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P3000, P0A9C

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by aaroncv3, Oct 10, 2016.

  1. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    Hello,

    Red triangle, check engine light, and "Problem" on the MFD. Techstream reveals two relevant codes: P3000 and P0A9C. Here are screenshots of more info about those codes:

    P3000: 20161010_P3000.png
    P0A9C: 20161010_P0A9C.png

    I'm curious if this information might indicate a problem more serious than a possibly faulty temperature sensor. Any thoughts?

    Aaroncv3
     
    #1 aaroncv3, Oct 10, 2016
  2. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    I have no experience with these codes but it looks to me like TB1 is the culprit with a low reading. When compared to TB2, it's a nearly 40F difference which is probably what triggered the code.
     
    #2 fotomoto, Oct 10, 2016
  3. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    how many miles on her?
     
    #3 bisco, Oct 10, 2016
  4. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    about 167K
     
    #4 aaroncv3, Oct 10, 2016
  5. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    battery fan has been kicking on, full blast, lately, for a period of time, then off, or at least low enough not to be heard. this made me think some cells might be failing.

    i'll start taking that area of the car apart to see what i can learn from visual inspection. i'll report back.
     
    #5 aaroncv3, Oct 10, 2016
  6. Texas Hybrid Batteries

    Texas Hybrid Batteries Senior Member

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    Arron,
    A reading like that normally means that the temperature sensor has come loose from the bottom of the module. IIRC TB1 is the one nearest the exhaust duct on the bottom of the pack. I have been personally responsible for sticking a hand in there to pick up a battery and breaking the clip that holds that thing on, lesson learned.:)

    Has your battery been worked on or taken out for anything?

    It would be easy to take the duct off and use an inspection mirror and a flash light to check those.

    Hope that helps.

    Matt
     
    #6 Texas Hybrid Batteries, Oct 10, 2016
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  7. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    the 12V ground has been disconnected from the battery and the orange HV safety mechanism has been removed. i have the HV battery area dismantled down to the pack itself. the pack is still mounted, but i just removed the hood that covers the connections.

    before i proceed, i thought it wise to measure voltage across the terminals connecting the car to the battery, ensuring high voltage
    is not present.

    i put my multimeter on the high voltage terminals closest to the wheel well. about 1 mV. the terminals closest the batteries read about quarter of a volt (0.25 V).

    before i move forward, i need confirmation that this is normal or alert that it is not.

    pictures follow.
     
    #7 aaroncv3, Oct 11, 2016
  8. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    IMAG0186.jpg IMAG0187.jpg
     
    #8 aaroncv3, Oct 11, 2016
  9. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    to answer the question about previous HV battery service, yes, the previous owner replaced at least one cell before my time with the vehicle.
     
    #9 aaroncv3, Oct 11, 2016
  10. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    oh boy. look what i found: IMAG0199.jpg IMAG0200.jpg
    a duct tape repair job by the previous owner. right in the area of TB1. go figure!

    its also pretty clear that the cells have been shuffled like a deck of cards: IMAG0197.jpg IMAG0198.jpg IMAG0201.jpg

    its hard to tell in these photos, but the sides appear to bulge, too.
     

    Attached Files:

    #10 aaroncv3, Oct 11, 2016
  11. Texas Hybrid Batteries

    Texas Hybrid Batteries Senior Member

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    Wire nuts and duct tape, wow! Check the first 4 digits of the S/N's on the modules, you should be able to tell if there were any replaced and how many. When you said the sides look bulged where are you talking about? If you mean the ends where the white plates are that's fairly normal.
     
    #11 Texas Hybrid Batteries, Oct 12, 2016
  12. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    Well, it appears there's more to this particular battery pack than that. There appear to be multiple donor modules. This thing is a mess. Have a look at the picture below. (It's been scaled to 10% of the original. Links to 25% and 100% follow the picture):
    overview (10%).png
    overview (25%).png [9MB]

    overview (100%).png [91MB]


    While the battery is out of the vehicle, and because of other issues (poor performance and fuel economy), it's a good time to take care of the other developing issues. What are your thoughts about the pack given this information?

    Yes. Good to know.
     
    #12 aaroncv3, Oct 13, 2016
  13. ericbecky

    ericbecky Hybrid Battery Hero

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    This appears to have had multiple repairs over time. It's up to you whether you want to add another band aid to the dying patient.
    As long as you don't mind the car being a bit unreliable and it going down for periods of time you should be fine. Hopefully you have a spare vehicle to drive while you work on this one.
     
    #13 ericbecky, Oct 13, 2016
  14. Texas Hybrid Batteries

    Texas Hybrid Batteries Senior Member

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    Who ever worked on it was really sloppy but your pack may not be doomed. Modules 25 and 28 are obviously not original and they rearranged the pack based on something, who knows what.

    I'd say at the very least you need to record voltages and find a way to cycle the modules and bring them to the same state of charge so that you can do some load testing. Then you need to clean up the bus bars and hardware and get another temperature harness to go on it. Actually, since the temp sensor is the code that started all of this you could just fix that and see how long it lasts.

    Matt
     
    #14 Texas Hybrid Batteries, Oct 13, 2016
  15. ericbecky

    ericbecky Hybrid Battery Hero

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    And by the way, this duct tape and wire nut repair is one definitely in my top 10 favorites Repair failures I've ever seen.

    Can I have permission to use your pics?
     
    #15 ericbecky, Oct 13, 2016
  16. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    Sure. You may also share my dismay!

    I've been designing a tool to help with testing modules. I'll get some pictures and/or video when ready.

    I have not unbolted any modules, yet. That said... I would not be shocked to find more duct tape on TB2 and TB3...

    I'll update the thread with progress.
     
    #16 aaroncv3, Oct 21, 2016
    SFO and m.wynn like this.
  17. aaroncv3

    aaroncv3 Member

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    Ah, I see that the clips for TB sensors are actually part of the sensor...

    Here is the first check of each module, by voltmeter, under no load. I understand that voltage alone is not enough to determine the health of a module, but can indicate failing modules.
    Screenshot_20161023-020131.png
     
    #17 aaroncv3, Oct 23, 2016
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