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My Prius dead again, with techstream this time.

Discussion in 'Prius v Main Forum' started by gromittoo, Oct 16, 2021.

  1. gromittoo

    gromittoo Active Member

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    Do you have the capability to reprogram the ECU with calibration data?
     
  2. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    I get
    Vacuum Switching Valve Assembly - Toyota (25860-37020).
     
  3. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    No, I don't. I will depend on my local dealer. But, having the part and installing it will defray the cost appreciably.

    If I can't drive it to the dealer, I'd have it towed and hand a copy of the TSB over to the service manager at the dealer.

    I would not have to pay for the diagnosis fee or the installation; only the reprogramming. It would also save me time and a second tow, which unfortunately you had to pay out of pocket. I have towing on my insurance.

    It would be about a 2 hour job, I guess.

    If the parts are reasonable, I like to purchase them as a pre-need type of cheap insurance.

    In an earlier post, you saw the full Prius v fuel pump and sender assembly that I got for $45 delivered off of eBay. Many of the used ones are tan colored from contaminants. The one I got is white and exceptionally clean as gasoline is cleaner in California. If I never use it, I can easily get more than I paid for it years in the future off of eBay. A new genuine Toyota unit cost nearly $400 even with the on line discount.
     
    #103 Georgina Rudkus, Oct 19, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
  4. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    cutaway of plate for Prius v.JPG
    There is no need to spend $200 on a cat guard. I got this one and modified for it for a Prius v by cutting off a 1x3 inch strip off one corner.

    CAT DEFENDER™️ 2010-2015 Toyota Prius Catalytic Converter Security/ Protection | eBay

    I even put some easily done bends over a 2x4 to get clearance, so it never rattles. 212305_IMG_1237.jpg
     
  5. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    I had never heard of that TSB before. Here it is on on NHTSA.

    I am kind of spoiled by recall paperwork, because when something is a recall, you can pull up the "defect information report" on NHTSA, which explains how they figured out the cause. I would love to be able to read that story for this! But alas, it is just a lowly TSB, so no published report there on exactly why it happens.
     
  6. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    Thanks again, Grom. I just placed an order for the purge valve.
     
  7. gromittoo

    gromittoo Active Member

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    I recall that my 2013 was purchased by its previous owner in October or November of 2013 in New York... About 96 Months ago. But at almost 103K, I miss the 80k mark.
     
  8. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    I would be very interested in any observable differences between the old and new purge valves (since we don't get a defect information report, so we get to guess what's really going on!).

    I'm having trouble believing the story is quite as simple as the evap system just "building up and releasing incredible pressure" as the tech described it ... evap system testers are carefully built to keep test pressures under half a psi, to avoid ballooning the fuel tank, which isn't really built or shaped like a pressure vessel.

    Clearly, it takes some "incredible pressure" to blow clamped hoses off nipples, but I'm thinking that pressure might have built up a lot more sudden-like, maybe when the purging air/fuel mixture got somehow exposed to a source of ignition.
     
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  9. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    I wonder if replacing the valve alone would make the car derivable, so it would be easy to drive to the dealer later to get the software update.

    If the valve is small and light enough, I might even put it in one of those plastic foam compartments in the back hatch area.

    I remember how my dad got a $20 fuel pump off of eBay 15 years, ago, when his 1998 Mazda MPV van reached 190k miles. When the fuel pump failed on the side of the road, he took it out and replaced it. In less than an hour, we were again on our way with no trip interruption. The pump's box was 2x2x6 inches and weighed 10 ounces.
     
  10. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Possibly just plugging the nipples on the manifold and the hose ends would make the car driveable to a shop.

    Or maybe reconnecting the PCV and plugging the purge-related connections.
     
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  11. gromittoo

    gromittoo Active Member

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    The new valve requires new firmware in the ECU. You can't simply put the new valve in, and have it work.

    In the video of the Car Care Nut that you posted earlier, it shows him replacing the EGR as part of a TSB. At the end of the video, he uses Techstream to download new data into the ECU. Both have to be done at the same time.

    The problem that the dealership has is getting the new part. I was told if they can get it from Partznet tomorrow, I can have it tomorrow afternoon. Otherwise it might be Thursday.
     
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  12. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    I understand what you mean. I'm think that, although not ideal, the car can be driven to the dealership with the new part installed immediately afterwards for the software upgrade. The upgrade apparently is only available with Techstream connected to the Toyota network.

    In order not to interfere with your order, and so you can get your car fixed as soon as possible, I ordered mine form McGeorge Toyota of Richmond, VA.

    Check out these videos;



    This one is in Spanish. I understand Spanish. Even if you don't the video is helpful.

     
    #112 Georgina Rudkus, Oct 19, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
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  13. Raytheeagle

    Raytheeagle Senior Member

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    Ah a good dealership and where I bought our old 2010 from:):

    A8FF05DC-5DFB-4875-AA11-205F7BFA6EBB.jpeg 21764CAE-9B2E-4696-A721-70A5FAE60F39.jpeg

    Online parts department seems top notch ;).

    Some north of the 49th parallel even recommend them(y).
     
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  14. gromittoo

    gromittoo Active Member

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    I was thinking the same thing. Make sure the PCV hose is connected, and disconnect the hose on the gas tank side of the purge valve. The Check Engine light will come on for Evap, but should be driveable.

    As I think more about this, the stranger the EVAP system on this Prius must be. On a Chrysler EVAP, the purge valve is pulse width modulated to pull a constant slight vacuum while the engine is running. It closes when there is no vacuum from the engine. At the far side of the Charcoal canisters, there is a vent that is always open to the atmosphere, (except during the EVAP test cycle, then a solenoid "vent valve" is closed).

    Since there is a vent to the atmosphere almost all of the time, the Chrysler system can never build up pressure. If the engine is running (and no evap test is running), it pulls air from the atmospheric vent, through the charcoal canisters (and taking gas vapors with it), through the purge valve, to the engine. When the engine is off. the purge valve is closed, and any pressure buildup in the gas tank is released through the charcoal canisters (where the gasoline vapor is trapped), and the pressure is then released to the atmosphere.

    During an EVAP test, my van first shuts off the purge & vent valves (active closed). A vacuum pump pulls a slight vacuum on the system, and waits to see how long the vacuum holds (slight simplification).

    This huge blast out of the my Prius EVAP has me thinking that there is no atmospheric vent in it EVAP system (or that vent is broken). When I started my car on Saturday, there apparently was a huge pressure buildup on the gas tank side of the Purge valve. When the car went to purge this pressure, it released the pressure all at once, and blew both hoses, causing a major vacuum leak. Also, the engine ran like it was in a death rattle. This totally closed EVAP system sounds kind of poorly designed.

    I am thinking that the new part can be made to open slowly. This may explain the need for updating the ECU to control a different type of valve.

    I can't make sense of what happened during the first incident, that included the loud bang. I had been driving the car for at least two hours when that happened.
     
  15. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    There would be DTC codes , but since the tank is over pressured, maybe cracking the fuel tank cap might relieve the pressure and all the car to be driven until the evap valve is replaced and corrected.
     
  16. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    and yet......no information as to why shortwave highest value is only 1.5 volts? or is it 1.25 volts....or jumping in between?......
     
  17. gromittoo

    gromittoo Active Member

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    That could explain the bang on the first instance. Maybe the new part has some sort of explosion preventer built in. I do think it odd that the purge hose is so big. On my 3.3 liter minivan, the purge lines are much smaller, and longer. Can't come up with a reason for such a big hose on the Prius.

    This has me asking "why now"? I am wondering if the charcoal canisters are damaged as well.
     
  18. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    The charcoal canister would be damaged if it was filled with liquid gasoline. That's why one should never top off the tank.

    Until I learned that it's not something that one should do, I was guilty of topping off the tank.
     
  19. gromittoo

    gromittoo Active Member

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    I asked the SM that question. He gave me a glazed eye look. Maybe that is the source of ignition @ChapmanF alluded to.
     
  20. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Can't think of any way for that to be it.

    The Short Wave value may just be some other, unrelated issue this car also has.

    I know the manual says it should be at least 4 volts, but there might be something more to the story, if it was below that in a freeze frame but the car has not elected to log P0AA6. I maybe wouldn't sweat that question just now.
     
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