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Computer powers up but won't start - main display and radio go dark

Discussion in 'Generation 1 Prius Discussion' started by Rustbucket Prius, Sep 29, 2023.

  1. Rustbucket Prius

    Rustbucket Prius Junior Member

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    2003 Prius, has previously been flaky and parasitic drain on 12V battery, I disconnected battery and it has sat idle for a few months.

    Connected via jumper cables to another car, computer powers up, I get red triangles (not unusual, they have been intermittent).

    But when I try to start the car, it won't start and the main LED display and the radio both go dark. The dashboard lights remain on.

    Releasing the key, the main display reboots and the radio comes back on.

    Video is here if that's helpful:


    Any insight appreciated, it's a high mileage car but trying to keep from scrapping it.
     
  2. ammdb

    ammdb Active Member

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    Initial thought is the 12V battery, even when jumped from another car, isn't providing enough voltage to start the car. When trying to start, the power needed to close contractors in the main HV battery draws down the 12V until it's two low for the screen.
     
    ronlewis likes this.
  3. Trombone

    Trombone Member

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    You say the car sat idle for several months. The traction battery that starts the engine has run down and can’t produce enough voltage to crank the engine. The 12v hookup will still light up the display. You’re gonna have to get the big battery recharged, if it isn’t completely dead after sitting so long. You may be SOL.
     
  4. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    Likely this.

    BUT the 12 V system needs a thorough test BEFORE delving into the hybrid battery.

    IF.....the onboard 12 V battery has a shorted cell or two, it can drag down the
    jumped battery too. And might result in SMOKE if left connected too long.
     
  5. Trombone

    Trombone Member

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    Perhaps. Disconnect the old 12v and jump directly into the battery connections. If car gets “Ready,” then you have your culprit.
     
  6. Trombone

    Trombone Member

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    Also, of course, if you do manage to get the car "Ready," and if all systems are functioning properly, the traction battery will be charging as long as the ICE is running. (One way to keep the ICE constantly running is to activate the MAX a/c button.) And you do need to check out that 12v battery, as previously noted.
     
    #5 Trombone, Sep 30, 2023
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2023
  7. Rustbucket Prius

    Rustbucket Prius Junior Member

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    Thank you for the replies...

    I am jumping directly to the battery connections with the old damaged 12V battery disconnected.

    It seems like it's getting plenty of 12V power -- pumps whirring, headlights are bright if I turn them on -- and the other displays or overhead light don't dim when I turn the key.

    Are the main display and radio are on a separate "starting" circuit that might be getting shorted out for some reason when I turn the key?

    I could move the battery over and try connecting directly as best I can (wrong battery terminal posts). Or I could replace the battery (again) for about $75 if that's worth a shot. I had previously retrofitted the 12V battery/wiring to a 35Ah AGM threaded terminal battery.


    I initially also suspected the high voltage battery, but would this strange behavior be consistent with that? Any way to easily check if the high voltage battery still has charge?
     
  8. ammdb

    ammdb Active Member

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    Looks like the HV battery is charged.

    upload_2023-9-30_19-1-44.png
     
  9. Trombone

    Trombone Member

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    Seems rather late to bring this up, but have you done diagnostics, I.e., pulled any trouble codes, and if so, what are they? Or have I missed something?
     
  10. Rustbucket Prius

    Rustbucket Prius Junior Member

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    Got my flakey ODBII Bluetooth device to work just now wiih Dr. Prius app.

    Clicking "Read Battery Errors" and "Read Engine errors" both didn't return anything. I assume with the battery being disconnected for a long time any historical errors would be gone.

    Also shows this for battery monitor... a lot of red which I assume isn't good, but shows 59% charged?
     
  11. ammdb

    ammdb Active Member

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    That's no good at all. Not all the features of the Dr Prius app work on Gen1's, but it's still able to read the pack and blade voltage. Blade nominal voltage is around 7.2V, so the pack should be around 274V, not in the single digits. Not sure why the SOC still looks good.

    This is how it looks on my '01 with the ignition on before starting the car. Note, the app does not read the 12V battery voltage.

    upload_2023-10-1_8-47-13.png
     
    #10 ammdb, Oct 1, 2023
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2023
  12. JohnPrius3005

    JohnPrius3005 Active Member

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    Build yourself a “grid charger” - it’s cheap and easy - and charge the traction bat.
     
  13. Trombone

    Trombone Member

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    Looks like I nailed it on my first post in this thread. So if this were my car, I'd look into replacing the traction battery from one of the outfits that will install it in your driveway. Do an internet search.
     
  14. Rustbucket Prius

    Rustbucket Prius Junior Member

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    Thanks for the replies, I'm not sure it will be worth replacing the traction battery which in my preliminary searching looks like it's close to $2000 even for DIY.

    Kind of a shame because I've put quite a bit of money into it overhauling the AC, replacing wheel bearings, etc. But I don't want to continue throwing good money after bad.
     
  15. Rustbucket Prius

    Rustbucket Prius Junior Member

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    > Build yourself a “grid charger” - it’s cheap and easy - and charge the traction bat.

    Have you personally done that, successfully and if so could you point me to directions to follow?

    My searching didn't find anything specific other than Gen 1 is more difficult due to higher voltage requirements.

    I did find a commercially available one, but apparently because of those difficulties it is 2x the price of chargers for Gen 2.

    Maxx Volts EL-1 Entry Level Charging System
    $459.99
     
  16. JohnPrius3005

    JohnPrius3005 Active Member

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    Yeah I’ve done it. Basically a Meanwell LED power supply which provides 275v at very low amps. You should be able to find good instructions on Prius Chat with a little searching. I didn’t even use a diode, just an old electric light house switch. Total cost around $65
     
  17. ammdb

    ammdb Active Member

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    Grid chargers can be used to recondition good working batteries, but will not recover a dead pack. If the Dr. Prius app is accurate, your pack is way below the threshold where irreversible cell reversal can occur. It still has a $1300 value as a core when purchasing a new pack from Toyota.
     
  18. JohnPrius3005

    JohnPrius3005 Active Member

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    A grid charger can be used to charge an HV bat which is below the level at which an engine start can be accomplished. It’s a cheap alternative to going to Toyota to get a charge.
     
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  19. Trombone

    Trombone Member

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    Here are some sources for the HV battery. I have a Dorman installed in my '02, and so far, so good, although the first one installed was defective and replaced under warranty (not the install labor, though; had to pay for that). When I did the math, I figured $2-$2.5K was much cheaper than either a new or used car, and I got to keep the car I really like a lot. But, you pays your money and you takes your choice. Good luck with your decision, and let us know how it turns out!

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