Tesla's performance Model 3 delivers 3.5 second 0-60 for $78,000

Tesla's performance Model 3 delivers 3.5 second 0-60 for $78,000

What's the 60-0 time?

FWIW...I hope that the 3 sees commercial viability and I also hope that people who only have $30 kilobucks will be able to roll 'lectric if their situation allows for it.

Tesla's next problem will be what 5 and 10 year old Teslas look like to the 'every buyer.'

 

Stay out of their way. Lol

 

Actually?
For a 'lectric-car you want aggressive regenerative braking, which yields different braking profiles than a ZR-1.
My only concern for the OTA fix is that it looks VERY much like a 'Volksvagen' solution...

If GM tried that (very valid) software fix for the (very understandable) braking....ah.....calibration problem, then it would be time to drag out the pitchforks and torches.
In this case.....I'll take the myopia, because the EV technology is proving worthy....BUT(!!!!!!!) there are rocks and shoals ahead that are going to have to be carefully plotted.

Tax kickbacks are going to sunset.
A five year old Prius with 60,000 miles will have considerably different street cred than a five year old Tesla with 60,000 miles simply because the battery will have...what? 15,000 charge-discharge cycles?

Also...there are hidden supply chain problems (every car has them!) that will manifest themselves after 10,000 door slams....3500 potholes....5 winters and summers.....etc.
This is a PROBLEM for Toyota, GM, Volksvagen, etc.....but they have longstanding relationships with suppliers that are just now getting ramped up for the edgy upstart.
Remember the F150 production halt recently?

The judges are scribbling on their note pads (or consulting their bookies) to see who won Round-1.
I'm thinking so far that it's Elon............BUT......it ain't over!

 

YES! Personally I'm dying to see how good the 12-20 year old Teslas will be. Will they still be releasing software updates? Will they realize that if they don't, someone else probably will do it for them, for better or worse?

 

Read your own words. You weren't asking a question, you were making a statement.

i thought you were just asking a question. You are being obtuse. There are many people writing articles that want to see Tesla fail. It appears that some of the "writers" are being funded by the oil industry as "independent analysts". Nothing could be further from the truth. We are now living in an age where we are being manipulated by social networks, independent analysts, and in fact entire governments. Look no further than Washington, D.C.

Yes, there were a number of people who pre-ordered that jumped to conclusions like you have done. "Speculation" and "assumed" does not make anything a fact. Yes, there are a few people who say they have cancelled but there has been no verification of how many there are or if the even had a reservation to begin with! Some people are being manipulative for their own nefarious reasons. I can tell you that I placed a second reservation for a model 3, two years after the first reservation...........and I am willing to prove it if necessary!

Yes, Tesla is ahead of schedule for the model 3 because it was scheduled for introduction until 2019. Yes, the introductory model 3 that was rushed into production as a result of 500K pre-orders (Elon said he was expecting, hoping for, 100K) is about 6 months behind schedule in terms of meeting production goals. So yes, you are being manipulated by "nearly every single source you've seen."

You are brushing off my explanation of your criticisms. The issue is immaterial anyway because you have stated you are not a Tesla customer so it accomplishes little to attempt to address your criticisms. So to your point, "My point is that there absolutely are valid criticisms of how Tesla is handling the model 3 situation...among other things. And it puzzles me why they are always just brushed off by many around here" when "many around here" try to address your "valid criticisms" you interpret as being "brushed off." You have obviously made up your mind, so what are you trying to accomplish here on this sub-forum? I have made up my mind and none of your points have induced me to change it.

 

As a result of the recent OTA update, the stopping distance is less than 130 feet. When is Toyota going to send an OTA update to improve your Prius?

With 500K pre-orders you don't need to hope for anything. When was the last time Toyota had 500K pre-orders for one of their models...........at any price point?

Toyota's problem will be what a 5 and 10 year old Prius look like to 'every buyer' when the streets are flooded with BEVs?

My only concern is NOT doing an OTA fix looks very much like a 'Toyota' solution.

When are the tax kickbacks to the oil industry going to sunset? Kickbacks to the oil industry amounts to a subsidy to ICE vehicles as much as $10 kilobucks per vehicle. Elon said he would support the elimination of the EV tax credit since he believes that BEVs can and will compete on their own merits. Can an ICE vehicle compete on its own merits if their $10 kilobuck subsidy per vehicle is eliminated?

And what will be the street cred of the drive train and TCO be on a five year old ICE vehicle when the streets are flooded with BEVs?

Every one had to start someplace had to start someplace too.

And that is what is scaring the hell out of Toyota, GM, Volkswagen, etc., IT IS JUST BEGINNING!

 

better check that math ....
Drive 60,000 miles
250 miles between charges

250 divided into 60,000 miles

250 cycles?
Math isn't my specialty - but it looks like that 15,000 charges is just a teeny bit of hand wringing exaggeration .... by a factor of ~ 60.

& speaking of hand wringing ....

We've already found a couple entrepreneurial EE's who have successfully upgraded 60kW & 75kWh traction packs to 90's - WAY cheaper (25% less per kWh) than tesla's upgrade of 90's to 100's. 1yr warranty. Buzz words?
* aftermarket
* salvage yard parts
You don't HAVE to have a brand new passenger window .... door handle .... air bag module ... gear box etc, do you? Or maybe i'm just the only one who finds the cheaper needed parts? Think of all those idiot drivers crashing their teslas .... some see tragedy & others see surplus parts.
.

 

why would toyota have any pre orders when people know they can buy what they want most of the time?

 

When was the last time Toyota had a highly anticipated car? The clock is ticking waiting for an answer.

 

The Model 3 was announced to have a Supercharger standard. Many jumped to the conclusion that it meant free access to the Supercharger network.
Tesla/Musk might need to improve communications, but there will always be people that hear what they want.

Tesla botched the production ramp up, so it is taking longer for them to get to making the base trim. They are shipping cars sooner than what they stated when they started taking pre-orders.

With a GM, Toyota, or anybody else, most wouldn't know it was just a software fix because they would have to take the car to the dealer, where a technician would drive it into the repair while they waited up front.

There were waiting lists for the ben2 Prius where dealers were taking some amount for a deposit.
Is there any business that wouldn't want demand exceeding their supply, besides the like of ERs and blood banks?

 

2017

 

And what was that car, what was the amount of pre-orders, and what was the amount of the deposit?

 

no need for either, toyota customers don't have to worry about how long it will take to build a car, or if the company will be in business next year.

 

the reason tesla has preorders is because people know how long it takes to ramp up production. toyota (and most auto mpg's) don't usually have that issue, although they do make incorrect projections from time to time, no one can foresee the future.

 

Preorders are a way of gauging the amount of interested buyers, and also getting cash to launch the next step in some cases.
If Toyota has taken preorders for the Prime, they could have had a metric on where to ship non-preordered cars. Instead of ignoring some areas, over supplying others, and then having to offer deep discounts to move them.

We also need to keep in mind the dealer system in the US may not make preordering a viable option for the traditional car companies.

The number of people willing to put down $1000 to get in line for a Model 3 was astounding. This is a car that is in the entry level luxury segment, which is a high margin segment compared to what Toyota, Chevy, and Ford branded models go for.

The C-class and 3 Series are the 3's main competitors; under 80k sold a year.

400k preorders for the Model 3 is more than the number of Camrys sold in 2016. Toyota and the others noticed this, and wish they had products that can generate such demand. If Toyota brings a BEV here, it won't be because of China and the failure of hydrogen.

 

they might be the only customers they ever get.

 

What car are you referring to and how many have they sold since introduction?

And they might not be the only customers they ever get. I'm betting on the latter and the model Y SUV hasn't even been introduced yet, which will probably garner another 500K pre-orders.

 

think about what this means. Tesla; They botch communication, they botch quality, they botch inter design preferences, they botch delivery dates .... & their list of missing the mark continues. Yet the list of deposit holders not only runs out the door - it runs around the block, and out of the city. Who else gets away with all of that?!?
Then consider, not too long ago Toyota and other manufacturers were defending their stance that no one wants an EV, then they gave lists - of WHY no one wants them. That conclusion was reached, despite every RAV4 EV being sold or leased, all got snapped up - every EV1 getting leased got snapped up, etc. That should have been the industry's wake-up call for possible demand, because no other car was so popular that owners protested when they were taken back & crushed.
When did traditional manufacturers "see the light"? Only when their sales began to get crushed in the various competing segments.
The only remaining fail the manufacturers haven't yet even grasp is infrastructure. They want to leave it to others, to build fast Chargers out Nationwide. The cluelessness continues. It's so bad, that the cluelessnes will be defended .... even for not building charging infrastructure, the industry will rationalize, "oh - we didn't know what will become a universal standard" .... "oh - that's not our line of business" ... so ... they wait (sigh) & scratch their heads at the 400,000 member wait list .... all the while ignoring fir the most part that the plugin segment is growing much faster than regular hybrids ever did. That too, should have been another clue.
.

 

Good debate here guys...but I think we are 'beating a dead horse' at this point.

As for myself, I have concluded that Tesla and the Prius have vastly differing client bases...even with the introduction of the Model 3 ( at least until the '35K car' materializes ). And we can't really have an apples to apples compare until Toyota introduces a full electric vehicle.

 

prime. you asked for their last highly anticipated car. don't move the goalposts.