Advice please: brake pads from shop or from dealership?

Tutorial

 

Amazing Some people have wild idea's of proper brake service and post them on the web.
Does this mean it's the correct way ?? No, it doesn't. Please understand, your brakes are the most important
system on your car. It's best, NOT to follow an unskilled methodology of DIY brake service.
If you're not a qualified technician, please don't post your home brew methods of brake service. Someone could DIE
from this type of improper information. Thank You!

 

Take a look at this extract from the Toyota service manual if you think working on Prius brakes is just like any other car.

 

You're confusing brake service with fluid replacement that includes a complete bleed procedure.
None of that is necessary to perform brake pad or rotor replacement.
Please stick to the topic of: Brake Pad/Rotor Replacement

 

OK, let's stick to that topic. It still is a good idea to disconnect the 12V battery before starting work. The point of that is to prevent the brake actuator pump from running while you for example have a front disc caliper removed.

The Toyota repair manual suggests that the ECB brake control has to be "prohibited" (in other words, remove power if you do not have access to Techstream to prohibit ECB operation) before this work is done, or else wait at least 2 minutes after the car is IG-OFF.

Since this might be too complicated for some to understand and act upon, I suggest a simple approach which is merely to disconnect the 12V battery negative cable. Then, no one can put the car in any mode other than IG-OFF while the brake work is being carried out.

If you do a search you may find a few instances where a hapless owner ignored this and found that the disc caliper piston shot out of the caliper, or an untrained independent tech did the same and the car had to be towed for Toyota dealer service.

 

Baloney.

Its the first thing you should do when servicing Prius brakes. Sometimes just opening the door will actuate the brake vacuum pump. If the caliper is off out the piston comes with ensuing hilarity and usually a tow truck if the diy'er is not the genius you are.

But why shouldn't we listen to you? You've been here all of 30 days.

 

Yeah! I guess it's only been 30 "DAZE" since I fell off the turnip truck too You can do whatever you like.
You can believe all the urban internet B/S too. Happy motoring and good luck with your MAGIC BRAKES

I have 38 years of automotive technical training as a professional technician to back up my knowledge.
As a current shop owner with ongoing educational training, I can assure you.
I know better than ANY D.I.Y.er on the internet.

 

The magic comes if they have to bleed the breaks, "good luck for the first time shop or DIY who dose not believe in education!". An a little investment. But just a pad slap no problem. I have been in a few shops that open the hydraulics and wish they did not. Boy watching them waist lots of time was amusing. Yon know there still a few shops that do not have internet or any computers, still to this day!. the same shops don't spend any money on any training and it shows. I'v watched the some of the shops I have been working with the last 20 years decay. It's sad to see a once good shop die a slow death and they do not see it until it's too late. The Prius is one of the cars this type of shop will talk about being their end. When I ask them like what?. They respond, Coolant system, power ev battery and not understanding the problem a low but not dead 12V battery will cause, No belts, no brakes for over 100,000 miles and yes a few nightmares when trying to bleed them.

 

Please list the name of the shop you own.

 

Bleeding the brakes at the caliper isn't any different on a Hybrid. Changing out the fluid with a full system bleed is
the same as all ABS brake systems with an accumulator. I've been doing it for years. GM had the old accumulator
design back in the 90's on some Pontiac's. We had to rebuild the master cylinder as part of a recall campaign.
It was necessary to discharge the accumulator before disassembling the unit. There's nothing to worry about if
you bleed the system at the caliper. When doing a brake pad replacement, there's no need to open the system, unless you're going to flush the brake fluid. Standard brake service isn't part of that procedure.
There's no mystery to the Hybrid brake system. It's a standard ABS system with other ELECTRONIC controls
that don't effect how brake service is performed. It's not anything special. It's very simple and basic on the hydraulic side. Most of today's vehicle's have the same ABS, Traction and Stability control systems.

 

You want it, you can find it. And no, it's not in FL

 

Unfortunately some old shops still believe in flushing brake systems when not needed to pad their bottom line. Some times get them selves in trouble like when GM Camaro 90s first changed their ABS system to were you needed your scanner to just bleed breaks. I thought that was ridiculous at the time.

 

Now tell us about your training on Toyota hybrid systems. Can you add a used keyfob to a Prius? Can you use 0W20 oil in a Gen2? Do you know how to install a Prius C water pump on a Gen2 engine?

Toyota service documentation says to turn the ECB off when servicing the calipers. Sounds to me like good advice to disable electrical equipment before working on it.

 

Were not talking about servicing the calipers. Were talking about replacing the brake pads and/or rotor's.
Try and stay with on topic

I would need to refer you to the Toyota TSB for oil information on the GenII

The short answer is: NO
A new FOB is necessary for full function. 5W30 is the only Toyota recommended oil.

 

Just trying some tests of competence with Toyota hybrids. Since you claim to understand Toyota systems better than the people who write their service documentation, I wondered what your thoughts were on those other items.

 

Where did I say, I know better than the service docs ??? or those who write them ?? Well, I might know more than the writers I did say: "I know more than any internet DIY'er"

That process isn't part of a brake pad/rotor replacement procedure. It's for a brake fluid change with a system bleed.
It's not necessary to replace the fluid when replacing brake pads, unless it's due per the maintenance schedule. Were taking a no frills brake pad replacement per the OP.
This thread has morphed into a full on hydraulic system service

I can assure you if it's something I don't know, I'll research it until I find out.
Nothing is worth guessing at, if you don't know. I pay for automotive data information and use
it everyday. Even when working on non hybrids.

 

The Toyota service documentation says to disable the ECB when performing pad maintenance. You claim that what they said only applies when also doing hydraulic system maintenance.

The ECB is an electronic system that has the ability to apply pressure to the hydraulic system. Having it decide to do that while a caliper is removed would not be a good thing. Turning it off disables such an event.

 

You only need the scan tool to bleed the ABS valve block. You can bleed the brakes without bleeding
the valve block the same way you would a non ABS application. I agree with your statement about
shops trying to boost their bottom line by over selling services not needed. With the economic downturn
we've manage to put shops like that out of business. Better informed customers help reduce the abuse
that takes place in that type of shop. The internet helps on one side, but makes it worse at the same time.
There's to much misinformation associated with automotive repairs. People tend to believe what they want
no matter if it's right or wrong. Some will listen and some just never do. They run off the deep-end and usually
end up blaming everyone else for their problems

 

I just had my 2013 C brake caliper off the mounting perch without disabling anything. Yes, they tell you to do disable
the system, but it's not necessary unless someone else is working on the car at the same time. Most brake jobs are done with the car in the air on a rack. No one can gain access to it, so I don't worry about it. The system won't active unless it has other inputs from the ABS control module as well as the steering wheel position sensor and Yaw rate sensor. The vehicle would need to be in a crash anticipated situation to active brake assist control. That means, it would need to be underway with the system on and sliding on the road with the wheel turned. It's just a fail safe recommendation.

 

So what's wrong with just waiting the 2 minutes for the system to power down ? After I get the car in the stall, turn the key off, put the rack arms under it and raise the car. It's been well over 2 minutes. Now I need to remove the tires and start to remove the calipers. By the time all this is done, it's probably been at least 15 to 20 min. before I get a caliper off. That's long enough for all the systems to sleep.