Plug-in Owners Plug In More

Not sure I would agree... how is paying $2.00 to charge a PiP for 11 - 14 miles of road (and usual additional parking fees) beat 3.60/gallon gas price which will take me down 50+ miles of road?

 

I said "almost always"
$2 is pretty outrageous. The PiP only has 2-2.5kwh available, IIRC.
So, $2 works out to about $1/kwh. Where/who is charging that much!?
I've read that many public charging stations charge a flat fee, based on time, and regardless of kwh. I think it had something to do with laws on the books stating only utilities are allowed to 'meter' electricity, and anyone charging per kwh was 'metering', so not allowed.
I think that is beginning to change, so we should see more reasonable rates.
My guess is that $2 you mentioned would also fully charge up a Volt, allowing it go 40 miles. Also, most PHEVs, unlike the PiP, get WORSe gas mileage in ICE mode than just a regular hybrid version of the same car would.
So in this case, the problem is a combination of the PiP's small battery, superior ICE efficiency, and an unrealistic/unfair charging price.

 

Who: Most private parking spots in downtown DC. There are some with a .75c/hour charge. There are a lot with the $2.00/hour charge. There are very very few with free charging (after payment for the parking).

 

One would pay for parking whether they charge or not, I am assuming.
Also, I'm guessing this is a level 2 charger? And the $2 is irrespective of kwh drawn?
Is is pro-rated if you disconnect is less than 1 hour?
If that's the case, it makes sense for a Volt, but not a PiP.
Volt (2013 & later) would be able to draw 6 kw in 1 hour, so $2 translates to 24-30 miles, as opposed to $3.50 (premium) for the same 24-30 miles using ICE.
PiP doesn't make sense in this situation, as noted previously, except in the $.75/hour spots.

 

All curent Volts (and 2014 specs) are 3.3kW for L2 charging. So an hour is about 10-14 miles.
At home I pay $.14 kWh on-peak and .10kWh offpeak for green power -- i.e. (so .30-.35 per L2hr) won't pay anywhere near $2. I max out at $.50 an hour unless its clear they have their own solar/wind (in which case I'll do 1/hr just to be supportive).

 

It might be even simpler than what you state.
Someone buying a Volt gets a car that can go pretty much anywhere any gas car can go, thus it is an OK replacement for a one-car household or as the main car in a multi-car household. And, of course you would use it that way, all the time.

A Leaf buyer is most likely getting it as a commuter car in a multi-car household and they use it to commute and do local chores. By "natural" self-chosen selection, the Leaf buyers all have a shorter than average commute, while the Volt buyers are average or above.

Mike

 

Agreed. They should design charging stations that assess some sort of penalty if you don't disconnect & move within so many minutes of reaching a full charge.

 

+1

Most chargers are either Blink/Chargepoint. So this could be done. If the EV stops charging and sees the plug is still connected (say after 30 minutes later), the system should start charging for overstay fee. Something like $2/hr. This is like them paying for charging.

 

I'd prefer to see a system that locks the charger to the car while charging that has an over ride for the owner, and then lets the charger be disconnected by anyone when complete.

 

But what if no one is waiting?
What about all the proponents of V2G?

Just a thought...this does make sense for a high use area (haven't seen any of those yet except at work). Allow someone with an access card to swipe it when a car is plugged in and finished and it sends the owner a text to move their car.

For example I use ChargePoint (needed for work chargers). It sends me a text message and an email when charging is done or someone unplugs me, etc. So it would be easy enough for them to send me a message when someone swiped their card, but I'm still plugged in. The system has just a scrolling display and no buttons. The cards are RFID. And some stations have 2 L2 charging cords or one L2 and an L1 access door. So the software would need to realize that I want to send a message to someone, and ask me to swipe my card a second time to confirm.

Since I know someone at ChargePoint, I'm going to suggest this.

Mike

 

How would this fix the problem with PiP plugging and taking up the parking space all day? My company says to call security to get this resolved. Hahaha.... they do nothing. Giving fake tickets certainly would not help since they cannot be enforced for not paying.

 

I was envisioning a charger that can reach more than one parking space.

 

Then you do not have much experience. The problem is most of the used parking spaces are the PiP parking next to each other. Have you tried plugging a few parking spaces away with about 15 feet of cable length? And usually the other side of the PiP is an handicap parking space.

 

Wrong. I have NO experience

Still, I think the problem of physical connection and charge permission are separate problems to fix. I do understand that when either are present the orphaned *EV is unhappy.

 

The ChargePoint cables can reach to 6 or 8 parked cars. Sometimes it is a bit of a stretch. If the charging station is centered on a parking space, maybe only 6. Here are some of the ways. Sometimes you need to be backed in...some spaces either way works.



Mike

edit: I should note that this works well for work chargers. Most public ones I've seen are against a wall.

 

I don't want the charger locked to my vehicle. I am fine with someone unplugging me that needs a charge. I have the ICE to fall back on and a BEV doesn't. I leave a sign in my windshield giving permission to unplug my vehicle if someone needs a charge. So far, everyone has plugged me back in when they have finished using the plug.

 

Yeah.. we have parking meters that you cannot "feed" without moving and alert meter maids when the cars are parked past time.

I used to do that, and will continue to do so at some places/times, but the last two times I parked at DIA Canopy Parking, I was unplugged, within 30min of parking (so not much charge) and never plugged back in. This despite a note saying they could unplug when charged, and how to tell when its charged. Any BEV driver there also had choices (other spots or the valet area).

A mode that is locked it unless charged or unless I send it a code would be nice. Don't know that I would but I paid extra to park at that spot and was angry when I was unplugged like that.

 

Ditto

 

If no one is waiting, the system should allow indefinite stay with no penalty. Someone mentioned above that the parking meters in their city can sense if a spot is occupied, so this should also be doable for charge stations.
Further, the charge station should be able to take reservations via smartphone, so it would text you and warn you to unplug if someone were en route to the charging station, giving you time to put the charger back in the cradle by the time they arrive.

About V2G.....I would envision these being primarily non-public - commercial fleets, corporate campuses, private parking garages, or private parking spots in public garages. The reason is
(1) the V2G equipment installer would need dedicated customers in 'clusters' to justify value to the utility
(2) adding V2G abilities to a public charging station simply adds too much variability....it is highly likely that the charging station would end up giving out power during peak hours, as opposed to receiving power

On a side note......the entire charging interface system needs to be better designed and standardized.....there are plenty of stories about confusion and congestion at charging stations, and we are only at 100,000 EVs....what happens when we get to half million? Million+?

The best way is to have communication between EV, smartphone and charging station. This enables greater flexibility and utility per station as opposed to just building more stations, which is expensive.

For example, right now some people are leaving placards on the dashboard saying "OK to unplug if charged"
Well, what if I have a Volt, and I only need a full charge by 5:30pm (starting charging at 3pm).
If I pull in at 9am, I should be able to allow a LEAF arriving at 9:20am to unplug me, so long as they charge up their LEAF and plug my Volt back in before 3pm. It is NOT necessary for the LEAF owner to wait until I'm fully charged up, because that would be denying the LEAF a badly needed charge-up, delaying them, not to mention losing another customer and more utility for the charging station. Ideally, the station would penalize the LEAF owner if they don't plug the Volt back in when they're done.

These types of complexities can only be remedied by seamless interface between charge station, EV, and smartphone, whereby a user can specify "plug in by" and "with at least x miles" and so forth, as well as facilitate communication between users of a station.