2023 Prime ?

Used car prices are certainly still at their peak where I am in Ontario Canada… on Autotrader, I see 2018 Primes with nearly 100k KM (!) selling for a bit *more* than brand new MSRP; also see several 2021ish vehicles (with low mileage) listed for low $50k-ish… that almost 50% markup over new MSRP (brand new price after rebates in Ontario is $31k -$36k) for a USED car. Insane.

But I digress…

 

They'll be launched within a three month window like the NX and RAV4 PHEV. Bestcarweb.jp reported it'll focus on power like the NX 450h+ and RAV4 Prime and not efficiency which is a head scratcher because the NX 450h+ and RAV4 Prime are still closely efficient to their hybrid brothers. Here's the google translation:

"The Prius PHV has long been a selling point for its large-capacity battery, but the new model pursues overwhelming power performance like the RAV4 and NX. Therefore, there is a high possibility that the RAV4 PHV system will be installed."

Yeah right. A 2.5L Prime setup with an 18.1 kWh battery? Just how big is this thing going to be? Maybe they'll use it to start a prime version of their other small models like the Camry, Corolla, Corolla Cross, C-HR. Perhaps the 2.0L and if they can shrink the 18.1 kWh battery to the same size as the current one? Possible as the current battery is currently 5 year old technology and has a lot of wasted space in the packaging.

 

Apparently, the Toyota used car prices are still on an up trend. Other cars are either at the peak or starting to drop a bit.

Source: Used Car Price Trends - CarGurus

 

While the Rav4P is close in efficiency to the hybrid, it is also the fastest Toyota available. It's hardware may even be the same as the hybrid's, with the performance increase coming from the bigger battery and software tuning. A performance Prius Prime could just tuning the system to make more power at the cost of maximizing efficiency like the default Prius tune. No need for a bigger engine. A bigger battery alone can give a performance boost. That's pretty much all the other power PHEVs on the market did.

The packaging of the PP's battery is a kludge. The engineers were told they needed to increase the battery size for range, and not given enough time to do it properly. Part of the bulk it takes up comes from ducting for the air cooling. With better cooling and enough time, they did a much better job with the Rav4P. The current PP has a smidge longer wheelbase than the Rav4.

 

In the LA–OC area, the trade-in value of Prius Prime has increased by $9,400 in comparison to last year's, a used Limited trading in for $37,000. Therefore, if you own one, it's more profitable than ever to trade it in with a new one, even with no tax credit at all. However, it is very difficult to find one at MSRP here.

 

I have ordered a 2023 Prius Prime Upgrade, on speculation that the 2023 may provide better styling and greater power and EV range. I have no idea when the 23s will be delivered or what improvements, if any, will be made. However, the used car trade in combined with Federal and Provincial rebates make it a good value proposition. Living in Victoria and with my driving needs, I hope to do about 90% of my driving in EV mode.
Hope we get some definitive news on the 2023 soon.

 

Yesterday, CarMax quoted me $34,400 for my 2021 Xle w/6000 miles in the Chicago area. This is ~$3300 more than its MSRP (incl destination), and ~$9000 more than I actually paid for it about 1.5 years ago (excluding taxes, fees and the federal tax rebate). I don't know if this is higher or lower than a few months ago, but it is still crazy high imo.

 

Same for me. Here in Ontario, I put a deposit on a Prius Prime in May, and was told it was a “6-8 month” wait list, which I figured should be good timing for around when the 23’s would be available (or at last know details by then)… but realistically I also expected it may likely be much later than they told me (probably ~spring?), depending how long the 23’s take to arrive.

Assuming this news about production halt is accurate, getting a 23 rather than 22 is almost guaranteed at this point. I just hope it won’t be TOO long….

Committing on a car without even knowing the look, features or price is weird, but the deposit is fully refundable anyway, should I change my mind for any reason, so no risk.

 

This was just in today from Motor Illustrated:

A new redesigned Prius with AWD and a combined 194 HP ( from the Corolla Cross ) is coming in 2023.

The second generation Prius Prime is probable for 2023.

Sorry I can’t post a link or copy a quote as I am a new member.

 

Here is the URL that Prime Minister referenced:

https://motorillustrated.com/toyota-2023-lineup-models-and-changes-overview/103202/

Doesn’t say much more on Prius beyond what was mentioned, but also provides updates on the entire Toyota lineup.

Having a significantly more powerful powertrain such as suggested would do wonders for the Prius reputation, and in typical Toyota fashion would likely still achieve similar fuel economy.

Looking forward to Toyota eventually releasing some official details!

 

This says a whole lot of nothing....I've reached out to a dealership sales guy who has a business associate working directly at Toyota. ON Monday he is reaching out to him to find out what the story is with 2022s and when the 2023 will actually start being produced. The dealership don't know anything so I find it difficult to believe that Toyota has already stopped making 2022s and won't be making the 2023s until 2023.

 

I heard back from the sales guy with a source at Toyota. Yes, there will be a trickle of remaining 2022 coming off the line but then it should be a fairly quick start up of the 2023 which will not have major changes. He indicated barring any covid shutdowns or disasters, there shouldn't be more than a month delay between 2022 and 2023 allocations.

 

My buddy who sells Toyotas convinced me in March to order a new Prius Prime and trade in my 2019 – I hadn't followed the story on used prices.

Decided to get the "big daddy" tech package, as he called it. Happy to wait an extra couple months if it means getting the 2023, but I hope that's all it is.

 

Well now bestcarweb.jp now says the new Prius will be launched in December of this year.
新型プリウス12月下旬!!　来年のトヨタの新型車戦略はどうなる??　ほか 国内メーカー最新情報取って出し!! - 自動車情報誌「ベストカー」

Here's a translation of the meat of the article:
"
■ Toyota expects to launch the next-generation Prius in late December this year
　Toyota seems to be adjusting the schedule in the direction of a full model change of the Prius in late December this year. In addition, the plug-in hybrid Prius PHV will be renewed at the same time.

　The next model will adopt the more evolved TNGA platform, and the power unit will be equipped with an improved 1.8L hybrid.

　Production of the current model has already been discontinued, and pre-orders for the next model are expected to begin in late November."

Dimensions on the New Prius Old Prius in red are as follows:
length: 4550mm (179.1 inches) 4575mm (180.0 inches)
width: 1780mm (70.1 inches) 1760mm (69.3 inches)
height: 1415mm (55.7 inches) 1470mm (57.9 inches)
wheelbase: 2750mm (108.3 inches) 2700mm (106.3 inches)

Exterior resembles the Crown according to the creative311.com website. No information on the Prius Prime yet but some information may leak out late October. So it'll be wider but not as long with height about the same as the Corolla. The wheelbase is longer than the Rav4 so the wheels are pretty much placed at the corners with emphasis on interior room. It should be a nice riding stable platform if true. May be delayed but only to January. Again no new info on the Prime but supposedly it will be released with the new Prius. All current orders for the current generation have been suspended.

 

i thought gen 4 was tnga

 

It is. I think they are referring to a more evolved TNGA (in their translation) that went from one that the Prius started to the new GA-C which is still TNGA.

 

Could also mean they are using the eTNGA.

 

I was also thinking that.

 

thanks, i had never heard of that. i wonder if it will allow for better battery placement