Ford C-Max Plug-in hybrid to have 20 mile range

That's why the re-revised estimate GM set for Volt was questioned so much. Remember back in January, how it was reduced to 3,750 per month? That still seemed way too optimistic.

Of course, now the story has been changed and the next few years are suppose to represent market establishment (proving the technology) rather than market penetration (becoming a mainstream vehicle).

That doesn't make good business sense for Volt, since it's a bet-the-farm approach. Both Ford & Toyota are quite different, also having no-plug models available.

 

Local Ford dealer quoted me $37K. It has a lot of stuff Toyota would charge $5K for in a package. Power, heated leather seats, auto/on/off headlights, DRLs, fog lights, high end nav, Sony stereo system. If it will do 48mpg as hybrid and 20 on EV. Be tempting to do. I'd be getting 82 mpg on my daily commute vs. current 56 mpg.

2013 Ford C-Max Energi
Ruby Red Metallic
Light Stone Leather
SEL 302A package
Panoramic Roof
MSRP $37,030
YOUR COURTESY PRICE $37,030

 

No I don't remember things that did not happen. There were various new outlets which misreported the old numbers as the 2012 estimates very early in Jan around when the battery fix was announced, but there was no official statement of 45000 (3750/month) estimate released in january, unless you mean jan 2010 or Jan 2011. The first 2012 official announcement I remember (or could find) were from 1/9/12 this year were to match supply and demand, see GM’s Akerson Says He Will Align Volt Production to Sales Demand - Bloomberg
Where did you see an official 2012 estimate of 45000?

The success of the Volt does not have to be measured just in sales. Its a chance for GM to reestablish its technology leadership, reprove its quality and a halo for GM's and other chevy vehicles. The prius did not really make money for more than a decade.. but it was also very important to the overall perception of Toyota and in some part for their growth.

Here is a comparison of volt and prius US sales after US launch.. homeruns can, and often do, start slow. (Note Volt was not on sales nationwide until month 11).

 

Its probably a good thing to not remember fiction. Back in October WSJ and Businessweek were questioning numbers. GM was a little slow pulling back forecast, but anyone paying attention should have realized by November sales were over estimated. GM just never put out a new 2012 estimate because they did not have one. GM has had problems with their dealers not knowing how or wanting to sell the volt. Nissan is reporting those problems now too, and I expect Toyota and Ford dealers will be an impediment also.

I don't think that story changed for those of us paying attention. The story has always been establishment of the technology. Anyone claiming something different is just blowing smoke up your, well....

Does GM have a farm now? Look at the financials, the volt is an investment in a halo. Only a small percentage of their spending is on that car. Nissan/Renault did make a much bigger bet on the leaf and other evs. I hope it will turn out well for them.

+1

The prius did much for toyota's image, and very little for its bottom line. You can look up the figures. GM needs the car for its image and its future.

The important part of the graph is not shown. That is the big increases in the second generation.

 

Is this 35k pre-tax break or post?

Going to assume post because that is mega cheap otherwise.

 

For me, Gm's problem with the Volt is packaging: it's just too darned small inside, especially considering it's footprint outside. It needs to be more spacious before I'd even consider it. Ford, finally, seems to have learned that lesson with the upcoming C-Max.

 

good summary of prices, capabilities, credits. You can go to the ford cite and see what the energi costs, outfitted to your desires. Forbes did put 15 miles on ev-range of the phv and it should be 11. We still need official tests to see if the c-max energy stays at 20 miles.
Terminal Velocity: Ford C-Max Energi To Vie With Volt, Prius - Forbes

I don't think there is a problem with the volt. It is nice to have multiple vehicles and something will fit more consumers. One size will not fit all. I never heard, that porsche is just too small, unless someone was trying to sell an SUV.

 

The saleperson wanting to help me suddenly got frustrated when I pointed out the size was too small for my needs (routinely carrying a 3-wheel recumbent with lots of gears inside and 2 bikes on the outside), then just walked away. Apparently, I was far from the first person who had made that comment... and could be why Ford is placing emphasis size of their offering.

 

I'm sure the salesman knew he wasn't going to sell you anything from your attitude. You should not gauge a problem, by how car dealers act when your being a smart-a$$. Go test drive a 911 and make the same comment and see what the dealer does.

 

The price for the Energi is currently $32.9k on Ford's site. Couldn't find any fine print about the tax rebate. The Prius PHV is $32k starting with standard navigation. The non plug in's price difference is a little over a thousand dollars. Ford may eat more of the pack cost to keep the list price competitive.

 

When you include delivery fees, which are always included
prius phv = 32,760 - 2500 credit= $30,260
c-max energi = 33,745 - 3750 credit = $29,995
volt = 39,995 - 7500 credit = $32, 495

Go to toyota's and ford's websites to price them with the options you want. I don't think ford will lose money compared to the c-max hybrid. The tax credit covers the extra cost of batteries. There is a cost just to make it a plug-in that toyota, gm, and ford must pay, no matter the range.

 

Sure am glad I documented what was actually said back in the past. There's a lot of spin taking place now.

 

I am glad you know you are spinning. Most of the time you seem quite unaware of your distortions.

You went to the chevy dealer to insult the car. Then the dealer walked away. Isn't that your story? How many years have you disliked the car before you went to the dealer and decided you still didn't like it? You have documented your hate of the volt quite well. I am sure you documented your hate for far longer than I have read your posts.

 

goodbye

 

Energi loaded = $37,500
PIP loaded = $40,000

Energi includes a good bit more, sunroof, power seats, power lift gate not available on the Prius. Plus offering 25% more EV range and power.

 

Anyone noticed that the plugin version has 1/2 gallon larger tank?

I really like the 13.5/14 gallon tank. Very good road trip car.

 

Last year, the discussion was that Energi will have 35-40 mile EV.

C-Max Energi: How much EV range will Energi have ? Ford gives us a clue ...

 

That post had a simple math error, it assumed no charging losses. Put those in and we get about 7kwh from the plug @95mpge gives 20 miles. 10 kwh as that author suggested would have been 28 miles. Still an over estimate but still close to what ford is putting into their smaller battery.

 

I know they dont want to, but once you see C-max, you will realize what I am saying... it is liftback competitor, not Prius v, as it is significantly smaller than v... and most of the 10% extra space C-max has in the trunk compared to liftback, is due to high roof, as is most of 5-6% interior space.

It is like Ford comparing new Fusion to Avalon and saying how it gets better mileage and is cheaper than Avalon... and then people buy Camry.

 

C-MAX Energi spec says it has 7.5 kWh battery pack. Prius PHV has 4.4 kWh.

That 20 miles electric range is likely a blended range just like 11 miles for Prius PHV.