need to show HOW storing more energy improves miles per gallon. Which you have so far manifestly failed to do.

 

The Volvo and Toyota info posted does seem to have cause a lot of sturn and drang.

 

Volvo provides correct but opaque information people make incorrect assumptions about.
You mix up units to your heart's content, throw out conjecture as if it was fact, and lack an elementary (high school) understanding of physics.

Why don't you read a textbook, and ask some simple questions to get up to speed ? Much more productive than throwing out BS all the time

 

To be fair, putting a diesel engine in a Prius would be heresy as the primary reason for the hybrid drivetrain and all of the tradeoffs favor emissions first and affordability (including fuel economy) second.
The 3008 is rated better than the Prius, but this is in the Euro cycle where also the CT200h receives a better rating than the Prius and many new clean diesels game the ratings by going for 3.3 or 3.2 l/100km. I hope this will lead to a similar change in the test procedure as back then when the EPA rating were changed.

A pipedream would be having all non-standard compliant countries become standard compliant and everyone used the same ratings. Until that time we will keep seeing people touting impossible Euro-cycle fuel economy in the face of people who might already drive cleaner vehicles (case in point: Prius vs. diesels)

 

And thus the tragedy of insisting on regenerating filters versus replacable ones. But how much of these fine particles are actually being emitted by a DPF equipped diesel. These car's tailpipes remain soot free after thousands of miles. Not so of gasoline cars. They are as dirty as diesels it turns out.

Gasoline cars may need particulate filters; PM Emission No Longer Just a Diesel issue

 

Chuckle. You need to explain it to Volvo. I'm thinking a standard "You Diesel kids get off my Prius lawn" might work.

 

I need to explain what to Volvo? YOUR inability to defend YOUR (not Volvo's) claim that a larger battery improves miles per gallon in hybrid mode? I seriously doubt they care about it.

You seem to want to think that this has something to do with Prius loyalty, or diesel hate. When in fact, it is an effort to get YOU to justify YOUR claims.

 

It would be great if the governments started some smart regulations instead of current more regulations. I have no idea what is the appropriate level, but we keep adding cost to new cleaner cars, while leaving the big polluters on the road. Certainly higher standards are needed in certain cities. I certainly think cleaner diesels make sense as part of the mix as they are much cleaner than some old gasoline cars that are allowed on the road. But the hybrid market seems to try to aim for the minimal unhealthy tailpipe emissions and here with their added costs diesels don't make much sense.

I'm sure the folks at volvo understand what corwyn is saying, but you don't seem to be able to get it. They chose a diesel engine that weighs more than an equally powered gasoline one. This hurts power to weight and energy to weight for the car as a whole. It does increase miles/gallon and reduces co2/mile and likely increases particulates/mile and cost per vehicle versus a gasoline Atkinson or turbo charged di gasoline engine. Mercedes, Peugot, and volvo seem to be trying this strategy, but these are europe only vehicles for now. Its a tradeoff that doesn't make much sense in america.

 

Actually Toyota already proved that with the Plug in Prius getting slightly better mileage in hybrid mode than the regular hybrid.

As for my "claim", more of a speculation since the added efficiency of the Diesel would not appear to account for the 117 mpg hybrid mode rating Volvo stated but I realize this is a faith based discussion for some of gasoline Prius faithful .

 

thats like top gear racing a prius with a beemer and saying the beemer is more fuel eff.
there are also a lot of MAYBE's in that artical and unless its from a source i can truts and not just A website to me its like the "study" done about the hummer and prius..... it not seems but WAS a hoax.