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Seating issue--Arthritis in knee makes driving painful

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Main Forum' started by kgall, Apr 21, 2013.

  1. kgall

    kgall Active Member

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    Anyone out there with arthritis in your driving knee (right in US, Canada, Europe; left in Japan, Britain . . .)?

    60 years of walking like a duck (toes pointed out) has finally caught up with me--resulting in a quick and vicious onset of arthritis on the outside of my right knee, which has made it very painful to drive, at times; as well as frequently difficult to get the right leg in and out of the car.

    I'm seeing an orthopedist, so I hope some relief will be available. But until then--anyone have any tips to help the situation--seating position, seat modifications, etc., etc., really any ideas?

    I'm one of those who generally thought the Prius driver's seat is pretty good, so I'm not randomly comp;laining about that--except that right now, the same thing that felt good hurts a lot.

    Thanks.
     
  2. jdcollins5

    jdcollins5 Senior Member

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    I have started having some minor issues with the outside of my right knee while on longer trips so understand your pain to some degree. I have to get out of the car every couple of hours if nothing more than to go to the bathroom, get a cup of coffee or get gas.

    Just a trip to the bathroom and back seems to get the blood circulating again and I am good for another couple of hours.

    While driving I have found that if I can get my foot between the gas and brake pedals to stretch out the leg a little and move the ankle back and forth gives me some temporary comfort.

    Good luck.
     
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  3. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    I would suggest looking into other vehicles and maybe long-term renting. I'd hate for this to get worse. Maybe something that allows you to sit higher like a CMAX?
     
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  4. Roland1555

    Roland1555 Senior Member

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    I feel your pain. I've been dealing with arthritis in both knees since before I bought the 2010. I just had the right knee replaced a week ago on the 15th of April and will have the left one done in 3-4 months.
    What I found, was that keeping the seat cushion as low as possible with the front edge under the steering wheel slightly raised helped with support. I also used the dynamic cruise control a lot of the time so that whenever possible I could move the leg to various positions to alleviate pain as much as possible.
    I had actually had a new 2009 lined up and ready for me at the dealership because of the knee, where I worried the flying bridge might put too much stress on the joint. A couple of base 2010's had made it into the showroom and I gave them a comfort test and had the 2010 advanced tech package ordered and waited.
    Also, take anti inflamatories ahead of time, don't get behind the 8 ball. Aleve and ibubrophine are good. Extended release Tylenol will help with pain.
    I wore unloader braces on both legs for years. Makes things a little more snug, but the idea is that they open up a little gap where you are running bone on bone. Mine were $1200.00 each, but my extended healthcare picked up most of the tab. Keep your knees warm, avoid hard jolts like jogging or tennis, you have to keep it smooth. It doesn't go away, but if you can keep the weight down and keep moving it will help. I'm 6'3" and 380 and can tell you the Prius is a good car to have, personally I wouldn't go to the cmax ever, but everyone is different.
    Good luck and take care.

    Roland
     
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  5. kgall

    kgall Active Member

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    We still have our old Subaru Forester, so I will probably try that, and see if a higher position helps.
     
  6. kgall

    kgall Active Member

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    Thanks. I will try some of these--though my cruise control isn't dynamic.
    I will probably try F8L's idea of a higher driving position and yours of a lower one and see if either of them work for me.
    By the way--what's an "unloader brace" and how does it work? The idea sounds good (even though the Dr. said I wasn't yet bone-on-bone).

    Good luck with recovering from the knee replacement. Based on my wife's experience with hers, just make sure you do all the physical therapy recommended.
     
  7. Jon Hagen

    Jon Hagen Active Member

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    I have a bit of the same problem and when I can use cruise control, I shifthat leg to get the knee away from the panel. Might a cheap garden store knee pad, shifted a bit to the right to get between the side of your knee and the panel help ??
     
  8. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    Let us know if the higher or lower seating position works better for you. Hopefully the info will help others including myself. :)
     
  9. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    Hmmm, could you do a heated wrap for your knee? Maybe a small electric towel-sized wrap that can be plugged into the cigarette lighter or inverter? Sorta of like out seat warmers but for your knee.
     
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  10. kgall

    kgall Active Member

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    Well, today I drove our old Subaru Forester (compact SUV, higher seating position, for those of you who don't know this car). Getting in and out was easier than the Prius, but after about 15 minutes of driving, my right leg started to hurt, behind the inside portion of the knee, through the calf muscle, and down to the foot, pretty much like the pain when driving the Prius.
    Oh well.

    Anyone who doesn't already know this take note: Arthritis is weird, and what didn't work for me might work for you, and vice versa. To paraphrase a favorite statement on this forum, Your Pain May Vary.
     
  11. kgall

    kgall Active Member

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    HMMMMMMMM+1.
    I have an A/C plug in heating pad for my knee at home, but never saw a 12V DC model. I will look.
    However, as you will see in my post above, when driving the pain is not restricted to the knee.
     
  12. Roland1555

    Roland1555 Senior Member

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    Thanks for your support and advice.

    The unloader brace is something used to hopefully extend the time that you have with thinning cartilage as arhritus tends to cause deterioration of the joint over time. In most cases, as we are bipedal, more wear occurs on the inside of the joint, leading to more pain as we have less and less of this cushion between the bones to help. The brace takes hold of your leg above and below the knee, and places a little force to spread apart, or crack open the joint where the narrowing has been identified as leading to increased pain and reduced mobility.

    Next time I'm on, I'll put up a link, the manufacturers describe their products the best and it is always nice to be aware of options when talking to your health care providers.

    Is your wife doing alright now? Good news helps and is still very important to me as I'm still very early in this process with just over a week to go before getting staples removed and getting assigned to physical therapy treatments.

    Roland
     
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  13. njmurvin

    njmurvin Member

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    Hey Roland. I had my right knee replaced last Oct. and was playing golf in Jan. Do the PT to get your strength and flexibility back. You're gonna LOVE your new knee.
     
  14. KK6PD

    KK6PD _ . _ . / _ _ . _

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    As a chronic back pain sufferer, any movement is going to cause pain, any seat is not going to help, much! Your in motion, jostle bounce, bump, OWWW! I just take my ( insert painkiller of choice here) an hour before I have to drive, it works. It's a lousy option, but if you need to drive, hopefully you will the perfect seat, but until then, better living through Chemistry!
     
  15. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    I don't know how much it would help but if you think it is worth it then you can always install an inverter that will convert the current so you can use your A/C heater. It would be pretty cheap to do.
     
  16. kgall

    kgall Active Member

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    Thanks.
    My knee seems to be wearing out on the outside, mostly, because of the odd structure of my hips. But if they make these unloader braces to order, maybe it would help. I would like a link to the mfgs etc.

    My wife just got one knee done. It is much stronger now than it was before, so she is happy. One reason that I emphasize doing ALL the physical therapy is that she sometimes skipped a bit, and so I think she recovered more slowly than she might have.

    The fact that she got only one knee done also means that she says she feels a bit "off balance." She feels that her two knees are different, which they are. When she walks upstairs now, she pretty much uses the reconstructed knee exclusively for the weight bearing part of the climb. You may want to consider that in deciding when and whether to do the second knee.

    I also think that health ins. cos. do not budget for enough physical therapy. We had to push for more. Of course, after a while, you get the idea, and many physical therapy providers have lower cost continuation programs, where you do the work without supervision. I'd suggest doing that.
     
  17. kgall

    kgall Active Member

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    Yesterday I tried lifting the steering wheel as high as possible to get my knees under it, and the pain was lessened.

    However, the amount and type of pain varies so much from day to day that I can't say whether this was cause and effect, or just a good day, until I see a pattern.

    Thursday I'm starting a series of injections of artificial coxcomb (if I have that right), a substance that is supposed to provide lubrication to the knee. We will see how well it works.

    I hope you are recovering well from your surgery, Roland,
     
  18. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    I'd recommend checking out Prolozone therapy. The injection of ozone into painful areas causes improved healing.

    I had it done on a heel that would hurt for a week, starting the day after I did a run. I mentioned the therapy to a friend recently, and he asked which heel it was. I had to really think about it, as it's no longer obvious even where the problem was.

    The particularly relevant case is a woman who had two bad knees. She had one replaced, and the other got prolozone therapy. She said that the prolozone one is completely normal now, while the replaced one is still a problem. She wishes she had known about prolozone before she had the knee replacement. Mind you the prolozone cost several hundred dollars while the knee replacement was several tens of thousands.

    There is a good article by the developer of Prolozone at http://www.journalofprolotherapy.com/pdfs/issue_10/issue_10_06_prolozone_regenerates_joints.pdf

    Note that prolozone is not mainstream therapy. I had to pay cash to the naturopath who provided the therapy for me. There are a number of MDs who also provide it, and they may be able to get at least partial coverage from insurance. There is a list of providers at Ozone Therapy Doctors World Wide There are also doctors who provide the therapy, but choose to not be listed in the directory.
     
  19. kgall

    kgall Active Member

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    Never heard of this one, but I will check it out.
     
  20. Roland1555

    Roland1555 Senior Member

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    I will be getting the second knee done in the summer. I fully can understand how your wife would feel unbalanced with having only done one side. The second joint will let the surgeon do the math and get both legs matched up for lengths and such.

    Just using our public health coverage, they do allow for a standard number of physiotherapy visits but will readily extend them if the individual seems to need more. I understand the differences between our countries in this regard, and am not making any judgements, but you are also able to pay for private services here, including physiotherapy and if you have additional health benefit insurance, those plans will either pay in full or perhaps a large percentage of those out of pocket expenses.

    The company that made my knee braces is Swedish I guess, but it was their California office that contacted the Canadian branch to have me take part in a trail of a new brace. I have now two of these custom things for the leg with the fully replaced knee, so there goes $2400. as they sell for $1200. each.

    There are many of these companies I am sure, but mine was called Ossur. Just Google it and I'm sure it will give you a listing for not only their site and products, but also competition/alternatives to them. My surgeon in hospital gave me the initial prescription to see them, it is a teaching hospital and they are always looking for ways to help.

    The braces are most definitely made to order, and in fact they will not make them without a prescription and they create a full cast to mold them properly. With your issues occurring at the outside of the joint, it would to me seem to be a matter of reversing the Velcro straps to cause opening pressure at the outside of your joint to help you rather than at the inside as was my case.

    Check out online those companies near to you, email them and discuss with your doctor... I truly hope that you can find relief with them. I was told that in many cases you can avoid surgery, reduce pain meds and maybe get decades of use with these things depending on your unique circumstances. I think I waited too long before speaking up and giving into the pain.

    I've been out in the Prius now on three occasions to drive the family around to do shopping and stuff. My knee has improved, but it is still hard. My leg rests against the 'flying buttress' shifter panel that sweeps into the armrest. While I've made progress in physiotherapy getting scar tissue down in the larger joint, there still seems to be some behind the new patella where there is a button to help it track in the middle of the plastic center portion of the insert. the lateral pressure when your knee rests on the shifter panel seems to cause it to find new positions that you have to train your tissue to accept. I know that motions should only be done in a straight on fashion, but driving seems to have long legged people using the legs at a relaxed angle, that introduces some side to side pressure. All in time I suppose and trust.. they say 8-12 weeks for a reason I'm sure. Hopefully you know what I was trying to say above,... looks a bit messy as I re=read it but I really don't know how to best explain without sitting down over a coffee with you in person.

    For now I use these shuttle buses that come right to your door and take you to your doctor or wherever you have to go. It is really awesome how many wonderful services they have to help folks in need of a hand these days. I am truly grateful.

    All my best to you and your wife as you cope with your own knees.... and my apologies for going on about my own circumstances.

    Roland