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2005 rebuild

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by bithead2, Aug 6, 2020.

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  1. bithead2

    bithead2 Junior Member

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    The hybrid battery is good in this car (replaced awhile back) but everything else, engine, tranny, etc. probably needs replacing. I was going to scour junkyards for some good low miles parts. But if you were to replace everything what exactly would that be? The engine and transmission for sure, but what else? I think it will be a challenge to see if I can get it to 500,000 (it has 265K on it now). It barely starts and barely moves at the moment, it isn't drivable. Let me know your ideas on other systems I should replace while I'm at it. Should be good therapy. No, I don't need to be told it isn't worth it :). I'm doing this to learn something and have some fun problem-solving.

    Thanks, CJ
     
    #1 bithead2, Aug 6, 2020
  2. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    What are the OBD2 troubles codes (DTCs) that are causing the vehicle to "barely start and barely move"?
     
    #2 SFO, Aug 6, 2020
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  3. pasadena_commut

    pasadena_commut Senior Member

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    If the only good part of your car is the traction battery it might be cheapest to find a lower mileage car with a bad battery at auction and swap your battery into it. Then "everything else" comes in a nice convenient rolling package, probably for less than you would pay for all the parts separately, and it would be MUCH easier to swap the battery than the engine!
     
    #3 pasadena_commut, Aug 6, 2020
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  4. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    How do you know what's wrong? How much oil are you burining? What's the oil pressure? What's the compression on each cylinder? Have you done a leak down test? When was the last time you checked the valve lash? What about valve guides and seals? I suppose you already looked at the obvious like the PCV valve and such. Right? Are you aware of Toyota's having small oil passages to their oil control rings and how to go about getting the gum out of those? When was the last time you took the heads off and cleaned out the carbon from them and from the EGR system?
     
    #4 Isaac Zachary, Aug 6, 2020
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  5. bithead2

    bithead2 Junior Member

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    Great questions. Let me get to them all because these are really good. I just went out and started it in Park and ran a scan. No OBD codes from the BlueDriver. Even with some dash lights illuminated/flashing and even though I'm pretty sure the ABS controller is toast. So then I switched it into Neutral. Bad things started happening. Stinky smells, looks from the neighbors, the Triangle of Dread, etc. I ran another scan and got the attached (also attached some pics of messages and lights that occurred while in Neutral....note that black tape is over some of the lights).

    Isaac: The car burns a quart a month (or more, the last time I checked was awhile ago). But right now, judging by the smell, I'd say it has upped its game quite a bit. Anyway, where I come from using a quart of oil a month is a rebuild of everything especially with that many miles on it. :). I've never taken the engine apart to clean anything. Even if I fixed valve guides (assuming it isn't the oil rings) I'd still have a high-miles engine. And since I see used engines with 59K miles out there I'd rather have one of those than try to rehab a 265K mile engine. So Isaac, your points are well taken but this engine is a goner. Maybe it could be fixed, but I wouldn't be able to trust anyone to drive it anyplace. I'll look up the answers to the questions you posed though because that interests me.

    Pasadena_commut: Yeah, I think I could find one of these for cheap. I see 122K-mile cars out there for under $5K asking. One thing that occurred to me is to buy one of those and then I have a parts car. Pretty sure I can get a hybrid battery pretty cheap anyway now (greentecauto). I have the room, but not sure I want anything like that around.

    SFO: The codes are as shown in Neutral (none in Park). This car has been sitting for 4 months while I figure out what to do with it.

    CJ
     

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    #5 bithead2, Aug 6, 2020
  6. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Never used that app before, you may be missing some DTCs. A few around here like to use Dr Prius or the Torque app. Before trying the Dr Prius app, be sure to read this link and confirm that your OBD2 Bluetooth adapter is adequate : Hybrid battery diagnostic and repair tool for Toyota and Lexus

    Best of class for reading OBD2 codes (DTCs) would be a 'mini-vci' cable and a copy of Techstream, AKA dealer technician software.

    Try using the 'advanced search' (More...) feature, it will help you limit the results to just the gen2 forum(s) for a search like P0505, example : https://priuschat.com/search/201953653/?q=p0505&o=relevance&c[node]=3+22+87+68+56+21+49+91+12+54+13+85+14

    Here is the workup for DTC P0505 : https://share.qclt.com/%E4%B8%B0%E7%94%B0%E6%99%AE%E7%91%9E%E6%96%AF%E5%8E%9F%E5%8E%82%E8%8B%B1%E6%96%87%E6%89%8B%E5%86%8Cpdf%E6%A0%BC%E5%BC%8F/Repair%20Manual/04pruisr/05/2054m/cip0505.pdf

    If you've replaced the 12v recently or jump started the vehicle, the ECUs could have reset back to "default", which among other things means the vehicle is now looking for a clean(er) MAF/intake area. Try cleaning the throttle plate and the MAF. For the plate and throat I've used a tooth brush dipped in some vodka, which makes pretty quick work out of the build up. If spraying those areas with throttle body cleaner, then do it very sparingly, if at all. For the MAF you may want to use MAF cleaner (though not required : 100K maint - 2 ), remember that the sensors are delicate and even though I've dropped the MAF before (it still worked after) they shouldn't be touch or moved around.
     
    #6 SFO, Aug 7, 2020
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  7. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    Miles aren't necessarily a good indicator to engine life. A low mileage engine could have been neglected, abused, overheated, etc. Whereas there are well cared for engines that have lasted many hundreds of thousands of miles, even milliones of miles. What I'm saying is if you haven't run out of oil or overheated or such in your engine, it could be better off than a 59K mile engine that who knows what it has gone through.

    So the engine burns a lot of oil. It could very well be gummed up oil rings that don't let oil flow back and instead pump too much oil up past the compression rings up into the combustion chamber. If you start doing some frequent oil changes (every 3,000 miles) using a high detergent oil (I would recommend one that's 5W-30) and perhaps an "oil flush" during every oil change that might fix that problem. Then you probably also have a bunch of oil leaks that would need new gaskets and seals. But that may be all the engine needs.

    But that doesn't mean much without a proper compression test. If the engine has good compression and good oil pressure I'd say it would be worth a try to get the oil consumption under control. If you do a compression test and it's bad, then I'd say go ahead and look at another engine.

    But personally, if my engine is bad I'd rebuild it instead of looking for a low mile replacement. That way I'd know it was put together right and would be starting out with a brand new engine. But that's just me.
     
    #7 Isaac Zachary, Aug 8, 2020
  8. bithead2

    bithead2 Junior Member

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    Great responses Issac and SFO. I'll get a better scanner and sell the BlueDriver. It sounds like I need a better scanner to progress on this issue so I'll get on that.

    What I'm worried about is some major component like the tranny is bad, and if I'm going to pull that out then I'm going to change the engine. A low miles engine is attractive because I have more money than time right now. I agree rebuilding it would be fun, I haven't done anything like that for 35+ years.

    The 12V battery in this thing is out of warranty and a new one is $150 so I'll probably do that, but that isn't going to fix the smoke billowing out of the engine compartment. I've never had much luck rehabilitating oil control problems on engines, but that isn't likely to be causing the triangle of death either.

    Any idea why moving the tranny from Park to Neutral bring up the triangle of death and the scary message on the Info Center display? Are there other major components that might need replacing other than the hybrid battery, the engine, and the transmission?

    Thanks much, I'm off to do the brakes all around on the Toyota FJ!
     
    #8 bithead2, Aug 13, 2020
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