Has a majority opinion been reached regarding synthetic vs. "traditional" oil?

If the focus is the engine, it's a non-issue. If the issue is wasting far less oil, then it's a completely different issue.

 

OK thank you FL you are correct. I tried to learn a little more about the A5/B5 etc. so I started looking at all the M1 bottles in the garage and next time I go to Walmart I will check more lube bottles. It is still very confusing...apparently the A5/B5 is extended drain so if you are pushing drain interval that would be important. One reference said for top quality it had to be A5/B5-08 or A5/B5-10 but some (older ones) in my garage say A5/B5-04. I'd be curious to know how the Toyota Synthetics are labeled. There is some inference that high MPG formulas (0W-xx) have harder time qualify for top A5/B5 extended drain interval top marks. Presumably for a price you an get everything, but if you have regular drain intervals, the extra cost for A5/B5 may not be worth it?

 

Paying a premium for long-life oil and then changing it out at less than half it's formulated life is certainly wasting money. Changing out a synthetic at 5000 mile intervals does not make sense, just as trying to extend using conventional oil to 25,000 miles is senseless.

 

Easy to see that extremes do not make sense, but how about the question of whether following Toyota reccs of exchanges every 10k using their synthetic ? Is that in your opinion a reasonable interval if the owner wants engine long-life way past warranty, given the UOAs we have seen here on PC ?

I'm not trying to put you on the spot, I value your opinion.

 

I thought about going the route you practice, but I kinda sorta decided that the cost of the UOA would offset the cost of the oil change; and the oil is recycled (IIRC to heating oil,) so enviro gain is minimal.

I like the idea of re-refined oil as something of an equivalent to your practice, but so far as I know high quality 0W-20 is not available.

 

The recommended Toyota interval using the recommended oil is going to work great. Whether the recommended oil is a synthetic or not is going to make little difference. The 5k or 10k mile interval assumes the oil meets the minimum grade requirement called out in the owners manual. Following the manual will make the engine last longer than many other parts of the car for the vast majority of owners.

Now owners in extremely cold or wicked places (e.g. Alaska and Canada) will often go a few extra steps, such as using an expensive synthetic or changing oil grades with weather conditions, so there are limited situations where the payoff for unique oil handling is worth considering.

The payoff of extended intervals works for me because I'm going to do all the routine maintenance myself and just like to know what is happening inside the engine. The UOA's actually report of lot of info for those that can understand the report. What also becomes clear is the wide variation in the quality of oils. I just like using minimal resources to their full extent. In this case I also get "insider knowledge" of what is going on inside the engine.

One last note, I've done this enough to recommend changing out the initial oil early, like at half the recommended interval. The factory oil is first rate, but the amount of silicon (e.g. dirt) in the first UOAs made it very clear that some dust was inside the engine when it was put together. So while I like extended intervals, that does not apply to the first interval.

 

Spamoil, er, I mean Amsoil users. They really like to push the oil change intervals way, way, beyond the recommended oil change intervals. I asked a couple on Amsoil why they do that (extra extended oil changes), their justification is the product comes at a premium price, so (mindset), they don't have to change it as often. When it is suggested they get a UOA, and the results come back to them, they are shocked at the build up of metals and acids in their beloved Amsoil.

Talk about a bunch of horses**t responses: they think the UOA is wrong, or misread. They have a hard time believing the oil and filter must be changed more often. Reality sets in when they go back to the recommended change intervals, get a UOA and, PRESTO!!!! - the levels on contaminents are well with specs.

Go Figure. But, remember what P. T. Barnum said: "A sucker is born every minute".

FWIW, the above super extended oil changes are even more ridiculous with some diesel truck owners. They pay big $$$ for the engine only to squander money on not doing the recommended oil and filter change intervals.

DBCassidy

 

My first hand experience is the complete and total opposite of your hearsay experience.

 

product.

So be it, I stick by my reply.

DBCassidy

 

From the Canadian Prius Owners Manual Supplement:

 

I would hate to see what the Arctic Circle Owners manual requirements are.

 

Trust me, 49th parallel is not like Artic Circle. Heck, the Arctic Circle hasn't been itself for the last decade. Recently it's been high twenties (Centigrade) in Whitehorse! Here in Vancouver we just broke a record: a calendar month passed without rain.

And our Canadian coastal winters are a lot milder than US Midwest.

I guess what I'm saying: I think there's a lot of politics in the oil change interval, and good arguments for somewhat shorter interval. Just keep in mind Toyota's recommendation for transaxle fluid change...

 

As promised, I checked out lube oil bottles at Walmart (for as long as my wife could tolerate; ie briefly).

>>I saw in general, for example Mobil-1, both the 5w-30 and 0w-30 are A5/B5 and A1/B1 rated.
>>However, the 20-weight oils 5w-20 and 0W-20 I did not see any brands with the A5/B5 rating (extended drain) some brands including Mobil-1 mention A1/B1 rating

Also re: Mobil-1 these ratings on the new bottles differ from the old bottles in my garage.

 

Found this in an old post:

Something must have changed since then. I can now get A5/B5 rated 0W-20.

 

...did you mention brand you are using to get that A5/B5 in a 20-weight?

 

Yes, Amsoil 0W-20 is now A5/B5 rated, but that has only been the case in the last couple of years. Prior to that, I could not find any 0W-20 oil rated A5/B5 (hence the question and answer from the old post). I do not know if the oil or the standard changed to allow the improved rating.

 

But that won't stop anyone from arguing about this topic.

Let's try religion or Mac vs. PC next.

 

I was just trying to help OP with the obvious: that from day #1 the opinions did not split exactly down the middle.

 

..I filled up at Shell today, they had AMSOIL so I checked out 0W-20 and 5W-20 bottles. I did not see any ACEA A5/B5 nor A1/B1 ratings...did I miss it?