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Dealer Alignment Question

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by Aaron, Nov 28, 2012.

  1. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    My local dealer says they only do 2 wheel alignment not 4 wheel because the Prius has a solid rear axle. They said they don't even check the rear wheels.

    Is this okay?

    DROID RAZR ? 2
     
  2. xs650

    xs650 Senior Member

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    No it's not OK. Rear wheel alignment on Prii is frequently not very good and it can be corrected.

    Toyota's official position is that it isn't adjustable. But, it can be adjusted with aftermarket shims. There are good quality shims and bad quality shims. Read through this thread and find out which shims The Critic found to be bad.
    Rear Alignment Shim and Hub Bolt Torque | PriusChat
     
  3. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    Thanks. Mine is a 2008. Would the alignment specs be the same as his 2010?

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  4. xs650

    xs650 Senior Member

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    I think they are but verify. PM The Critic, he's helpful.
     
  5. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    I just got my new tires installed on my 2008 Prius. The alignment was checked and as I suspected there were some issues. This might as well be written in Greek as I really have no idea how to interpret these results. The Front Left Toe looks REALLY out of spec. I do know a Hunter alignment machine was used and the tech said they use Moog shims to correct the issues with the rear. Hopefully The Critic can chime in on this one. I read he used NAPA Spicer shims and wanted to know if it matters.

    I was quoted $200 to fix the rear (1 hour per side). Fair price? How critical is it that I get this fixed tomorrow or do I have time to shop around?



    [UNSET] (28).jpg [UNSET] (29).jpg
     
  6. JimN

    JimN Let the games begin!

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    How long have you been driving the car? If it's been that long another couple days isn't going to hurt.
     
  7. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    I was concerned that I might damage the new tires, not the car. Am I more likely to damage the car?
     
  8. xs650

    xs650 Senior Member

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    You aren't far enough out to need to do anything in the next few days.

    The way the Prius twist beam rear axle is designed and installed in rubber mounts, the rear axle total toe will remain the same until you change something. Yours is barely in spec, but it's in spec. The individual left and right rear toe measurements will vary depending on how the car is driven on the alignment rack. You don't really need to do anything to the rear toe, although if you cut it down to about 1/2 the spec (.24 degrees total toe), your tire life will be a bit better.

    I don't think you small amount out of spec on left camber is going to hurt anything. If it was too much camber instead of too little, then you would be getting worse tire life.

    If you decide to have some work done, an hours labor per side sounds fair as long as the recheck alignment after they are done.
     
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  9. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    Thanks. I appreciate the info.

    What is Steer Ahead and Thrust Angle? How do those look?
     
  10. xs650

    xs650 Senior Member

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    Thrust angle is the angle the rear axle is off of straight ahead, in your case 0.1 degrees to the left. That's pretty good. If you drove the car off and back on the alignment rack, a Prius or other car with the same rear axle setup could easily vary more than 0.1 degres each time you moved the car.

    Steer ahead is similar to thrust angle but for the front wheels. That is controlled by the combined left and right toe in adjustments and is a quick and easy adjustment. It is to make the car go straight when the steering wheel is straight. If the steering wheel seemed straight to you when you were driving in a straight line, then you can ignore the fact that they measured it to be a little out of spec.
     
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  11. Avi's Advanced Automotive

    Avi's Advanced Automotive Independent hybrid repair shop

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    How did the old tires look? Were the warn unevenly?
     
  12. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    DROID RAZR ? 2

    I just checked depth. They looked ok.
     
  13. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    In summary....I should get the Front Driver's Side Toe corrected along with the one shim for the Rear Driver's Side to correct the Camber. The Total Toe for the Rear is within an acceptable range so leave the Right Rear Passenger's Side Toe alone. Correct?
     
  14. xs650

    xs650 Senior Member

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    You front total toe is well within spec, so if your steering wheel looks like it is straight ahead while your car is going straight ahead, then the front is OK. If the steering wheel is clocked one way or the other while you are going straight down the road, then get the front adjusted.

    I can't get too excited about the amount the drivers rear camber is out of spec. If there aren't any handling problems and your tires are wearing evenly, then you could just declare victory and accept it as is.
     
  15. The Critic

    The Critic Resident Critic

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    If it was my car, I would probably put one shim on the RR corner to reduce the toe by 0.25 deg, and reduce the camber by 0.5. However, this is not entirely necessary, since the torsion beam uses toe-correction bushings. Because the rear torsion beam uses toe-correction bushings, the toe is constantly changing. In fact, the difference in the side-to-side readings may in part be due to the tech not centering the beam before driving it onto the alignment rack. Regardless, because of the "floating" nature of the torsion beam, the total toe is what counts and yours is well within specs.

    So if you want, do the shim for the RR, but the tires should still wear acceptably after a normal thrust-angle alignment.
     
  16. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    My alignment is now corrected. The car drives straight as an arrow, but the steering wheel is off center by about 5 degrees. Should I take it back? It's just annoying.
     
  17. xs650

    xs650 Senior Member

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    That is the reason I suggested you leave the front alignment alone unless your steering wheel was already noticeably off.

    Take it back, there is no excuse for that. Be sure they give you front toe readings after they correct the steering wheel position because it is corrected by adjusting the left and right toe adjustments. They should have road tested the car and caught that.

    What did you have done to the rear and did they give you an after alignment readout?

    Congratulations on your car driving straight as an arrow. Is there an obvious improvement? Do you have the after alignment numbers to share with us?
     
  18. The Critic

    The Critic Resident Critic

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    Be sure that a zero point calibration was done after the alignment.

    The shop should have a Hunter Codelink module that is attached to their Hunter alignment rack. Be sure that they do not skip any steps in the process, such as disconnecting the 12v battery when prompted to.

    They'll always claim that minor adjustments do not require recalibration but don't buy into that.


    iPhone ?
     
  19. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    I got the alignment before The Critic was able to reply. Had to keep my appointment. Overall, I'm satisfied. I'm coming from the Nokian WRG2 (lasted 50K) and went with the Bridgestone Ecopia EP422 (running 44/42 psi) on the advice of several members of this forum. There is a HUGE difference in road noise and comfort between the two. With the Ecopias it feels like I'm floating on a cloud and road noise is pretty much nonexistent even at 70 MPH. I really like them. When coming up to a red light or stop sign these tires just seem to roll forever compared to the Nokians. The Nokians are an awesome tire and I'm sure they are much better in snow than the Ecopias, but I couldn't justify spening $720+ for them again. The winters here aren't THAT bad, plus I work for a school, so if it's bad out I get a "snow day" and don't have to drive to work.

    I called my tire dealer and scheduled an appointment to get the steering wheel adjusted. It's not really an issue, but I'm OCD about it and it's annoying to me. Here's the alignment report. Let me know your thoughts. As you can see I left the Right Rear Camber alone, so it saved me $100.

    kn PriusAlignment2.jpg
     
  20. Aaron

    Aaron Member

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    I will Monday, but how do I ask for that without sounding like a know-it-all jerk?:confused: