HV Battery fail @ 126K miles

Back in the mid 70's I bought 2 Chevy vans, had so many problems with them. I got rid of them and never bought another American car since. I have been very happy for 40 years.

 

Sedan. 4 doors and a trunk. Nice car

 

Just curious what car did you replace the Prius with?

 

Nice. I'm sure you will have a much better experience. That has to be good for 10 + years and 150,000 -250,000 Miles easy

 

Ok, hopefully that car is nice and reliable. At your nearly 20 kmile/year though, that 28 MPG is going to equate to a $2500 "repair" bill about ever two years in equivalent gas costs.

 

That's a good point, uart. I think the lesson here, for other Prius owners, is that you have to start looking at the battery as a maintenance item. With a non-hv car, you could drive it forever and never see anything like a transmission needing to be replaced. But eventually, the HV battery is going to die. Batteries die. But if you look at it more as a supplemental fuel cost, rather than a repair cost, then you are no longer trying to compare it to catastrophic repairs on other cars.
There is still the sticker shock, just as when a giant SUV fills up at the pump and it costs over $100.

To the OP, I'm sure you will enjoy the RAV4. Since they dropped the spare tire off the back, I think it is a nice looking compact SUV. You should have sprung for the EV model (just kidding).

 

I realize that this is a little late and after the fact you already bought another car, however Toyota Corporate is helping those like you who are having these failure's.

Multiple Warning Lights=Hybrid Battery in Question | PriusChat

This may not help you, but it might help other's reading this site.

Ron

 

I don't quite get what you are complaining about here? I think it's owners responsibility to know the realities regarding their vehicles. Why would you believe a salesman telling you the price of a HV battery?

Toyota is not disingenuous about their warranty coverage on their HV batteries. From new, it's 8 years, 100,000 miles or 10 years, 150,000 miles if bought and registered in a CARB state. And YES, once you are past warranty, you could at any given moment be faced with the replacement of a HV battery. Personally, I think Toyota's warranty on their HV battery is very, very good.

As an owner I simply operate with the knowledge that in Oregon, I'm covered for 150,000 miles or a decade, and when and if I approach those limits, I then accept that I could have to replace the HV battery on my own dime.

So I don't think it's a matter of "Beware" as the OP ends their original post. I think it's a matter of "Be Aware".

From what I've read in Prius Chat, there are some options outside of dealership replacement of the HV battery that may be more economical, and even potentially better. I'm thinking of "Re-Involt"...and I think there are a few others.

But unless you bought a Prius entirely oblivious to the realities of it having an expensive HV battery as part of the standard equipment...then I say Be Aware...not Beware...Toyota's warranty coverage is really very good, even at the 8 years or 100,000 miles level. I think 100,000 miles of fantastic gas mileage even if I "might" have to replace the battery at some unknown point beyond...is still a very good deal. From what I've observed here at Prius Chat most people's batteries are lasting well beyond the minimum parameters of Toyota's generous warranty.

 

I agree with your logic 100%. Car quality has progressed 10 fold. To buy a new car from the dealer a Prius and be presented with a $3,500 bill after 7 years and some 100,000 thousand miles is unbelievable , akin to getting bit on the nose by the traction battery. If you do fix it, than what's next Transaxle, brake master cylinder, Inverter? I would have done the same.

If given the choice of a car that is a little worse on the MPG but peace of mind I'm there also. New car no worries for years. Can't beat it. If you can afford it than by all means do it. As consumers we are not expected to know all the little tricks of the trade to get back alley white glove treatment from the manufacturer. We expect our dealers to be our trusted advisors.

Your going to get the Cradle to Grave Prius Types here. I'm a Prius enthusiast but fool me once and I'm buying something else ( Sold my BMW after 7 years and 110,000 miles and a long history of expensive repairs and maintenance and migrated to Toyota). It is not wise to throw good money at bad. Get out, get some money for it while you can, get a new car. At least you stayed in the Toyota family. That is a win for the Toyota company stock holders. The Rav is a great car, drive it in good health.

 

Why is it "unbelievable"? The OP did get 128,000 miles and 7 years on the original HV battery. While a little low in comparison to many experiences, I wouldn't call it an unacceptable failure. Unfortunately for the OP they don't live in a CARB state so the battery is beyond warranty. And again...Toyota is upfront about their battery warranty. It's in the owners manual.

And as far as the cost? Like I said, I think that's owners responsibility to make themselves aware. I'm not going to believe a salesman's quote for replacement. Before I ever purchased my Prius I did plenty of research as to the real cost of battery replacement. It seems currently to be $3000-$4000 range if OEM and through a dealership. Other outside battery remanufacturers and independent shops seem to be in the $2000-$3000 dollar range.

That's not a cheap replacement in any case, but if it's a reality that is faced on a 130,00-150,00+ mile cycle or after about a decade of driving? Then I just look at it as an inevitable maintenance expense.

 

Yes I understand what you're saying. The fuel savings of owning a Prius are certainly reduced if you have to factor in a battery replacement. And I'm sure this is reflected in the second hand price of a Prius as it starts to age, so to some extent you still lose out even if you do trade early. For some of us however, there's also an element of satisfaction in owning a very low emission vehicle which is aside from just the cost saving issue (no please don't insert south-park video of prius owner smelling own farts here. )

Anyway, in your situation I think I would have tried to obtain a second hand battery from a low mileage wreck and taken a punt with that for perhaps $1500 or so fitted. I then would have sat back and thought of the $7000 in gas costs that I'd already saved over that 7 years and 128000 miles, and possibly not felt quite so bad about the whole situation.

 

We all set the Bar at a different level.

We all have different thresholds on repair or replace decisions. I would have sold the car and chalk it up to experience.

 

I think your dealer made out real good. He told u your battery was bad and u bought a new car from him. I still think the battery might not of been bad.

 

And there is your mistake. A HV battery is not an "Electronics World" product. It is a very specific component to an automobile and so is going to be priced like any specific unique automotive part. That is to say, likely to be priced at a premium.

I wouldn't expect an HV battery to hold the pricing patterns of a Cell Phone or Ipad, or any mass produced product in which technology change and direct competition and greater production, lead to price drops. Outside of oil and air filters or other mass produced routine maintenance items, in which high volume and direct competition creates lower prices, no automotive "part" I've ever bought for a vehicle has been valued at near the cost of production. I would not harbor that expectation. That's where salvage yards become of value. You did this all through the dealership, which is going to be the most convenient avenue for replacement, but not the most economic.

Outside of Re-Involt, and I believe a few other battery remanufacturers, you pretty much HAVE to go through Toyota to get an OEM battery replacement "new". Whether we are talking a Brake Actuator, Water Pump, or HV battery, I expect the price to reflect a substantial profit for the manufacturer.

Your expectations....and a "Salesman" told you....that the price had gone down. This was simply not true, at least not at the level you expected. That's too bad. But any minimal amount of research here, or on the internet would of kept you from being too surprised.

I can hope that in 6-10 year plus, if I face HV battery replacement the cost has gone down. Do I expect it? No.

There are links that appear right here on Prius Chat....to rebuilders, of Prius HV batteries. They can be shipped to any place to be installed by any independent installer. Or some people attempt installing themselves. So there are some lower cost options.

The "Tin Foil" hat speculation beyond all this, is that it IS somewhat in Toyota's advantage to keep the price of an HV battery replacement in the "painful" range. Why? Because people will do exactly what you have done. Trade in, and buy something else. If Toyota can "encourage" you to buy a new Prius every 5-6 years because of fear of a HV battery failure? Win for Toyota.

Toyota sold you a new vehicle....and the dealership got your Prius, which they can resell or as you say, probably install a new battery themselves at a much lower cost to themselves and resell......win/win for Toyota.

This isn't something I'd really complain about...it's simply automotive reality, whether we are talking an ICE or a HV battery.

 

LKQ or Keystone is so much less than OEM it is a Fortune 500 Company or close to it.

If reinvolt expanded production and network reduced costs they may be good for the market.

My friend is a nurse makes good bank. Driving her paid in full Prius 10 years with 165,000 miles. Husband says when the battery goes they will buy a new car. They will get a PIP. They are in a CARB state or low carb state judging from her gams Humor

 

Chances are the traction battery had failed. And it seems the OP had to decide rather quickly whether to repair or sell. His decision was a fairly good one. But indulge me and continuing reading this rather long post.

OK, the OP drives 18K miles per year and will likely continue to do so for many more years.

Trading in his Prius before reaching the 100K mark (in a non CARB state) would have allowed the OP to recoup about 38% of the purchase price. The Edmunds TMV for a 2008 Prius II with 99500 miles is worth around $9000 as a trade-in. The original MSRP was about $24,000 tax included. So the cost of owning the Prius for five and a half years was about 15 cents per mile (not including gas, insurance, maintenance, license, etc.).

The OP has bought a new $24K RAV4 instead that he would have been able to get for $15K after the Prius trade in. Now he's spent $39K and drives the RAV4 for eight years and 144K miles. Let's assume the RAV4 with 144K miles on the clock is worth $9K in 2021. So after 13.5 years and 244K total miles driven, the total ownership cost is 12.3 cents per mile ($30K/244K miles).

Assume instead that the OP had decided to install a new OEM traction battery and drove the car for another 144K miles and eight years more.

That would effectively increase the MSRP to $27500 (including the $3500 for the new HV battery) with a residual value of $2000 after 13.5 years. Don't laugh - there are many people who would gladly pay $2000 for a 13.5 year old Gen II Prius they could tinker with - I would be one of them.

This would make the cost of ownership about 10.4 cents per mile (assuming no other major repairs are needed - yes, it's very unlikely - but still possible) ($25.5K/244K miles).

Consequently, switching to the RAV4 would cost the OP about $4500 more for 13 years of ownership than staying with the Prius that had two new OEM traction batteries.

Sure, it's not a big difference - but nearly enough for me to buy 2 more new OEM traction batteries that I could install when I needed them .