Gas in californina

Btw, something I just noticed: diesel prices haven't budged, despite also being a California-specific formulation. Seems like a telltale sign of intentional price manipulation.

 

The spike is moving through here too, just not at the same strength as in CA. Check gasbuddy's historic gas price charts and select each of these states. And British Columbia too, which is getting hit harder than OR and WA, though still not as bad as CA.

 

Is it seasonal ?

I gather part of the bad timing for the petrol refineries is that some have transitioned to winter formulation they are not yet allowed to sale.

 

Yes, dual fuel with decent range is great when the unexpected happens. Gas price spikes: limit your use to EV/charge more often. Electricity outage: dip into the gas tank.

 

There is more diesel in the crude, which makes it easier to make. Gasoline on the other hand requires more cracking and reformation to get amount we burn out of the crude. Maintenance problems at a refinery can possibly only involve the equipment to make the gasoline.

I think diesel also keeps longer, and maybe they were making more to ship to colder climes for the winter.

I know that a reason for switching to winter blends is because summer blends can have starting problems in cold weather. Is there any possible down side to using winter gas in warm weather? Besides the lower fuel economy.

 

Let's put the "New refineries will solve our problems" old wife's tale to bed. I keep saying old wife's tale, but it keeps raising its ugly head.
CA doesn't need more refineries. But for fun ... I'll bite ... let's pretend that tomorrow we wake up and there are an extra FIFTY refineries in CA. We built them over night with fake paper money generated by the feds ... we'll pretend the Fed's printed an extra trillion (actually they don't even print any more ... they just add more zeros to bank ledgers.) dollars, bought off all the interested parties, and we're good to go ... all over night.
Heck, let's pretend the economy is as booming as it was in 2007 while we're at it. Here comes the rub. Crude oil production peaked around 2007. So what are we going to refine with all those swell brand new refineries. What paltry inventory we have now days, turns on our sputtering economy. If the economy tries to increase, oil production is strained ... prices go up ... and the economy gets choked to death. Here's a typical graph of world wide production as of just a couple years ago (from wikipedia):

You can find other production charts - some more current - some not going back as far - but they all tell the same story. Welcome to tomorrow land.
And THAT's why the oilies don't build any more refineries. As crude goes up in price, it's very much worth it - to the oilies IF they can raise production. Wouldn't YOU be churning out tons of fuel at the refinery if you could? Wouldn't YOU find a way to build refineries, if you had the product to refine? It aint rocket science and it aint a conspiracy. Use enough 'stuff' and eventually you'll find you're running low on 'stuff'.
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The President IS culpable for putting so much of federal land off limits, as well as much offshore, too for new drilling. While he carps that our oil production is the highest in 8 years, most of that increase is on private land. Time to open up these federal lands for responsible drilling and oil shale mining and get the Keystone Pipeline underway. We'll not be energy independent anytime soon if he doesn't take these steps; solar and wind won't get the job done soon enough. Don't blame Fox News for something that should be obvious to just about anyone not steeped in the radical Left.

 

Responsible oil shale mining …there's an oxymoron if I ever saw one lol

 

Interesting watching this from a Country where we're paying 40% more than the California highs. People still drive 5 litre V8 SUV's here, people still waste fuel and drive cars bigger than they need too. Ten years ago petrol cost the same as it is now costing in CA and people moaned about the cost then. Now it's 40% higher and still we moan and still we drive. Ten years ago we had riots and blockades because our petrol costs reached the level in CA now and yet it still went up. Fuel protests in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Maybe the oil companies have watched Europe and realised that they can massively increase costs and get away with it. It always goes up but never goes back down to where it was.

Keep hold of your Prius - you'll need it.

 

Thanks everyone for the alternative fuel details. Regardless of the alternative fuel, CNG, electricity, or ethanol, the lessons learned are clear . . . it is good to have alternatives. Monopolies and mono-cultures are generally at risk of price increases.

Bob Wilson

 

A Prius uses 1/3rd the fuel of a SUV. Stuff that in your Fox News energy independence calculator.

I think my home is getting NG for hot water next week, and then my (coal sourced) electric consumption including cooking will be at most 100 kwh a month. Solar and wind already have me covered.

Only the idiotic right still thinks that conspicuous energy consumption is best solved by more oil spills, pollution, and climate change. Now, you will have to excuse me; I am installing some (more) passive solar today in my home. Lifetime cost for the heating energy I will use: 1 penny/kwh.

 

Yep - not many alcohol fuel stations here ... and it's a nice thing and a good thing. The less grain fuel we in california use, the more grain that's left for starving people, hopefully at a more affordable price. Win win. Maybe I can create a bumper sticker:
"Pop Corn ... not Octane "

SGH-I717R ? 2

 

I want you to try to think of your arguement in this light....

Drilling for more oil = Raising Taxes
Optimizing one's fuel economy = Cutting the Budget

Before we "Raise Taxes" maybe we could try to make a hard and honest effort to "Cut the Budget".

Example: My neighbor just bought a new Ford Edge and sold her previous Ford Expedition. She was excited because this new Ford Edge can seat 4 adults (they have 2 kids just out of college) and it gets better gas mileage than the Expediton.

Fuelly shows that the following vehicles get the following MPGs

2006 Ford Expedition: 16 mpg.
2012 Ford Edge: 21 mpg.
2011 Toyota Camry: 29 mpg.
2010 Toyota Prius: 48 mpg.

If we assume she drives 12,000 miles per year, she would consume

2006 Ford Expedition: 750 gallons.
2012 Ford Edge: 570 gallons
2011 Toyota Camry: 410 gallons.
2010 Toyota Prius: 250 gallons.

She reduced her consumption by 25% (180 gallons)
She could have reduced her consumption by 67% (500 gallons)

Cutting the budget by 25% is a great start.
Cutting the budget by 67% should bring a tear to the eye of every fiscally conservative person. If we could do that, the we wouldn't need to "Raise Taxes".

Right?

 

Lest anyone think Codyroo is talking about metaphorical taxes, remember that the pump price is only a fraction of the total cost. The rest we pay in other ways, including on April 15th. Use less gas and you lower everyone's taxes.

 

It's a real shame that auto buyers "wait" for higher fuel prices to consider a fuel sipper. Folks who happen to be in the car market anyway, start looking at hybrids, when fuel costs spike. What with so many roads in disrepair, and road taxes come in large part via gas / diesel sales ... sounds like a great time to quadruple fuel taxes !! Heck ... while we're at it ... throw a buck per gallon on for no fault insurance ... the more you burn, the more you pay. Ok course that'll never happen.
Fuel spikes bring shouts of "drill baby drill!!". The thing many don't get though is, that it doesn't matter HOW many straws you stick in the margarita glass ... eventually you start to suck air. More straws simply mean you suck more air. That seems to be too complex a formula for many to grasp.
I imagine the same happened on Easter Island ... as it was being denuded of every tree ... and conservation didn't appear to be the answer back then. Even as the various birds on Easter island disappeared - the population screamed, "cut baby cut!!". We learn nothing from history. I see quite a picture down the road as our heirs search for more fuel (rather than conserve and switch to alternatives) ah la the 'Road-Warrior':

George Miller - the producer of Mad Max ... I hope his vision of tomorrow land is wrong
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Not more, but newer, or updating, can help with costs. An old poster(Jay?) mentioned that the old, pneumatic operated refineries in service here can take days for the products to reach spec. Newer, electronic controlled ones could reduce those days to hours.

 

why hasn't anyone mentioned Hitler yet?

 

You just did.

 

Wonder why no one wants to live next to refinery?

The "lack of refinery" is bogus reason for the very predictable twice yearly increases on retail oil prices, summer and winter. The claim of "refinery maintenance" and "refinery shortage" is a lie.