Gas on to heat car - does it defeat the purpose

Having a goal to sell a vehicle in high-volume is just ordinary business-sustaining profit. Enough with the off-topic spin already.

Using engine heat to feed the coolant for warming as well as replenishing some EV is a clever aspect of the design, something those of us experiencing real winter conditions will definitely benefit from.

 

Jeff N understands HSD. The components are sized and are assigned multiple roles. The goal is to do more with less.

 

I have to agree with 13Plug. I really really like the Volt, but ended up with a PiP for various reasons. That said, Almost every thread has some posts regarding the Volt, and it is becoming frustrating. I'll visit the Volt forums if I want more details about the Volt (or start a new thread if I want to compare), but there really is too much Volt talk in the PiP threads IMO.

In the end, I'm here to learn more about my car, and the heater in this case.

I apologize in advance if I sound rude, as that definitely was not the intention, but hopefully the post makes some sense.

 

My fault .... The thread's title seemed to open a discussion of design choices and their trade offs. My post was mainly to illustrate that you could use the battery to heat the cabin and not use any gasoline, especially if your trip is within the capacity of the battery to do both.

 

With the electric seats turned on and climate control set to off the ICE does not need to run. I find this is comfortable for the duration of EV range. The ICE does not run so it does not defeat the purpose. Once EV range is used up ICE will come on on it's own and at that point I will turn on the climate control if necessary to keep my toes warm on a longer outing.

 

My 2005 Prius heater came on hot very quickly, the quickest of any car I ever owned. The PIP could do the same but it would hurt the EV range... this is all I can think of...

 

Lol nothing like reviving a thread that's over three months old!

 

Yes! I really wish this existed or could be installed as a mod at least.

 

Ok, I think I have a solution for the lack of non-ICE-derived heat. I hadn't thought much about it before, but now I have,and here's what I suggest - keeping in mind I'm not an engineer and haven't tried it myself:

Lasko makes a 200 watt "personal heater" that is designed to heat small areas with little enough power so that it is allowed in office cubicles. My housemate just got one for her refrigerated "office." I tested it (not in the car, in her cubicle, which is large and very cold) and it produces very warm air, with a modest volume flow. It should work fine for a PIP. To power it, you can't use the accessory ports, so it would need a 20 or 25 amp, "always on" dedicated circuit from one of the fuse blocks in the car, to power a good quality 400 watt inverter. For safety, you would also want to "cage" the heater with an enclosure that would stop anyone from knocking it over, and also to keep it far enough away from combustible materials. The inverter could be mounted under the dash.

To preheat the car with this setup, I'd suggest a timer be wired into the circuit, ahead of the inverter, so that it can be used optionally. That way the heater could preheat the car for, say, 15 minutes; if you didn't change the switch position by then, it would shut down, preserving the accessory battery. A simple timer would have to be activated manually right before leaving, but a better one could be set further ahead of time. Once the car was running, even in EV mode, the DC/DC converter would keep the accessory battery supplied with power, as the accessory battery supplied the heater. A thermostat wired into the heater supply circuit, either ahead of or after the inverter, would also be advisable as the Lasko unit just has an On/Off switch. There may well be better heaters (with thermostats and even timers) out there, but the 200 watt unit seems ideal in size, power consumption, and heat output. One final suggestion, especially for those who own their PIPs: get a better 12 volt battery, with a higher capacity, and a true Deep Cycle architecture.

Actually, the heat pump in the 2013 Leaf can heat the cabin with as little as 1500 watts (1.5KW). It can also work until the temp gets into single digits F. Even the resistance type heaters can be 'throttled back' if necessary. I think that the PIP can indeed provide adequate heat - especially when compared to no cabin heat at all. It's my understanding that the prototypes had electric heaters.

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wow, more than a year later, 150 posts, 8,000 views, and still no solution...

 

I am sorry, running the gas to heat the car WAS the solution. You are free to add seat heaters.

Premium Heated Seat Kits for Two Seats - Universal, OEM Equipment - High and Low Settings - Five Year Warranty Rectangular Switch : Amazon.com : Automotive

 

The PiPs come with seat-heaters and I use them when it's cold, but if the windows need to be cleared, the ICE is coming on.

The fellow out in Torrance said the PiP HVAC system has heating elements in the HVAC system, just like the standard Gen III. I neglected to ask what parameters they work under, though.

 

I seriously hope that Toyota reconsiders this design in the near future. One of the biggest advantages the PiP has is on short trips, yet with this design, that advantage is largely eliminated in cold weather. I'm seeing trip mileage as low as 22mpg in the cold temperatures we've been having, compared to all electric in warmer weather. 22mpg in cold is only marginally better than my 20 year old 300 hp Volvo was getting. Obviously that's not the whole story, but a simple electric heater to clear the windshield would suffice.

 

In the standard Prius, the ceramic heaters run in all the defrost modes.

The ptc heater | PriusChat

At 350 watts, they can't clear the windshield, let alone heat the car.

 

So you COULD have an electric heater, which will turn on the engine to produce electricity, or you could have a radiator heater which will turn on the engine to produce hot water, your choice.

 

Right, but in previous discussions it was brought up that there's nothing other than the heater core in there, which is not the case.

 

Which makes me wonder if it works differently in the PiP. In other words, maybe when the ICE warms up the cabin, then shuts off, the elements try to maintain heat before the next time the ICE comes on again. I'll have to give the guy in Torrance a call sometime again and ask how exactly they work in the PiP and if it's different than a standard Gen III.