VW Faces $17B Fine for Emissions Scam

Volkswagen emissions scandal: is my car affected? - Telegraph

 

No, but the EPA's investigation after the study's release did not find fault in them.

Audi TDI® models smash fuel economy ratings during cross-country efficiency drive | Audi USA
Audi TDI Crosses US On 66 Gallons - HybridCars.com

It was a highway run, but the time constraint kept the use of advanced hypermiling techniques off the table.
The A4 had the cheater 2.0L TDI. Note: the EPA has pulled the 2014 A4 TDI off its site.

Q5 highway rating 31mpg; returned 38.6mpg on the challenge.
Compare Side-by-Side
It matched or best the Lexus hybrid SUVs on the challenge results and in highway ratings.

A7 rated 38mpg highway; returned 42.6 mpg. It is also AWD.
Compare Side-by-Side
Its highway rating is near the the popular sedan hybrids, and results just past them.

Yes, it's on the highway, but many report surpassing the their diesel's city EPA in the city. Plus, the EPA highway test city is closer to the roadways around the suburbs than an actual highways.

That's news. Don't know why the EPA didn't do this already? The 3.0L uses SCR though. That doesn't require the car to 'burn' more fuel to regenerate it. So, if they had the cheater hack, a fix will have very little impact on the car's fuel economy. It will be using more DEF instead.

And particulates, and other emissions coming out of diesels and gasoline versions.

 

Its actually cheaper over a 10 year period to replace them with new cng busses, but since many are the same, I can see a retrofit kit built and mass produced more cheaply for a lot of school districts than the one off gong on now. Either way, yes, cng or scr + particulate filter on new diesel engines will fix the problem. If you give school districts 6 years it probably won't cost very much a year.

 

I think the bigger problems will be Europe's governments, who have done everything in their power to tax the crap out of gasoline and promote and subsidize the diesel industry. As a result, more than half of the car sales in Europe are diesel-powered. The media will probably come out and say what the Mayor of Paris said early this year, Get diesels out of the city. Those in Europe touting their claims of science and reducing CO2 emissions, will have to admit that they've been touting the wrong thing, and never once put the health of their citizens in front of bragging rights for how Green they are.

MERGED.

I haven't "trusted" VW since maybe ever. Even when they weren't lying their cars were about as reliable as a satellite dish in a raging blizzard.

 

I'm guessing, but its probably the fact the rear wheels aren't turning that tells the car its time to clean up.

 

Actually, it is the steering wheel staying perfectly straight that is a major input to the emissions switch. (The original post was meant to be humor to those learning the details of the switch.)

 

That's why we working drivers love school holidays! There are considerably less traffic on the road. Maybe we could consider having a clean whatever school buses to reduce the # of low occupant cars dropping off their kids. I recalled I see some buses that run on sugar, venturabus.com.au/environment

Sent

I understand EPA will be using test result for both fuel consumption and emission. What I was trying to convey is that the real life fuel consumption is lower due to emission system off, and it gives a false impression the stated emission figure is better in real life. This is how VW has been getting away with it for the last 6 years. No one is suspecting any foul play at hand, even the WVU dudes; they were only trying to prove to others that VW diesels were clean, but found otherwise.

 

This is not a matter of commercial vehicles and trucking lobby, being worse in polluting our air then any VW, its about how a car company deceived the buyers, and the US Government into thinking that their diesels were greener then they are.

 

as a kid of the 60's & 70's I recall difficulty breathing on the brown days. Every time the Santa Anas would blow to the south west, the fumes of Kaiser Steel & Aluminum to the east would empty into the L.A. basin. OK, so my dad (now in his 90's) smoked in the house every night, a lot too. But in the brown haze of summer afternoons of the 60's and 70's - the wheezing was worse.


A CARB victory? Duno. Should it require an entire department being created, just to do the right thing? So it was decided - way before most Cali residents had any input into who should do what. Still - it's better than it was, no doubt.
.

 

VW may not have caused immediate deaths, but what about in the future? These green cars are not so green.

 

nothing gets done in the public sector in this country, without first employing hundreds and thousands of workers. no point to complaint about it, it is what it is.

 

So, AG says diesel does not cause deaths, not impressed with even 40 times the allowed level or the WHO classification of diesel exhaust fumes as carcinogenic. This just in: smoking does not kill anybody, ...............right away! . EU must act over shock study on diesel fume deaths ...

 

So it seems there are more car cheats outside the 2.0L diesel

More cars set for Volkswagen emissions scandal

 

I am reminded of the old saying:

• One "Oh Crap!" wipes out a life time of "Atta Boys!"

I am waiting for the "Autoline After Hours" podcast and reading the literature, found references for the "Diesel Technology Forum", a Washington DC based advocacy group (i.e., lobbist.) They issued this:

Washington, D.C. - The Diesel Technology Forum issued the following statement regarding clean diesel vehicles in the U.S.

The Diesel Technology Forum does not comment on specific cases or circumstances involving individual companies and enforcement actions by the government. However, to the extent that these circumstances have raised questions about diesel technology in general, we offer the following:

The circumstances involving a single manufacturer do not define an entire technology, or an industry. Vehicle manufacturers and engine makers have invested billions of dollars in research and development to successfully meet the most aggressive emissions standards in the world. They continue to work closely and cooperatively with the Environmental Protection Agency, California Air Resources Board, international regulatory bodies, as well as environmental and other interest groups toward common goals.

Nothing has changed the fact that the diesel engine is the most energy efficient internal combustion engine. It is a proven technology and its unique combination of efficiency, power, reliability, performance, low-emissions and suitability for using renewable fuels ensures a place for diesel technology to help meet the demands of a global economy.

We are also confident that consumers will continue to find the new generation of clean diesel cars, trucks and SUVs as a competitive choice to meet their personal transportation needs.

Finally, it is important to focus forward on the significant accomplishments of an entire industry that developed and refined clean diesel technology to what it is today - a key strategy in achieving current and future energy and climate goals.​

I take no joy that VW shot themselves in the foot and the ricochet has wounded the other private car diesels. VW has made "clean" mean "liar, cheat, humbug." Such a waste and hind-sight suggests it was unnecessary. Understand even before this incident, I've been tolerant but not an advocate of light diesels.

The diesel engine efficiency is nearly matched by the hybrid, Atkinson cycle engine. But diesel cars continue to waste fuel when a hybrid shuts down the engine and saves the engine mechanical loss. Furthermore, hybrid braking recovers some kinetic energy instead of diesel heating and wearing down the brake-pads. But plug-ins beat both.

Plug-ins tap the thermal efficiency of power plants and even after the losses to reach the battery, beat everything on the road. Best of all, they are the ultimate, flex fuel ranging from solar, wind, water, nuclear, and fossil fuels. Even after the losses, plug-ins have nearly double the per mile efficiency of hybrids and blow away everything else on the road.

Bob Wilson

 

Can Bob or someone please do some calculations on how much really the 35x NOx the approved limit is?
Assuming the EPA limit is 50mg/mile (Tier 2, Bin 5??), this equates to 1750 mg/mile.

What does a typical bus or a truck do? I hope it's a lot higher?!

 

I was unaware of the above link in the first few days of the bad news. The EPA's own letter at http://www3.epa.gov/otaq/cert/documents/vw-nov-caa-09-18-15.pdf on page 4 says "As a result, emissions of NOx increased by a factor of 10 to 40 times above the EPA compliant levels, depending on the type of drive cycle..."

 

Thanks cwerdna! Let's just stick with 35x for argument's sake.

I think I found something interesting. According to the EPA:
www3.epa.gov/otaq/consumer/420f08024.pdf - Light Duty Truck
&
www3.epa.gov/otaq/consumer/420f08027.pdf - Heavy Duty Truck

It states that on average a petrol light duty truck emits 950mg/mile, and the Class IIb heavy duty diesel truck (very large passenger van) emits 3088mg/mile.

So back to the school bus discussion. A large school van is approx equivalent to 1.7 cheating Jettas in NOx emission. The bus can carry approx 10 kids whereas in a Jetta you might drop off only two kids?

Sorry Bob, I forgot it's very late over there... It's bright sunshine here in Melbourne!

 

Well there goes VW dreams of being the biggest selling car company in the USA! Toyota must be popping the champaign as they get ready to take the number one spot next year!

 

Now that I think about it more, the 35 times (max) was from ICCT report. Those were just initial findings.

Judging by the EPA letter and the letter at 482,000 VW TDIs Produce 5 to 35Xs the NOx Beyond Federal Emissions Requirements - CleanMPG Forums, besides the Dec 2014 recall, there was further testing by CARB in coordination w/the EPA (and maybe there was EPA testing as well). That's likely where the 10 to 40 times that the EPA states in their own letter comes from.

 

The word "highway" was (intentionally?) missed here.
For long time now you are adovcating VW diesels as being clean with performance...
You seem to market the latest EPA findings as a certificate of cleanliness of all other WV diesel engines except the 2L...
Even in this thread you claim BMW diesels far exceed the EPA bar while news from Europe may indicate you once again missfired.