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Know thy enemy: Copenhagen Consensus Center and friends

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by bwilson4web, Mar 12, 2013.

  1. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    When the Prius was establishing market share, 2001-10, there were active efforts to spread lies, distortions, and FUD by shadowy sources. For example, CNW Marketing and his "Dust-to-Dust" report, Martin Delgado and the Sunday Mail article on Canadian nickel and Prius batteries, and the Automotive Alliance and the "Bell the Hybrid" act. But it looks like the center for these efforts has moved to Europe as market share is beginning to impact the EU car makers. One such group is the "Copenhagen Consensus Center:"

    Source: Bjorn Lomborg: Green Cars Have a Dirty Little Secret - WSJ.com

    Shades of CNW Marketing, another attempt to use the mystery of 'life cycle' to make an unsupported claim to wipe the smug smile off of electric car owners. But the owners already have the "in your pocket" savings. This is really aimed at those considering an electric car and their skeptical friends and families. They are trying to engender peer pressure against electric car purchases. For Prius owners, it is a familiar pattern.

    I throughly recommend looking at who funds the "Copenhagen Consensus Center" as it turns out Shell and other EU based oil and car companies provide their budget and 'board of directors.' Like Big Tobacco's "Smoker's Alliance," it is a front trying to spread noise, quotable paraphrases that can be taken out of context by advocacy "journalists."

    Another interesting name is the resurgence of the "Journal of Industrial Ecology", a publication by the "Yale School of Forestry and Environmental Studies." It might as well be their school of divinity, communications, or MBA. However when I tried to find a 2012 paper on this subject by researching their papers, funnily enough, all I could find were 'carbon' studies about various aspects of popular culture. Murky science was common during the tobacco wars, even more evident during the control control wars, and now in full swing with the electric car war.

    It is very likely we will see more FUD from these sources and reports of "my <family member or peers> tell me that <nonsense traced to these sources.>" When (not IF) that happens, smile and say, "Ok but I only pay $xx each month in my <electric> vehicle. If you'll pay me the difference, I'll buy whatever car you want just pay me the difference in gas cost."

    Bob Wilson
     
  2. Corwyn

    Corwyn Energy Curmudgeon

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    For reference, gasoline produces 19.4 pounds of CO2 per gallon. So, at 30 MPG, that's 0.64 lbs per mile.​

    Electricity (US average 2007) is 1.36 pounds CO2 of per kWh. So a Leaf at 3 miles per kWh, equals 0.45 lbs per mile.

    If the difference really is 16,000 lbs, that is made up in 84,000 miles.

    For me, in Maine, electricity is 0.772 lbs / kWh, 0.26 per mile, pays off in 41k miles.
     
  3. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    One thing I've learned is 'facts and data' have no effect IF you try to answer the critic in the scenario they setup. You quickly get into 'shaving hairs' or in the case of one media character, reverting to "YOU ARE LYING!"

    Rather, a better approach is direct to the individual's pocket book or wallet. Simply smile and say, "Well I have $40 in my pocket that I would not have if I took your advice."

    Bob Wilson
     
  4. chronon

    chronon Active Member

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  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Ok, but I have over $40 in my pocket each month because of my Prius. Let's see:
    • 20,000 miles/year
    • 25MPG - USA fleet average -> ~800 gallons/year
    • 52MPG - Prius average -> ~400 gallons/year
    • 400 gallons @$3/gal -> $1,200/year saved
    • $100/month in my pocket
      • $25/week
    So I really don't care about the nonsense of others. My savings are real and year after year.

    We got our first Prius in October 2005 and it is still running quite nicely. So we bought another Prius for my wife in 2009. Far as I'm concerned, stick your "Al Gore" reference next to what passes for your brains where the 'sun don't shine.'

    Bob Wilson
     
  6. chronon

    chronon Active Member

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    and this is why getting into political discussions just makes enemies out of people who would otherwise be friends ....
     
  7. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Perhaps because you don't understand that some of us buy stuff to minimize the recurring, operational cost. Al Gore was not my salesman and I never gotten nor asked for a penny of government money. All I wanted was to stop bleeding my money at the gas pump and both of our Prius have stemmed that in spades yet delivered the performance we needed.

    Bob Wilson