1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

$1 Gasoline???

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by wjtracy, Mar 6, 2020.

  1. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    55,413
    38,648
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Costco line ups, bare shelves, while nearby smaller retailer have plenty of stock, and gas stations sit idle. Lemming mentality.
     
    hill and Trollbait like this.
  2. noonm

    noonm Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2019
    575
    595
    0
    Location:
    NJ
    Vehicle:
    2018 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    No offense, but this is a bad idea right now. There are COVID-19 cases in almost all states (the only hold-out is WV, but that will likely change):
    Tracking Every Coronavirus Case in the U.S.: Full Map - The New York Times

    There is a very good chance that this is going to escalate in the next few weeks. I wouldn't travel anyplace where you don't have access to good medical facilities and/or wouldn't mind being stuck for at least two weeks.
     
    litesong, Trollbait and Mendel Leisk like this.
  3. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    55,413
    38,648
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Yeah I kept it zipped but was thinking the same thing. Eat at home, go for walks, cool your jets for a couple of weeks, see what shakes out.
     
  4. noonm

    noonm Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2019
    575
    595
    0
    Location:
    NJ
    Vehicle:
    2018 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    Yeah, those interested in the details can pop into the Coronavirus thread:
    Wuhan Coronavirus 2019 (COVID-19) | Page 39 | PriusChat

    tldr version: Late March, early April is going to be.......rough
     
    Mendel Leisk likes this.
  5. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    22,034
    11,506
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Which doesn't explain the price stability here.
     
  6. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 12, 2018
    7,135
    6,683
    1
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    2018 Prius c
    Model:
    Two
    Yep great time to get where you plan to be for the next couple of weeks. I just watched a lot of my business go up in flames; I'm off the road. Nowhere to go and nothing to do until mid-April at the earliest; probably June though.

    Meanwhile my wife just got called up for a 4-day trip, starting from an airport in another state. We are packing her (and the Prius) for the worst; we really hope domestic air travel is shut down before she actually goes anywhere so she can just drive straight back home without any community exposure.
     
    bisco likes this.
  7. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    108,678
    49,378
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    $2.50 on the jersey turnpike today
     
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    108,678
    49,378
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    bring wipes and mask, don't eat anything, don't touch your face. in fact, try not to inhale :p
     
  9. litesong

    litesong Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2011
    371
    122
    0
    Location:
    Everett, WA
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    If you can find less traveled hiking trails (maybe even off-trail), ya should be able to dodge coronvirus air. At least that is what I used to do on the hiking trails here in Washington state. Even drank from thousands of streams & never got sick.
     
  10. litesong

    litesong Active Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2011
    371
    122
    0
    Location:
    Everett, WA
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Ah.... the best way to avoid coronavirus..... die before you catch it. :p & :ROFLMAO:
     
    bisco likes this.
  11. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2006
    11,321
    3,590
    1
    Location:
    Northern VA (NoVA)
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    We wound down here yesterday sooner than expected, due parent outcry, schools abruptly closed etc.
    Had orig been planned for phase-in next week maybe.

    We tried to make the Biscos fill up in Virginia enroute from FL but we missed them. Can't believe New Jersey of all places.
     
    bisco likes this.
  12. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2016
    11,508
    14,109
    0
    Location:
    Tampa, FL
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    I just found a pretty informative pdf from the American Petroleum Institute listing gas taxes by state from lowest to highest. https://www.api.org/~/media/Files/Statistics/StateMotorFuel-OnePagers-January-2020.pdf

    CA is 79 cents/gallon total state and federal tax.
    PA is 77.1 cents/gallon.
    Down here in FL, it's 60.69.
    We're all well above the national average of 54.53 cents/gallon, but CA and PA are crazy!!. :eek:

    OK and TX are 38.4 and NM is only 37.28. 37.19 in MS. MO is just 35.82.
    38.41 in LA, 37.4 in AZ.
    AK is cheapest at 32.75 cents/gallon.

    It's quite a spread!
     
    litesong and wjtracy like this.
  13. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2006
    11,321
    3,590
    1
    Location:
    Northern VA (NoVA)
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    That good reference Jerry, I know.
    Keep in mind that is state-average total taxes and it includes local tax.
    So Virginia for example bifurcates into low tax rural, and high tax urban type areas about 50/50. Also some states (eg: CA) have started carbon taxes that are sent directly to the manufacturers to avoid showing the price added at the pump per gallon. .

    Probably close to 60-70 years ago, Congress banned gaso stations from showing the taxes on the gaso station receipt. So API is all we got public.
     
    #193 wjtracy, Mar 15, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2020
    jerrymildred likes this.
  14. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2015
    10,970
    8,853
    0
    Location:
    New England
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    I looked at the documents, but don't know if the number presented cpg (cents/gallon) is fixed number or the value can change as the price of gas changes. So, is it always 79cents/gallon in CA, regardless of the price of the gas being sold? I thought the gas tax is a percentage of the gas price we pay at the pump, just like sales tax?
     
  15. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2006
    11,321
    3,590
    1
    Location:
    Northern VA (NoVA)
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Some states have variable taxes, but normally the tax rates are calc'd each quarter or something like that so the number quoted by API is real life what is being paid that quarter, but the next quarter it could go up or down.
     
    jerrymildred likes this.
  16. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2015
    10,970
    8,853
    0
    Location:
    New England
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Thanks. But my question is not how the rate is set but Is the tax rate set at "cents per gallon" or "percentage of gallon price"? If is it a fixed cents, then as the price of gas goes up and down the tax amount does not change. But if it is a percentage, the tax amount would go up and down.
     
    #196 Salamander_King, Mar 15, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2020
  17. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    22,034
    11,506
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    "The Transportation Funding Act 89 of 2013 eliminates the fixed diesel and gasoline excise tax. State law requires the Oil Company Franchise Tax (OCFT) to be calculated on a cpg equivalent basis and certified annually by the state Department of Revenue(DOR). In no case shall the average wholesale price be less than $2.99 per gallon."

    Was about as much as I learned on how the rate was determined. Those are 2019 numbers. The 2020 numbers may have changed. Considering how they do it here, that is the minimum Pa charges.

    Federal taxes are a flat rate, but it varies by state. Most seem to be flat, or are like @wjtracy stated. The other taxes for California are a percentage sales tax, so it could vary as the price of gas changes.
     
    Salamander_King likes this.
  18. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2006
    11,321
    3,590
    1
    Location:
    Northern VA (NoVA)
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    I only know a little about Virginia but Va. moved to percent, floating amount, but still each quarter it is calc'ed as cents per gallon, so even though it is a percent, it gets converted to cents per gal and stays there for a quarter, if I recall.

    Now they did that in 2012 when they thought gaso prices would constantly increase, which of course the opposite happened. So we've been sitting at 17.5 cents floor ever since 2012. Some of the local gaso taxes had no floor on the 2.1% addon, so the gaso price decrease was still hurting revenues.
     
    Salamander_King likes this.
  19. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2015
    10,970
    8,853
    0
    Location:
    New England
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Thanks for clarifying. So for the Federal Excise Taxes (@ 18.4 cpg) is fixed for all states, but the rest of the tax may vary and change with the price of the gas. Now, I am thinking if the BEV use becomes predominant and if gov shift the taxation from the gas tax to electricity tax to cover the cost of maintaining roads and bridges, it may not be so unrealistic to think in some states, the price can get $1/gal gas and $0.3/kWh electricity.
     
  20. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    22,034
    11,506
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Perhaps, but I think it would be for a limited time.
    • The gas taxes in place won't be rescinded
    • taxes applied to electricity will effect those just using gas
    • oil production will drop with such a drop in price
    Right now, the current oil price is below what many fracking oil companies need to make a profit. if this continues, they will stop drilling, and production will stop, if they don't go bankrupt. It is the fracked drilling that allowed the US to become a net oil producer. Without it, the market will shift back to how it was before, and Russia and SA will stop flooding the market. Russia because they can't afford it long term, and SA because they need the profit to keep control of their population.

    I see your scenario going much the same way. Few oil fields can supply oil that cheaply long term. Most of which are outside the US, and also unfriendly to us.