Beverly Hills bans plug in hybrids from public charging stations...

In this paragraph you are referring to the relative cost of the electricity the utility is having to buy, and not the amount of usage, necessitating an increase in price. If you are going to take the word of the power stations that they must charge more because solar is making their stations less profitable, and then you pay them the more the demand and pass it on to utility customers, then they are going to feel free to raise prices whenever they want. We saw clear evidence of this in the past. It's what they do. And as long as you cater to it by forcing the utility's customers to pay for it, then there will never be any innovation. Why change when you can simply charge more to a captive audience that has no alternatives other than to buy from the utility?

As far as the chart you posted, that chart is for TODAY. We are not in the summer months here. That is when the rolling blackouts occurred. The temperatures are around 70 degrees right now, and nowhere near as many people are running their air conditioners compared to the hot summer months. It is in those summer months that the rates during the utility-defined "peak" usage hours are highest (much higher than the peak usage rates at this time of year).

If you prevent the utilities from charging absurd rates with ridiculous policies, they will then have to figure out a better way to do things (perhaps including shifting hydro resources if and when that is possible). Let them charge whatever they want and manipulate when people use electricity and they will not innovate. They will continue with business as usual.

The thin facts you accuse me of relying on are based on living here for 25 years. I never experienced a rolling blackout in the very late afternoon or evening hours that SDG&E is now trying to say are the peak usage hours, so I know that is a bunch of bunk without looking at your graph. Now that I've seen it, I know why it is bunk (because it applies to today, a mild day that is not representative of the days on which power usage is a true problem). This all started with someone asking about the rolling blackouts and if they still occur.

I hope this self-described intelligent person has enlightened you.

 

I'll give you this: you probably think you are making sense.
Your argument boils down to this: if we set a low rate, they will figure out a way to satisfy us and remain profitable. Uh huh.

I'll tell you what is happening, though I cannot say if it is market correction that will mitigate your evening rates: the utilities are building large (IIRC 5-10 GW) amounts of NG capacity. To my ear it has the markings of a market correction, but the perverse built-in ROI on utility investments distorts the markets so I an unsure.

Anybody know ?

 

And you, no doubt, think you are making sense. I know what I am saying, and I know what I am saying makes sense. I'm not even sure what you're arguing, but you definitely want to argue it. I guess I finally got through to you on what the peak usage hours really are, and now you've switched to arguing something else.

Yes, if you tell utility companies that they have to get by with charging lower rates, they will economize. They must be made to suffer the consequences of not dealing with supply issues, or they will never do so. Why would they innovate if they can just charge more and manipulate when their product (electricity) is used to support their current setup? Necessity is the mother of invention. They have no competition. If this wasn't a monopoly on an absolute necessity, the market would exercise some control. There are so many analogies I could draw to other situations, but this has dragged on long enough.

 

I just want to clarify the new policy the new policy...There are 39 city run chargers with 59 charging ports in the 14 public parking lots and the Roxbury Park parking lot in Beverly Hills. This new policy only applies to the city run chargers in the city parking lots. It does not apply to the public accessible chargers located at commercial parking lots. A BEV using a space assigned to a charger must be connected to the charger with an active session. So the vehicle is being charged the 25 cents/kilowatt hour, and the per hour charge of $6/hour after the first two hours. The charging cord must be connected to the vehicle, and the charging session must be active. With the Chargepoint chargers, it is possible to unlock the cord from the charger, plug it into the vehicle, then unplug it, and replug it into the vehicle, to avoid payment. A BEV found to be doing this will be cited and possibly towed. Any Plug in hybrid EV is not allowed to use the chargers including BMW I3 with REX. A BEV using a charging port must be parked in the designated parking space. Parking in an adjacent space and using the charger is not allowed. Locking the charger to the BEV is also not allowed. Some of the city parking lots also charge a parking fee to be in the lot. A fully charged BEV is allowed to remain in the space as long as it is connected to a charger with an active session, being charged the hourly fee.

 

Thanks! Minor edits and maps to help explain what is going on:

. . . the new policy...There are 39 city run chargers with 59 charging ports in the 14 public parking lots and the Roxbury Park parking lot in Beverly Hills. This new policy only applies to the city run chargers in the city parking lots. It does not apply to the public accessible chargers located at commercial parking lots.

A BEV using a space assigned to a charger must be connected to the charger with an active session. So the vehicle is being charged the 25 cents/kilowatt hour, and the per hour charge of $6/hour after the first two hours. The charging cord must be connected to the vehicle, and the charging session must be active.

With the Chargepoint chargers, it is possible to unlock the cord from the charger, plug it into the vehicle, then unplug it, and replug it into the vehicle, to avoid payment. A BEV found to be doing this will be cited and possibly towed.

Any Plug in hybrid EV is not allowed to use the chargers including BMW I3 with REX (1). A BEV using a charging port must be parked in the designated parking space. Parking in an adjacent space and using the charger is not allowed. Locking the charger to the BEV is also not allowed.

Some of the city parking lots also charge a parking fee to be in the lot. A fully charged BEV is allowed to remain in the space as long as it is connected to a charger with an active session, being charged the hourly fee.​

Well that does it for me! No more coffee-coco at the Beverly Hills 7-11 that is 2,020 miles from Huntsville, AL.

Bob Wilson

1. For our 2014 BMW i3-REx:

• $1.80 - two hours of charging @$0.25/kWh, 40% SOC
• $8.70 - $2.70 - three hours of charging @$0.25/kWh + $6.00 parking fee per hour
• $7.30 - 2.3 gallons, @$3.17/gal premium gas, Gasbuddy

 

i actually like this policy. it is well spelled out, and hopefully enforced.

 

My guess is that they were built to act as base load, they require maintaining the water level behind the dam for future production, and those regions using it likely haven't invested heavily in other clean sources. Using them as a peaker plant may mean using fossil fuels at other times of the day.

 

And another plug-in hybrid owner snickers up their sleeve.

Bob Wilson

 

i may have a different outlook because i don't use public charging, but this policy is only for city owned spaces and they are not free.

 

We have a 40kW, high-speed, DC charger downtown. So when I run the traction battery down in the BMW i3-REx, 30 minutes and a $0.25 parking meter charge and I'm done. However, I usually put in $0.50 so I don't have to race the meter maid. That 30 minutes puts in up to 20kWh or $2 of electricity.

Bob Wilson

 

we're a long ways from beverly hills, but not beverly hillbillies.

 

How does that affect your opinion ?

 

if i needed public charging, i suppose i would be upset that they are not allowing phev's.

 

If a PHEV truly needed public charging, something has gone wrong.

 

i guess it depends on your view point. many phev drivers consider it a bev with back up emergency use only.

the fact is, it's up to authorities like those in beverly hills to differentiate, for better, or for worse.

 

"many phev drivers consider it a bev with back up emergency use only"

If they truly need to use a public charger means the ICE isn't available for that emergency use. So something is wrong.

 

Have you drive a Prius Prime or at least test drive one YET? Have you at least get a feeling how it feels when driving in EV mode compare to HV mode?

 

No, but driving in EV because you prefer it over driving with the ICE on isn't a need; it is a want.

Do you drive your Prime with no gasoline in the tank?

 

What's wrong with WHAT I want, nobody should decide for me what I want, not even the "Public Servants". When my vehicle has the capability to charge, then I have the NEED to charge my vehicle, is not up to anybody to decide what and when I NEED. This is "FREEDOM".

 

In the near future, am I going to be told that because I know how to cook, so I cannot go out to eat in the restaurant because I don't have the NEED?