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What would cause inverter not to charge to HV battery

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017.

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  1. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    To make a long story short...

    Replaced HV Battery due to P0A80
    Started car and after 10-12 seconds car dies with P3190 (loss of power). Discovered after measuring voltage at the HV battery terminals before car starts (204 V), and after car starts (197V) that the inverter wasn't charging <although I had no codes indicating bad inverter>.

    Went ahead and replaced the inverter and still have the same issue. Watching my battery indicator, the HV battery after about 10-12 seconds goes from 5 bars to 1 then shuts off with "problem"...red triangle with code P3190 (loss of power).

    I do have an extra ECM if this is the recommended route, although I have never had to replace.

    Thanks!
     
    #1 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
  2. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

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    With what did you replace the HV battery? If if was a rebuilt, it is likely faulty.

    Also the current battery, at 204 V, is below the 40% SOC threshold above which the HV battery ECU likes to keep the voltage. You need to give the HV battery a full charge before any further attempts to start the ICE.

    I don't believe there was anything wrong with the inverter or the DC/DC converter.

    You can then attempt to trace the reason the ICE looses power.
     
    #2 dolj, Jul 4, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
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  3. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    Battery came from a 2009 wrecked prius with 100,000 miles. The wrecked car was running the day he took it out and gave it to me. (trustworthy mechanic).

    The HV battery is possibly below threshold now because I started the car several times and even drove it.......for 10-15 seconds before it died every time.

    Measuring across the terminals at the HV battery, there should be a change in voltage up from 204 when the ICE starts yes? Am I measuring this correctly?

    It just looks like to me the HV battery isn't getting charged when the ICE is on.
     
    #3 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
  4. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    A hv battery would not come out of a running car at 204v. You would have to ask this trustworthy guy again.

    You need to determine if that hv battery is any good, it seems like it has failed modules, that's why it's measuring 204v

    Since you're able to take the cover off the hv battery, are all the serial numbers on the modules similar? What's the first 4 numbers/letters on the module serial?
     
    #4 JC91006, Jul 4, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
  5. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    If I measure across the terminals should voltage go up when ice is running
     
    #5 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
  6. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    jc....if the hv battery was problematic, it would indicate that through the appropriate PO code?

    Also.....I disassembled the hv battery before I installed and all cells measured anywhere from 7.3-7.5 volts
     
    #6 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
  7. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Why did you disassemble the pack?

    7.3v - 7.5v would mean you have somewhat of an imbalance battery. The variance should not be that high (although it's acceptable in the parameters of the prius ecu).

    I would think if the car had p0a80 and you replaced the battery, the problem lies in the battery. Not the inverter

    You should check all your wiring, make sure you didn't break anything. Also check the torque of the terminal nuts, 48 inch pounds.
     
    #7 JC91006, Jul 4, 2017
  8. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    You should check your 12v battery too, make sure it's fully charged. And when running, the 12v should measure around 14v.

    You went from changing the hv battery, to now an inverter. An extra diagnostic as the inverter can be bad now

    If a car dies while it's running, it's usually because the 12v is not being charged by the dc/dc converter.
     
    #8 JC91006, Jul 4, 2017
  9. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    I opened it and inspected it for preventative maintenance....cleaned some slight corrosion buildup off the terminals and copper jumpers. When I had the jumpers loose I measured voltage.

    When the ICE is running....should voltage across the hv terminals go up?

    And I have a brand new 12v battery. That was my first step in this process .
     
    #9 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
  10. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    I've never had to be bold enough to directly measure the hv battery while the engine is running. If I need live data, I would safely use my miniVCI and techstream. But there should be a voltage jump if it's charging.

    You should run some of the test I mentioned, as a new 12v does not mean is charged. You have to eliminate the simple things.

    How did you clean the corrosion? How tight did you tighten the terminal nuts? Do you still have your old battery?
     
    #10 JC91006, Jul 4, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
  11. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    Thanks for the info so far...

    I cleaned the terminals with a small brass wire cup brush on a drill. Worked great.

    And yes...bold and probably stupid.... yes, but I measured the voltage across the terminals and voltage dropped to 197 when the ICE engaged.
     
    #11 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
  12. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    You'll need to charge the hv battery before you can test more. It's out of its operating range.

    If the car will start,
    set your parking brake,
    press and hold the brake with one foot,
    put the car in drive
    and press the gas pedal all the way to the floor.

    This will force charge the hv battery
     
    #12 JC91006, Jul 4, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
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  13. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    Attempted force charge.....no luck. Ice shuts down with problem 3190.
     
    #13 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
  14. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    When you hear the engine spinning for a dozen seconds, and then giving up with a P3190, that means the engine never produced enough power to keep running on its own. That's why there wasn't excess power to put into charging the battery; the battery was being used to spin the engine.

    -Chap
     
    #14 ChapmanF, Jul 4, 2017
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  15. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    As described here is what's happening.



    I should note this prius is a 07 with 475000 miles. (original fuel pump). I have replaced just about everything under the hood including engine, trans, inverter etc etc etc. Car was running perfectly prior to getting the P0A80. 12v replaced, HV replaced, inverter replaced (I have a parts guy who gives me great deals). I want to hit 500,000 miles..it's personal!

    Getting P3190....engine issue. Maybe it's a fuel delivery issue? I just cleaned the throttle body with cleaner. I do have techstream software but have only hooked it up once and really not sure what to look for.
     
    #15 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
  16. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    Here is my forced charge attempt. Shutters horribly then dies.
     
    #16 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
  17. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Wow, this car has a lot of miles.

    Does the car have fuel? If you're not sure, you would need to add 5 gallons for the car to register it.

    If you've cranked the engine numerous times and it won't start, there maybe other issues. You would have to determine everything else you've touched is working properly.
     
    #17 JC91006, Jul 4, 2017
  18. popptj2001

    popptj2001 Member

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    Tks yes lots of miles. Has been a great car. I don't want to let it go yet..I added fuel up to half a tank. It does indeed start and runs great.....for short period of time....13 seconds in the above video.
     
    #18 popptj2001, Jul 4, 2017
  19. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Well you'll need to get that battery charged up, maybe you can ask Matt for a little help. He's at texashybridbatteries.com

    He's always providing helpful ideas and troubleshooting tips.
     
    #19 JC91006, Jul 4, 2017
  20. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    A Prius can always sound like it starts and runs great for 13 seconds—because MG1 and the traction battery crank it at about 1200 rpm, not the much lower rpm conventional cars crank at. When after 13 seconds the cranking stops and P3190 registers, that does not mean the engine ever started or ran.

    -Chap
     
    #20 ChapmanF, Jul 4, 2017
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