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replace head gasket or the entire enginee

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by field_catcher, May 21, 2022.

  1. field_catcher

    field_catcher New Member

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    Hi Folks,

    I have 2011 Pricus. Past Thursday, the engine light went on, and the car sputtered when driven at certain speed. Took it to dealership, Initial report "Check Engine Light Diagnosis - Performed health check and found code P219A bank 1 air fuel ratio imbalance and P0303 cylinder 3 mis¦re detected. Viewed data list and con¦rmed active mis¦re on cylinder 3. Additional diagnostic labor is needed to remove windshield cowl to access spark plugs. ". then they did compression test and used camera to look inside, they confirmed the head gasket were blown.

    The solution they propose is to replace entire engine with a used one, cost is $6,900. The reason to replace the engine instead just the head gasket is, according to the dealership, the cylinder block metal is too thin to machine for Gen 3.

    I searched online, it seems people do replace the head gasket for Gen 3.

    So I am little bit confused. Does anyone have the same experience?


    Thanks.

    George
     
  2. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    Dealers are more likely to partially or completely rebuild a lower mile engine for reliability and a guarantee. But we don't know what your mileage is or if you have used sealer or other shade tree remedies. We don't know if it burns oil or has been overheated, a sure way to warp an aluminum engine. Realistically you have to tear the engine down to determine if warping or cylinder scoring is an issue. Some dealers don't want to put in ten billable hours just to tell you half of those are wasted because the block or cylinders are damaged.

    In most Cali locations you can get a head gasket or a head gasket with a machined head at known independents. Some as low as $1600. Since you don't trust us enough to share location we can't be specific. Of course trust works both ways. The site does not trust new members to post without moderation for at least five posts.

    So it may take awhile to see any of your clarifications.
     
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  3. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Where are you in CA? If you're in SoCal, you can get a used engine installed for $3k to $4k. $6900 is crazy money for used gen 3 motor
     
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  4. field_catcher

    field_catcher New Member

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    Thanks for the reply. What you explained makes sense (dealer doesn't want to tear down the engine to find parts other than gasket are damaged too).
    I am in SoCal. the car mileage is 97K. I am not sure how not disclosing the location is related to trust.:)
    Thanks for the help.
     
  5. field_catcher

    field_catcher New Member

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    yes, I am in SoCal. I have been to the dealership since I bought the car, all were regular maintenance and some brake replacement. I trust them but due to their nature high overhead, for repair work like this, the price probably is higher than independent ones. $6900 is a lot of money, I will look around to make sure I am paying what I should pay.
    I googled and find some independent garages specializing in prius. I will give them a call on Monday.
    Thanks for the help.
     
  6. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    That seems to be the dealership "line"; I've heard the "Car Care Nut" (Toyota Master Mechanic with YouTube channel) say similar, that machining the head and/or the block will reduce the distance between camshafts and crankshafts, enough to upset timing. Maybe more knowledgable mechanics here will weigh in on that. @The Critic had a machine shop "go over" his head, not sure if that involved machining.

    Anyway, there's a couple of links in my signature regarding head gasket repair, maybe have a look. One is the @The Critic's thread, his head gasket saga.

    ALSO: get your Exhaust Gas Recirculation components and intake manifold (has EGR passages as well) cleaned, or you'll likely blow another head gasket in short order. More info in my signature, first link.
     
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  7. BiomedO1

    BiomedO1 Senior Member

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    IMHO;That's the cost of a rebuilt exchange or crate engine. What kind of warranty are they going to give you and how do you know that the replacement isn't as bad as your current engine. Low mileage used engines in these cars are like a needle in a haystack. The guy who sells the used engine can say it's only has 25K miles on it; but it could actually have 325K miles on it. Who knows, unless you can turn-on the car and read the odometer - highly unlikely after a crash...

    This is what I found, doing a quick search: https://karking.com/listing/rebuilt-2010-2015-toyota-prius-1-8l-2zrfxe-longblock-engine/
    I'm a bit of a cynic; but I would rather eliminate as many unknowns as I can; if I was going to spend that kind of money. At least you know there's new gaskets and the entire engine has been inspected. No twisted or bent rods and uniform compression across all four cylinders. As Mendel said; make sure the EGR system gets cleaned out - otherwise you'll just be throwing your money away.

    In the future, use repairpal.com to validate repair estimates.

    Hope this helps
     
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  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i would have to have a lot of confidence in the rest of the car to spend that kind of money, and have to be very sure i'm getting a low mile engine so i could get a few miles before the hg blows again.
     
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  9. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    Some people are seriously paranoid. You still did not address all the questions to get the best direction. Try Gasketmasters or Hybrid Pit.
     
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  10. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    Machining the block or cylinder walls on a warped or scored aluminum engine rarely succeeds. The head will take a small amount of machining.
     
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  11. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

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    Unpopular opinion :

    Hi all, new Prius v owner | Page 12 | PriusChat

    Frankly, the car isn't worth enough to me to do a full head gasket job...especially since we have three other vehicles in the 'fleet'.
    And trust me...I'm still super skeptical. However, the car is going strong and made it through the winter. We'll see what happens this summer.
     
  12. field_catcher

    field_catcher New Member

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    Thanks for all the replies. @rjparker @JC91006 @Mendel Leisk @BiomedO1 @bisco
    The comments are much appreciated. I am not a car DIYer as you probably figured out. I am a hardware engineer in wireless communication.
    Here is some more info on my car, and based on everyone's input, the course of actions I am going to take.

    1. The car has been regularly maintained in dealership since the purchase, It only has 97K miles. no problem so far except this one. I have been happy with their service.
    2. The value of this car is around $15,000. If I can spend a few thousand dollars (hopefully much less than $6.9K) to let it last for another 5 years, it is still worth it.
    3. In last Dec, the engine light went on from time to time for a week, but I felt no difference in driving. It eventually went off until last week. In retrospect, I should have had it inspected.
    4. Last week, it first started to sputter in midst of driving. The next day, it started fine without any knock, but still sputtered when being accelerated. After reaching the normal driving speed (~60 miles), it is smooth again.
    5. The dealership charges $190 for initial diagnose and then another $570 for further diagnoses. I am not sure if they just did compression test and camera or physically tearing down the engine, I would think the former.
    6. On the phone yesterday, the service coordinator suggested to replace the engine ( they found nothing else was damaged, but from their experience, GEN3 is very risky to be machined) and initially quoted $7.9K for engine replacement., then $6.9K after discount. As it was weekend, they hadn't contacted the used part vendor yet, so I am not sure how certain the quote is without knowing the exact used engine (I assume the prices varies with the used engine's mileage).

    Here is what I plan to do:

    1. I am going to the dealership tomorrow and clarify a few things: a. what kind of inspections have been done. b. to confirm from their finding, nothing else was damaged. c the final quote once the used engine is found.

    2. I will call two independent shops. As I am in San Diego, the nearest Gasketmaster shop is 100miles away, I am not sure if it is feasible to send my car there. I found two local shops nearby. Based on what I read online, they are experts on Prius too.
    sdhybrids
    escondidoautopros

    I will ask them (a) if nothing else is damaged, can they just replace the gasket? (b) how much is cost? (c) how much is the cost if the engine has to be replaced?
    If the answer to (c) with comparable used engine is much less than the dealership, that alone is enough for me to send my car to them and hope the answer to (a) is yes and the answer to (b) is less than answer to (c).

    Any comments?

    I appreciated all the inputs. I probably won't have much knowledge to contribute this wonderful community, but I will do my part to contribute to the greater community with the skills I have.

    Thanks,

    George.
     
  13. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    You should have a shop source a Japanese JDM engine for you, these will have a lot less miles than US car engines. It won’t cost more either
     
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  14. field_catcher

    field_catcher New Member

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    thanks for the suggestion.
     
  15. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    I have a shop locally that I work with and does all the work on my Prius. They are located in Rosemead CA. They can source the JDM engines for you and install
     
  16. field_catcher

    field_catcher New Member

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    Thanks for the information.
    Today I found a local shop here in San Diego that will do the motor swap with a JDM engine about 60K mileage. The total cost is $3500. half of the price from the dealer. I will keep you updated after I pick up the car tomorrow.
     
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  17. dctalk523

    dctalk523 Member

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    Get in contact w/ the hybrid pit shop in Buena Park
     
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  18. field_catcher

    field_catcher New Member

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    thanks, but it is 80 miles away from where I live.:cry:
     
  19. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    It wouldn't be a bad idea to contact Hybrid Pit and see how much they can do the service for. Even though they are 80 miles away (it's a free tow with AAA gold membership), they are really specialists with the Prius hybrid. You can rest assured that they will do what is right for your car.

    Sometimes closer and more convenient may not be the best choice when it comes to hybrid cars.
     
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  20. AzusaPrius

    AzusaPrius Senior Member

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    I believe I drove 90 miles to Hybrid Pit.

    Only shop I would trust touching the Prius.

    Got a fresh rebuild from them with updated Pistons/Rings.

    You can also save some cash using my code "azusa" on their website.

    hybridpit.com
     
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