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Lithium -- for household batteries?

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by Stevewoods, Oct 14, 2021.

  1. Stevewoods

    Stevewoods Senior Member

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    Just pulled out a household clock that had stopped working and found that the two AA alkaline batteries had leaked.

    Not wanting to be sued by a multi-national corporation, I will not name the company, but their batteries were certainly not durable and I have had the same leaking problem with their "high cost" "highly advertised" batteries for the past few years.

    Yep, I gave them a pass for too long. I do not mind paying more for something that works as it should. I might expect leaking from a no-name carbon battery, but not multiple times from what most consider one of the top firms in the world -- Well, at least tops in the USA>

    So, Lithium. Thoughts about just switching to lithium for all household uses?

    Have done some research and keep seeing warnings that lithium cannot be used in all devices and to check the manual. Heck. I have lots of things where I have no manual and are so old probably could not find a manual.

    Is it really that big of an issue in terms of incompatibility?
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    the voltage may be slightly different, should be fine for a clock.

    i had cell leakage from a battery that sounds like durable, they sent me a check for $120.
     
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  3. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    In my experience, low amp device such as wall clock does the best with alkaline, in term of length before changing. On the other hand, high-power demanding devices such as flashlights or amplified speakers do better with rechargeable lithium batteries. Or, are you talking about lithium chemistry-based non-rechargeable AA batteries like the one below? I used them on several devices such as Bluetooth thermometer transmitter or IR remote control but did not find them to last any longer than cheaper alkaline in those devices.

    Here is a link explaining the different chemistry used for AA-size batteries.
    https://www.batteryequivalents.com/aa-lithium-batteries.html

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  4. Stevewoods

    Stevewoods Senior Member

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    I was an early adopter of rechargeable batteries and was "burned." Lots of issues, none of them worked long, low power etc. Having said that, that was decades ago....but the hurt still lingers.

    I am talking about plain lithium, not rechargeable....I do use rechargeable now, but only in one device -- a cordless phone. If they "misfire" it is no big deal as I have two old school "plug in the wall" corded phones that always work.

    Regarding no "extra life" with plain non-chargeable lithium, I would be fine with that if they DO NOT LEAK>>>>
     
  5. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    Chicken.
    I will not be intimidated.

    I have had TERRIBLE luck lately with Duracell Copper Top alkaline batteries.
    Some have leaked and damaged devices after only a year or so.
    Notice that NO battery company advertises "leak proof" like they used to.

    I am now using the "economy" brand of alkaline batteries....Rayovac, I think and they are working out much better so far.
    The ones from the pink bunny seem to be more reliable too.
     
  6. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

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    Well, it's perfectly normal for alkaline batteries to leak after being in a device for two long. No way you complaining about the brand is going to get you in trouble with them.

    Lithium rechargeables might be a good way to go but very expensive compared to a pack of cheap batteries at the dollar store...

    A couple years back I got tired of all the waste of cheap AA batteries and bought a charger and some NiMH AA batteries. That turned out to be a waste of money as these batteries were garbage, couldn't hold a charge very long at all compared to alkaline and after a year most of them couldn't take a charge. Maybe lithium will be more reliable? But prices compared to dollar store makes it not seem worth it, even though disposable batteries are wasteful.
     
  7. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

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    duplicate deleted
     
  8. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Over the years, I have used both Energizer and Duracell brand alkaline batteries in many devices, but the only time I have had a "leak" was when such a device sits in a drawer for years without being used. I don't remember encountering any leaking batteries in frequently used devices. But using cheap non-brand generic batteries may be a different story. Or are Amazon Basic alkaline batteries as good as or better than the top brands? Don't know. I've never tried them.

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  9. Stevewoods

    Stevewoods Senior Member

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    Yeah, normal to leak after "too long." But devices with my Amazon basics AA have gone longer with no leaks, no problem and the other guys ... well. And, seriously, many years ago, the batteries I am now having problems with were much more durable.

    So, why not go with Amazon basics. I could. But there are some critical applications that I NEED TO KNOW -- at least hope -- that the battery will be good to go and Amazon could switch their supplier at any time.
     
  10. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    We've been using the Amazon batteries at the office for a while now with pretty good results. I'm thinking of getting them for home next time we get batteries.
     
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  11. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

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    You've gone to the dark side... Amazon has way too much power and their monopoly is more powerful than the economies of most countries. They have access to data for 2/3rds of the world's consumer commerce and monitor all their clients sales activities and boost the charges against them if they don't support the Amazon monopoly. The anti-trust violations of this corrupt operation are legion... Classic taxation without representation by a rogue nation that thinks it can control the economies of other nations.
     
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  12. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    But now, come to think of it, I do have a few remote controls with the original battery included with the purchase. One is never heard Japanese brand AAA batteries that came with the remote control for a Sharp window AC unit. I think it is over 15 years old. The printed expiration date on the battery says "10-2002" but it still keeps going. Yeah, we don't use the AC remote that often, maybe a few dozen pushes in a season? Then it gets stored away in an unheated garage for the off-season. But this is at least one data point for a good result from a non-name brand alkaline battery.

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  13. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Not yet. I have not bought any Amazon Basic batteries yet... But now reading the comment by @jerrymildred I may try some next time. LOL;)
     
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  14. Stevewoods

    Stevewoods Senior Member

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    Yep, As I said, I have had nothing but GREAT experiences with the Amazon Basics battery. But, again, I have a few NEED to have the best applications....
     
  15. Stevewoods

    Stevewoods Senior Member

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    So, I guess the main thing I am looking for -- lithium less likely to leak. I do not want to destroy a $130 part because I skimped on a $2 battery.
     
  16. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    In the decade before my retirement, I did contract work designing and testing and qualifying battery powered devices in the hardware arm of a local company. I won't name it, but it is big enough that everybody has heard its name.

    Because of production volumes, alkaline AA batteries were acquired by the truckload, palletized. We used different brands in different products, depending on what deals the supply chain buyers arranged with the battery makers, often putting their logos on our retail packaging.

    All alkaline brands leaked!
    Energizer, Duracell, Panasonic, Sony, etc. The great majority of individual batteries didn't leak, but when using sample sizes of a pallet or larger, no one escaped leak-free. Other engineers did learn that certain end-of-life discharge patterns did greatly increase the leak rate, but avoiding those didn't eliminate leaks. Some even collected reports of fresh batteries leaking while still in retail blister packaging, though these did remain rare.

    I've been out of that work for a decade, so don't know if major improvements have happened.
    My dad's "atomic" wall clock won't work with an Energizer Lithium. Discovered that when someone else ignored the very clear labeling ( :mad: ) I put on some spares for an outdoor weather station (lithium has much better cold performance than alkaline) and shoved one into that wall clock. But at least it survived, and worked properly when an ordinary alkaline survived.

    An avalanche transceiver didn't survive a test with these batteries.

    I suspect there are numerous other incompatibilities. OTOH, our first digital cameras worked far better with these batteries, so do some single-cell flashlights.
     
    #16 fuzzy1, Oct 14, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2021
  17. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    That is a minuscule sample size. For more useful data, increase the sample size to a full pallet.
     
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  18. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Yeah, to use pallet size AAA batteries on our AC remote, will take a few hundred years... or longer. LOL
     
  19. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

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    Yes... Same... Sometimes I can't find things anywhere else but Amazon and have come so close in recent weeks to giving those evil-doers my money. Not yet... Have found if I wait a few months and try again I can find it on Ebay or elsewhere. Also there's Kindle... Pretty hard to get an Ebook that's not in that format.
     
  20. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    I have tried lithium batteries in the past and they didn't seem to last much longer than alkalines, at least not enough longer to be worth the extra cost.

    My GUESS on leakage is that the chemistry or packaging would be less likely to leak.
    But that is just a guess, based on the number of lithium rechargeables in use in things like phones.
    But that may not be a fair comparison.

    Looks like nobody here has enough experience with them to know for sure.
     
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