Featured 20% of Americans say their next car will be electric

My mother got a whatever the C-RV Acura is recently. Father has a Mini Countryman, and brother a Jeep Renegade.

 

I like the idea of embracing the SUV movement, but holy heck that is a whole lot of wishful thinking though.

 

Well, the Bolt started out as a Sonic EV, but the platform of its crossover sibling, the Trax, was chosen as the basis for the production car because the extra height allowed more space for batteries.

 

I neither particularly agree nor disagree, but why do you say that?

 

Lots of things but she is saying the big problem with ICE vehicles is the humongous gasoline tank robs valuable cargo space which can all be gotten back using BEV. But that's the opposite of the truth....most BEV are way short on cargo space. For example Prime and that's not a full BEV.

If you knew nothing about BEV, now you definitely would want to run out and grab one to get mucho more cargo space.

 

(I don’t immediately recall what exactly she said along those lines, but gas tank probably not as much as the ICE itself. But anyway...)

I think she’s speaking primarily about EVs with the battery in the floor. The P.Prime lost a bit of cargo space because Toyota had to (or at least decided to) retrofit it into the existing Gen-4 design.

Teslas, even the smaller Model 3, have lots of cargo space.

On the Bolt, pretty much the entire space behind the back seat is cargo-carrying space. Unfortunately, there’s only ... what? 1.5-2ft ... between the back seat and the tailgate, so ultimately not much total cargo space. However, that’s not because the battery took up too much space.

The Volt is a different story, since its battery mostly gobbles up cabin space rather than cargo space.

I personally don’t know how the LEAF, Gen-1 or Gen-2, fares on the cargo space front. Presumably it would do better if they’d moved the power electronics out from under the hood, or at least compacted it a bit like on the BMW i3, to give the car a “frunk.” Potentially the same for the Bolt.

The Jaguar I-Pace looks like it’ll have oodles of space for both cargo and passengers.

 

Nationwide its a pretty good cut though.
April 2018 YTD U.S. SUV And Crossover Sales Rankings – Top 110 Best-Selling SUVs In America – Every SUV Ranked | GCBC

The best selling crossover/SUV larger than Rav 4 come in at number 5 explorer, then number 7 highlander.
I would not look at the old rav4 ev as a good sample though. More likely a phev version would sell better if there is not a total redesign for electrification. That's what ford is doing with the escape.

The model Y, probably due out in 2021 will likely be a huge seller.

Pretty silly ideas. Cars have been designed with fuel tanks in mind for a century. Its not a problem. The reason the prime doesn't have cargo space is because batteries were added on without really designing for them. The bolt has 3 cubic feet more passenger room, and 4 more cargo space than the sonic which was its base. You want more room, those battery packs make the floor thicker in cars like the bolt or a tesla, but they don't need to take passenger or cargo space if you design for them.

 

PHEVs have both an ICE and an electric motor plus all the supporting mechanisms. You won’t get much space out of them.
BEVs, that are well designed, will give you a lot more space.
It isn’t just the fuel tank. You also don’t need space for a muffler/exhaust system. Much less room for the motor/engine. The transmission is much, much simpler although I don’t know how much space that saves other than eliminating the transmission tunnel hump in the floor.

So yes, in general, a BEV can provide a lot more room for either passengers, cargo, or some of both.

 

Over time, batteries and charging infrastructure have and will continue to improve. As that happens, eventually we'll see sales steeply rise but that is not evident today. Only the Model 3 is leading the way. Happily the price-performance is getting there but has not yet arrived.

Bob Wilson

 

At least in some cases, price/performance isn’t all that far off, although that depends partly upon how “performance” is measured. A base-model Chevy Bolt or Tesla Model 3 isn’t “way off,” price-wise, a comparably-equipped ICEmobile. The ICE car in that comparison will (almost certainly) win with respect to range, but probably not with respect to acceleration.

Well, it’s an involved comparison; Not apples to oranges, but perhaps a red-apples to green-apples comparison.


iPad ? Pro

 

I’d say it has arrived, but only with regards to how much production capacity Tesla has, and GM is willing to produce.

As more companies get involved in EVs, and production can meet and exceed the demand at this price point, then price-performance will need to advance. Right now, the price of a Model 3 could be $2000 and it wouldn’t result in an more Model 3s hitting the road.

 

ok . . . . . but in the mean time ~ nothin' wrong for showing a bit o love for those willing to take the plunge on the over priced / glitch-ie X
.

 

Look at the prices of the desirable cars without tax incentives (state and federal). Then at the capabilities of the cheaper ones. Vast difference and with the commuter ICE cars so much lower in price and getting so much better MPG than maybe ten years ago....it is tough to buy one for economic reasons. Bolt battery recall, Leaf battery life, Tesla crash publicity, Tesla wait for teaser priced model. A home charger costs 5 years of my 2017 gas expenses! It takes real foresight to look beyond today's news to make the investment. And the willingness and capability to upfront cash. Plus the willingness to wait a year or so for some models. Talk is cheap. Lets see the demand.

 

A perfect argument untill gas stays over 100$ a barrel,
It’s been inching its way up, touching on 70$ now, five years ago at 70$ a barrel, a gallon at the pump was pushing 4$, things have a way of making a profit, Gas is a profit magnet.

But the big picture involves switching away from petrochemicals....

 

In our case, installing a home charger took just a few-hundred dollars, because we had an unused electric-dryer circuit we could heist. That may not be the case for others, of course.

Along those lines, here’s a thought, just speaking in general, not about your situation nor anybody’s situation in particular...

It’s easy to forget that your home charger does not need to be sized to your car’s battery. A car with a 60KWh battery doesn’t necessarily need a beefier charger than one for an 8.8KWh battery. You, most fundamentally, need to size your charger to how many miles (average) you drive per day!

 

I bought my 220V charger 6 years ago, when I had the PiP, so I'm sure it's more than paid for itself.

 

Purchase price is just one piece of the car ownership costs. Though, one many focus own, but once you factor in fuel, maintenance, insurance, etc. the ownership costs between the two are much closer, and may even equal out for some.

Exactly how cheap is your gas, or how little miles do you drive? With default settings, Fueleconomy.gov lists the annual fuel costs for a Prius v as $1050. A 64 amp EVSE from ClipperCreek is under $1000. Maybe you need a new electrician.

 

Sure, they’re certainly not at price parity yet, but the gap is definitely closing.

 

Fuelly says I drive 7k to 8k miles a year. My fuel costs have varied between $350 and $810 per year. Gas costs averaged over a year varied from $1.97 to $3.22. Currently $2.649.

To run a 50 amp line from my breaker box to my garage is about 50 feet and goes through 2 walls one of cinder block. My estimation is the initial costs of the installation would be $1k (cheap labor market). Now add in a 50 AMP charger with a timer (Time-of-Day billing).

I frequently make 50 mile door to grandkids events and then back with ad hoc extensions dictated by my grandkids and my purchasing agent. So I'm needing an EV that has about 200 miles of range on its best day because it is over 90 today and I'm gonna want the A/C. And one with minimal battery degradation over time. (This ignores any issues with charger availability on the longer trips I take. I can use my wife's car or rent.) So I'm into the $40k-60k range.

That is a lot of initial investment in a depreciating asset And it limits the audience for an EV. It also is money that is not available in my investment account that hopefully over my 10 years of typical car ownership will appreciate.

I'm an early adopter of lots of devices,and software and have bought more first-of cars than I can count. So I'm the ideal target. But not on the economics with no rebates. I could drive my current hybrid for 20 years before I came out even against an EV available today.

While other may not be in my situation, I've seen the differences between polling results and actual behavior, I've seen personally the difference between asking a person with spending authority what it would take in product content to make him/her buy and then asking for the purchase of that exact item. So my point is that 20% of people may say they would buy but ask them to put up the real/extra money and they may act differently. I wouldn't invest my money to build a billion dollar factory on that 20% figure.

Of course if gas prices rise significantly people may get religion.