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Winter driving suggestions

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Main Forum' started by Bob G IA, Jan 1, 2014.

  1. Bob G IA

    Bob G IA Member

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    Well winter is in full force here in the midwest and much of the northern USA. Our 5 day forecast has 3 mornings that are expected to be -20degF. There are a few things I suggest for those dealing with winter.
    Blocking the lower grill and bottom half of the upper grill defiantly helps the engine to warm up quicker and stay warmer.
    Putting the sunvisors down to keep the heat from the defroster against the windshield helps keeps the upper part of the windshield from frosting over.
    Continental Pure Contact tires are doing well for me on ice and snow.
    My Fiancee is preferring Michilen X Ice 3 tires.
    (Her and I both have 2010 Red Prius II)

    Good luck, stay warm & drive safe!
     
  2. Jon Stapel

    Jon Stapel Junior Member

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    Wait.....you and your fiance both drive the same year, model and color car? That's cute. :p
     
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  3. mrbigh

    mrbigh Prius Absolutum Dominium

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    Whoa !!!:rolleyes: cuteness
     
  4. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    we need it here today, winter driving suggestions and cuteness!(y)
     
  5. Bob G IA

    Bob G IA Member

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    Well it just kind of worked out that way. I had bought my Prius in May and my fiancee had been doing a lot of driving for work with her Town & Country minivan. After showing her how much money she could be saving on gas she really didn't want anything but a hybrid car to replace her minivan after that. My fiancee was actually looking at a different Prius that was about 75 miles from home when we spotted this red one marked down $2000 and was Toyota Certified that was closer to home. We even showed the salesman the dealer website of the other one we were planning on looking at. They offered us a deal we couldn't refuse.
    I know it seems kind of odd to have 2 almost identical cars, right down to the window vents, sitting in the garage side by side but she drives 100 miles a day going one direction and I drive 75 miles a day going the opposite direction.
    P.S. It does offer some humor when my kids try to get into the wrong car.
     
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  6. Daddy Dave

    Daddy Dave Member

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    Put studded snow tires on a Prius and it'll go anywhere!

    My 2010 has 94k miles on it already. 1/3rd of that is northern Wyoming -20F to +20F winter driving. The only hiccup I've seen is once when starting at -25F after an overnight cold soak it stumbled for 15 seconds after starting. I pressed the accelerator to get it to a decent rpm and it recovered.
     
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  7. Mide

    Mide Junior Member

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    Yeah I changed my tires out to studded snow tires and the Prius can plow through pretty much anything this winter. Handles similarly with a Subaru with regular tires.
     
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  8. our1vue

    our1vue Member

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    Any suggestions on going up snowy hills in a prius ? All my previous cars were standards and for them I would
    put it in third gear, and as I approach and go up the hill, I'd give it a little gas (not flooring it). Third gear seemed
    to be a good gear to keep the engine rpm's up and not go too fast.
    This doesn't seem to work in the prius because of its variable transmission. If I give it the gas before I start going up
    the hill it starts going too fast. Then when I go up the hill, the transmission starts "downshifting" and the car
    starts to slow down and I lose my momentum. The only thing I can think of is to floor the car at the bottom of
    the hill, but that may spin the wheels too much and the traction control will stop me. So how do you drive this
    thing up a hill ???? By the way I do have 4 studded winterforce snow tires on the car.
    Thanks for the suggestion about putting the visors down to keep the warm air on the windshield. Hopefully that will
    help with my wiper icing problem
     
  9. Bob G IA

    Bob G IA Member

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    I have driven for 32 years and have always used A/S tires. There is just so much of the time in Iowa that the roads are bare, even in winter, that I never felt it would be worth swapping tires for the winter and switching back in the spring.
    For my Fiancee it's different. She came from Vermont where its standard to switch to studded snow tires for winter. Last winter was her first winter in Iowa. She got by last winter with A/S tires but wanted winter tires this year. I talked her into studless snow tires instead studded because she commutes 100 miles a day, half of that being freeway at 70+MPH. I thought the X ICE 3 tires would perform better in the mix of driving conditions from dry/wet/snow/ice than studded tires. She can tell the X ICE 3 tires are better than A/S tires but she still thinks studded tires would slide around less on ice. This surprises me since what I have been reading in reviews made me think that tires like X Ice 3 and Blizzacks should do better than studded snow tires. But now reading post here maybe next year I should let her get studded snow tires again.

    There is one aspect of the Prius that I wonder if others have noticed. If you are braking on ice using only regen braking and the front tires start to slide it doesn't seem like the anti-lock system will kick in until you press down on the brake pedal hard enough to activate the mechanical brakes.
    After I described this to my Fiancee and suggest she press harder on the brake pedal when the Prius start sliding during braking she said it was better.
    I find this to be a flaw in the Prius system. If my foot in on the brake pedal wheel speed should be monitored for mismatch no matter if its regen braking or mechanical braking.
    With good tires and change in driving habit the flaw can be compensated for, but really should be addressed in a design change at Toyota.
    Have others noticed this as well? Are some model years better than others, IE, have they fixed in newer models?
     
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  10. Bob G IA

    Bob G IA Member

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    I too used to own several vehicles with manual transmissions and I would do like you describe and pick a gear high enough to keep the torque down but the power high enough to be able to make the hill.

    I never liked when automatic transmissions would downshift on me when climbing hills on ice because it would often mean it would make the tires break loose and start to spin.

    However, don't think of the Prius as "downshifting". That's a perspective that really doesn't apply to Synergy system. Yes the engine does increase RPMs when you press harder on the accelerator pedal but that is because the system is trying to match the power you are requesting when pressing harder on the accelerator. The electric motor/generators play a big part in what power is going to the wheels.

    Personally, every winter since I started driving, the first couple of winter storms of the year I "re-learn" how the car handles and get myself recalibrated on what to expect.
    The Prius is a different setup. The first time traction control kicked in when I was on ice I caught myself lifting my foot off the gas to try to get the tires to "catch". This is because I had never owned or driven a car with traction control. I soon realized to do the opposite when traction control kicks in, press harder on the accelerator.
    Something else I noticed with the Gen III is don't use ECO mode or PWR mode in bad weather. Running in standard mode seems to work best when traction control may be needed. I also found that "flooring it" doesn't help the traction control do what you want. However holding a steady pedal when traction control kicks in can cause the car to loose speed. For me a nudge more throttle to keep the traction control working hard but not so much it shuts down too much, is the best. There seems to be a sweet spot that all I can say it get out and pratice finding.
    Personally for me when tackling hills in the winter I want to start the hill at the bottom at least at 45 MPH and keep pressing the throttle such that I think I can maintain my speed or at least not drop below 35 MPH by the top of the hill. If traction control kicks in, take advantage of it and press harder on the accelerator, without flooring it.
     
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  11. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

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    Well with The Prius's eCVT transmission it never really down shifts or up shifts.
     
  12. our1vue

    our1vue Member

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    I know the Prius doesn't downshift. That is why I put it in quotes. But it does change to a lower gear ratio wrt to the
    engine speed and that is what is messing me up. I'm used to to a constant speed given a constant throttle position.
    Bob G IA,
    One thing about studded snowtires is they have less traction on dry concrete roads. Driving at 65 mph on a windy day on a dry road can be scary. It feels like the car is being blown off the road (especially if it is a cross wind). Fortunately I don't do a lot of highway driving in the winter, but it is something to consider. In one of the tirerack
    test they tested the same tire studded and non-studded. On ice, the studded tire was better.
    You are spot on about what I'm seeing (and doing when I go up a hill). I didn't want to floor it and cause the
    wheels to spin more. I'll have to try the little more throttle during our next snowstorm. I never drive in
    PWR or ECO mode.
    Also have you tried the "B" mode when going down the hill ? That allows you to use the engine to slow you down
    going down a hill. That worked pretty good. Just wish it locked up like a standard going up a hill.
     
  13. Bob G IA

    Bob G IA Member

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    Well... it sort of is "locked up" all the time.... However it is MG2 that is direct drive to the wheels, not the ICE.
    It might actually bet better for you to think of your Prius as primarily a direct drive electrical car that can use the power from the ICE to indirectly drive the wheels. Why do I say indirectly? Well, if it weren't for the MG1 apply counter rotation force against the ICE then power from the ICE would never reach the wheels.

    Think of MG1 as one side of a teeter totter, MG2 as the other side, and the ICE as the pivot point or fulcrum. The "height" of MG2 on the teeter totter equals the vertical scale for the MPH of the car and its RPMs. As the ICE changes RPMs it raises and lowers the fulcrum point but can't actually change the speed of the car (or MG2) unless MG1 pulls downward on its side. So how the car goes up a hill really isn't related to what the ICE is doing but rather the energy applied to MG2 and what system is doing with MG1 to direct energy from the ICE to the wheels.

    Check out this link to see where I came up with the teeter totter comparison.

    Toyota Prius - Power Split Device
     
  14. Vas25tl

    Vas25tl Member

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    I have Firestone Winterforce tires on the 2012 with gen II 15" alloys. I can literally plow roads with our prius.

    I have Michelin alps sport winter tires on our Lexus GS430 and I have had instances when I couldn't get into our parking spot.
     
  15. car compulsive

    car compulsive Active Member

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    Yep, this is a "feature" that supposedly protects the electric motors. The same thing happens if you are regen braking on gravel or broken pavement and the wheels start to lock up. (Search for surge.) The car removes regen braking and applies friction brakes, but it seems to take it's sweet time in doing the transition. There may be a TSB to shorten the transition time, but I just anticipate the possible delay and leave myself plenty of stopping distance. This quirk and the cold start knock after an interrupted warm-up cycle are the main reasons I suggested that my wife buy a Fit instead of taking over my Prius.
     
  16. Robert Holt

    Robert Holt Senior Member

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    Ah, finally found someone else who has had the front wheels lock up whilst doing regenerative braking on ice. That exact event Happened to me two days ago and I was also surprised that the ABS system did not catch it. One explanation is that the comparison of speed sensors on front wheels to back wheels may only be executed when the hydraulic brake system is activated. Fortunately the induced skid is forward rather than having the rear lock up and start to swing out sideways, but still it is undesirable. Thanks for tip of cramming on the hydraulic brakes as that was not my instinctive response when it happened.
    Ours is a late year 2012 hatchback, so that ABS flaw has not been fixed at least thru the 2012 model year.
    Anyone else have this happen?
     
  17. methuselah

    methuselah Junior Member

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    Many states don't allow studded snows anymore...including mine. Glad yours is working well for you.
     
  18. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Yeah they would be overkill for us, in the lower mainland BC. I like swapping over to snow tires though, our X-Ice (without studs) are well behaved on what's almost invariably bare roads. Once in a blue moon we get a snow dump. Global warming seems to be at work this fall: very mild so far, and lots of rain, but supposed to get colder next week, still above zero though.