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Gasoline Sales Discussion

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by bwilson4web, Apr 20, 2013.

  1. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    The lower gasoline price, increased domestic production, refineries going out of business, and push to add taxes to the Prius seemed like disconnected facts and data. Since we are about six weeks into sequestration, I thought to take a look at USA gasoline sales and was surprised to see a 50% reduction in the past six years:
    [​IMG]
    U.S. Total Gasoline Retail Sales by Refiners (Thousand Gallons per Day)

    There are hypothesis to test:
    • too many Prius and fuel efficient cars - need to gather USA fleet miles. The Prius has only been less than 3% of all sales so it doesn't sound like a Prius effect.
    • economy still in a tail-spin - driving is being replaced by not going anywhere, public transportation or other.
    Looking at diesel fuel sales, I don't see a strong, economic dip:
    [​IMG]
    Curious dip in the June 2010 time frame.

    Bob Wilson
     
  2. iClaudius

    iClaudius Active Member

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    Sadly no. You want to look at US total gasoline usage, not domestic sales.

    Here's the actual charge of US usage from Energy Information Adminstration. US is near all time highs for gasoline usage. What small dip you see is related to the Great Recession.

    U.S. Product Supplied of Finished Motor Gasoline (Thousand Barrels)

    image.jpg
     
  3. DavidA

    DavidA Prius owner since July 2009

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    Could there be a non-retail sales component that isn't recognized in that chart? Or a market segment that isn't reported? Hard to believe gasoline production is down 50% in that time. 60 million gallons per day vs. 30 million. There's something missing there. We're not that green or that poor as a nation.
     
  4. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    It had never occurred to me that sales is not equivalent to usage. Regardless, the highest resolution is 'per month' and the 'per year' chart leaves the more recent data out of the graph if I read the legend "US Motor Gasoline Consumption 1950-2010 With Projection 2011." In contrast, the monthly data shows everything up to January 2013.

    Bob Wilson
     
  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    This is why I posted the most accurate, high resolution data available. There are other hypothesis:
    • high gasoline prices - have folks switched from low MPG to high MPG driving?
    • California hybrid penetration - with 1/4th of the US economy, if the Prius has a substantial presence, it might have a disproportionate effect on gasoline savings.
    It is a puzzle but the data is consistent with some of the other effects we are seeing.

    Bob Wilson
     
  6. iClaudius

    iClaudius Active Member

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    Click on the link for up to 2012 data. US gasoline usage at near all time highs. 2012 was 3,185,312,000 barrels of gasoline. That is only 6% off US record high in 2007. Just a small dip due to the Great Recession.

    You were looking at US domestic sales not US total use.
     
  7. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Two different numbers:
    • "Produced"
    • "Retail sales"
    I wonder if the difference might be gasoline exports? Need to check the definitions.

    Here are the data plotted together:
    [​IMG]

    One possibility would be non-brand, gasoline retailers are taking the difference. We may be seeing the decline of refinery or petroleum company, retail sales as part of the decrease. But looking at the trend line, there has been a reduction in gasoline sales that is not fully understood.

    Bob Wilson
     
  8. iClaudius

    iClaudius Active Member

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    No the difference is you were quoting a source that was talking about a small portion of US gasoline market.

    US gasoline consumption is at near all time highs as the hard data and charts from the US Energy Information Administration show. Please just look at their website and data and change the title off your threat do "US gasoline US down 6% from all time 2007 high due to Great Recession".

    US gasoline consumption headed back up can be the subtitle.
     
  9. walter Lee

    walter Lee Hypermiling Padawan

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    The US total retail sales of gasoline at the pump (consumer purchases).
    The EIA supply(amount) of gasoline (consumption) also includes contract/wholesale purchases.

    Once it is made, how long of a shelf life does gasoline have?

    How much of the total supplied amount of gasoline is being burned/used and how much do we inventory/stockpiled?
     
  10. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    When I asked Google for "gasoline sales .gov", I got three links and clicked on the first:

    U.S. Sales to End Users, Total Refiner Motor Gasoline Sales Volumes​
    U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA) 1, 2013 – Beginning January 2007, oxygenated gasoline is included in conventional gasoline. In conjunction with this change, total sales for resale has ...​

    U.S. Total Gasoline All Sales/Deliveries by Prime Supplier ... - EIA​
    http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=pet&s...f=mReferring Pages: Prime Supplier Sales Volumes of Motor Gasoline · Prime Supplier Sales of Motor Gasoline · U.S. Prices, Sales Volumes & Stocks.​

    U.S. Total Gasoline Retail Sales by Refiners (Thousand Gallons per ...​
    http://www.eia.gov/dnav/pet/hist/LeafHandler.ashx?n=pet&s...f=mMotor Gasoline Sales to End Users, Total Refiner Sales Volumes · U.S. Motor Gasoline Refiner Sales Volumes · U.S. Sales to End Users, Total Refiner Motor ...​

    The first one had a default, yearly summary but I could tell it was not reflecting the most current data. Once I changed the scale to monthly, the 50% reduction was apparent. The second link is the larger number and I hadn't looked at it until iClaudius cited the annual sales. Both came from the same source so there was a conundrum.
    The first chart got our total USA gasoline consumption wrong because it is limited to refinery retail sales . . . probably brand-name gasoline. But I suspect those who want to justify a "Prius tax" are more than willing to use this to justify a Prius tax. But the 6% decline also reflects a hard change in gasoline consumption which we still don't have a good model to explain.

    In absolute numbers, the production decline is half that of the refinery retail sales. This suggests 'generic' gas picked up more customers. For example, Costco/Sams retail sales may be going up while Exxon/Shell are going down. Given the typical 5% higher pump prices I tend to see at the different stations, this makes sense.

    This link from the U.S. Energy Information Agency has a pointer to the stockpile inventory:
    Weekly Petroleum Status Report - Energy Information Administration

    The inventory looks to be fairly flat, just over 200 million barrels (200,000 'thousand barrels'.) The winter blend often has butane dissolved in it to improve cold-start performance. So I suspect it has a little shorter storage life.

    Bob Wilson
     
  11. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    Bob- Frustrated by the inaccurate data posted by several un-named Prius Chat members, I have been trying to post this data below. It shows gasoline down from 9.7 to 8.7 millions barrels (2007 to now). Since there has been some increase in ethanol use during this same period, the actual refinery dino gasoline output would be even greater reduction >1 million barrels/day.

    Believe your data is missing the gasoline sold by the ethanol blenders, and other factors. Diesel is growing somewhat since, for example, farmers/railroads need more diesel to make ethanol and get it to the market.

     
  12. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    Perhaps more fuel efficient cars across all types, lowered consumption due to recession.
     
  13. iClaudius

    iClaudius Active Member

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    Whatever as long as you know US gasoline usage is near all time high of 2007 numbers. It only declined due to Great Recession. It is starting to back up and will likely hit new record for US gasoline usage in 2013 or 2014.

    http://www.eia.gov/global/scripts/jquery/highcharts/exporting-server/index.cfm
     
  14. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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    Here is the official U.S. gasoline data, updated t0 2012:

    U.S. Product Supplied of Finished Motor Gasoline (Thousand Barrels)

    There is a 6% decline since the high of 2007. I would argue that due to increased use of ethanol, that dino gasoline demand is probably >6% decline over this same period.
    US Finished Gasoline Demand.JPG
    iClaudius- you feel that the future 2013 and 2014 gasoline demand numbers, when available in 2014 and 2015, will show a dramatic upward swing in U.S. gasoline consumption. You are entitled to your opinion of future demand, but I see no DOE/EIA support of your prediction. I know you keep citing the Earth Policy Institute plot from Google, but that is out-dated and not official DOE projection, as far as I can see.
     
  15. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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  16. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Serendipity, Google found the very report, published April 20, today:
    DOT: Monthly Miles Driven

    [​IMG]

    Also,
    [​IMG]

    There appears to be a recent correlation between decreasing miles driven and the last three peaks and two bottoms of fuel prices. This corresponds to my recent, anecdotal observations.

    The biggest gain from this paper are the references to source data.

    I am sorry about the thread title, I took the first entry from a Google search not realizing it was specific to the refineries and not the general gasoline market.

    Bob Wilson
     
  17. iClaudius

    iClaudius Active Member

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    The 6% decline from 2007 is most likely due to the Great Recession and keep in the mind 2007 was the all time peak for US gasoline usage and that the direction of the gasoline usage graph is steadily upward over the last 50 years.

    The links provided were to US Dept of Energy, Energy Information Administration and were current to 2012.

    This thread was posted in error.
     
  18. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Not the first time and it led to a better understanding of the facts and data. I'm still interested in the data and now it appears we can get monthly data.

    I'm looking forward to seeing if my anecdotal observations of lower than expected gas prices, less traffic, and less restaurant/bar activity have empirical data behind them. Sad to say, the three month delay in the monthly data means we may not see credible data about the effects of sequestration until July or August.

    Still, if you have a specific set of edits, feel free to propose them. I've learned something and gained insights which is one of the reasons I hang out here. But if you want the thread to go away, to censor our discussion, feel free to use the "report" option. No doubt some members would approve . . . any guesses who?

    Bob Wilson
     
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  19. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    This is exactly what discussion of data is all about. Finding and correcting errors.
    It is not about being absolutely, 100% correct, but getting to the bottom of things, and refining models to generate more accurate results:)
     
    bwilson4web likes this.
  20. iClaudius

    iClaudius Active Member

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    Well the thread title is way out there dog-bites-man "50% reduction in US gasoline use". Not much to learn from that other than if it doesn't make sense from the get go, look before you post.