If the Prime (or Gen4) was the size of the Smart Car...

If they would have just allowed the Diesel Smart Car in the US like Canada. Oh well.

 

For better aerodynamics, you need a longer car. Being short is what hurts the fortwo and others on the highway.

 

cars that small don't sell well in the u.s., no matter how gussied up you make them.

 

They only sell when cheap. I've seen plenty of Sparks and Mirages, and I've seen a base Spark listed for under $10k.
Start/stop or a mild hybrid system might sell on such, but a full hybrid system will push the cost up too much.

 

Toyota already has Smart Car sized Kei, although it is actually made by Daihatsu. I am surprised to find out they even have 4WD. It's not hybrid, but it gets almost same milage as Prius C does. Toyota Pixis Epoch New 2017 Model in Japan | Import new Japanese cars, Land Cruiser, Dealer and Exporter

 

Being Japan only, any official fuel consumption numbers will be under the easy Japanese test cycles.

 

Yes, I know the Japanese fuel efficiency testing standard is lax compared to US. But for comparison purpose it is still useful. For example, Suzuki Alto, the best mileage Kei Car sold in Japan has 37.0km/ by Japanese standard which is the same value as Toyota Aqua (Japanese name for Prius C) 4th best milage hybrid car in Japan. Gen4 Prius has 40.8km/l by Japanese standard and is still the best milage car by small margin compared to other hybrid cars made by Toyota, Nissan and Honda. However, Toyota's Kei Car, Pixis Epoch has 35.2km/l mileage not too far behind of top rated hybrid cars, but cost less than 1/3 of Prius PHV (Prime) in Japan. I understand Kei Cars are not street legal in US, but they are available in Asia and Europe. If they are available here, I think I would love to try Japanese Kei Car.

 

The closest thing to a true kei car in the US market is the Mitsubishi i-MiEV, but ours is several inches larger in width and length than the actual kei version.

Also, the height of the ForTwo (and iQ) hurts mileage as well - tall plus truncated body equals shockingly high drag, and as a result, terrible highway mileage.

If you wanted a small car to get amazing mileage, you'd start out with a subcompact 4 seater, and have a Prius-like roofline, a lower, more reclined front seat, and no back seat. The result would be something like the Honda CRX, the original Insight, or the CR-Z (although somehow Honda managed to get terrible mileage out of the CR-Z despite doing that).

 

I'm sorry if I am too harsh but I always thought the SMART car was a stupid car. I remember when they first came out my son just came back home from Iraq and was looking for a cheap car. Back then he got a barebones new 2007 Chevy Aveo for less than a smart car. No matter what you think of the Aveo he got a 4 door sedan that could seat 4 people, had a trunk, air conditioning and got BETTER gas mileage than the Smart car for less money.

 

The US gas version. The Diesel version got 60-70 mpg.

 

I see your point. But for those who can't parallel park on street, the Smart Car maybe the heaven sent gift.

 

It wasn't clear from your previous post if a like to like comparison was in effect.

I would expect kei cars to do worse on the EPA test than the hybrids. their low power engines will have to work harder under those acceleration rates and speeds.

I think the CR-Z fault lied in trying to be fuel efficient and sporty at the same time.

The US fortwo was limited to one transmission and the largest engine available to it. Along with the diesel option, other markets can choose a manual transmission and smaller gas ICEs.

The smart was an answer for Europe's narrow city streets, not efficient highway cruising.

 

I think it is interesting that the only version of the Smart Car now sold in the US is pure electric. It gets more than 100 miles on a charge, costs less than $24K and is eligible for the $7.5K tax rebate.

 

That's because the ICE model wasn't selling, and Mercedes-Benz could use the EV credits.

 

You could say that again!

Actually Tesla did a pretty good job already of suppressing top-of-the-line sales.

Bob Wilson

 

Like this car? The coolest 25-year-old cars you can import to the United States in 2016 | Autoweek They can be a cool toy, but I wonder milage was as good as today's Kei Cars? Some of those Kei car must be in high demand among Kei enthusiasts, but I can't say I am that intrested in 25 years old car.

 

And, in Japan, the highest speed limits are 100 km/h - 62 mph - with strict enforcement (because they're all on toll roads). So, when you're about 20 mph slower than the highest speed on the EPA test, aerodynamics are less important.

The thing is, I feel that "sporty" doesn't adequately explain why it was so bad.

I think part of it was simply that the hybrid system wasn't very good, the chassis was too heavy (hurting city mileage), the engine wasn't as good as it could've been (they used a 1.5 liter Otto cycle engine, when they could've used a 1.8 or 2.0 Atkinson instead), and the drivetrain was either not efficient (CVT) or wasn't able to keep things at optimum efficiency (manual).

It doesn't get more than 100 miles, EPA rating is 58 miles:


2017 smart fortwo electric drive coupe

Considering that there were keis with carburetors not that long ago... yeah, I doubt that the efficiency is anywhere close to current keis. Also, a lot of them used 3-speed automatics instead of today's CVTs.

 

You are right about the range of the electric SmartCar. I looked at it on their website and it mentioned 108 MPGe in the city and 94 MPGe on the highway and didn't anywhere state the actual miles you could drive on a charge. So as a newby to this technology I assumed MPGe was a synonym for miles per charge. Still learning.