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Wheel noise, 230k, tried balancing, tires look good

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Main Forum' started by georgefrank, Dec 2, 2023.

  1. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    Ok since this forum I cant upload photos, here are links to the youtube videos

    https://youtube.com/shorts/wbD8LdMSrZI?si=dUtYcPtvCW9eCwn7

    https://youtube.com/shorts/f5ty3usHczI?si=JRC3fv49rRP_6yPo

    Observations: the entire side wall came out, look at how on the second video I am spinning the wheel, you can see a deformation in the entire structure of the tire, right? meaning:

    Tire noise/wobbling sound/ is the ENTIRE TIRE out of whack, the infrastructure of the tire, look at the rip of its frame (the metal)

    Woah, usually when I get a flat, I do surgery right there on the spot and inflate the tire

    this is way different, It has happened to me before in a semi that had dry rot, they sat for i think 8 years, it was a front right steer

    Also, you can see the tread is still fine, but the inside had been out of line

    So, when I am driving, the infrastructure broke down slowly and became off center,

    that explains the balancing of the tires and it not getting any better (it actually got worse)

    Before today, I thought this only happens to dry rot tires,

    explanation: the tire is like a basket woven perfectly, the bumps, the slowing down, all of it, chips away at the wholeness of the basket

    Then, once a small part is off in the integrity of the weaves, then you will get that wobble/howling/uneveness/etc

    Then you will have what you see in those videos. wow
     
  2. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    Update:

    Ok I read another prius chat thread saying:

    Yes its fine go with the 205 50 17, it is ok, not a big deal, works out fine

    sorry for bugging yall
     
  3. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    Your vehicle is NOT safe to drive! Why won't you catch the hint when you said your
    car is wobbling all over the place?????
    You're fortunate that just the one tire blew out and that you didn't wreck and cause a HUGE
    accident and kill people.
    Park the car until you can replace the suspension parts and make the vehicle safe.
    You didn't say what state you were in....
     
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  4. bettergolf

    bettergolf Active Member

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    Sounds like that tire had a broken steel belt inside...........
     
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  5. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    Update on the sticky brake situation:

    I am still rereading this instruction to possibly have to do it

    What I have done:

    Whenever I bled the brakes, I put big 4x4 on the brake pedal pushing it hard

    Then I open 8 mm bleeder valve

    Let it come out, then i close the valve

    Then, I take out the 4x4 on the brake pedal, and I remember having to manually move the pedal back to original place, meaning:

    I must've created a vacuum situation, where the center point for the pedal is brakes engaged

    1st attempt at remedy did not work: I took off the top of the brake fluid holder and hit the brake a few times, thinking:

    "Maybe that top cap is keeping the system holding a vacuum and taking off the top cap MIGHT neutralize the system"

    Nope, it is in the line,

    Then today finally, I got under there and unscrewed the 8 mil bleeder, left the pedal alone in the regular position, allowed the fluid to escape, a bit of it

    My thoughts: in that line there was negative pressure/vacuum, I needed to open the bleed valve with the pedal in the non engaged position.

    Tomorrow, I find out if it is the end of the sticky brake situation...
     
  6. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Heck, or what country…
    That’s not optimum; having an assistant will work better.

     
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  7. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    Update on the sticky brake situation:

    Still sticking, I am having to manually pull the brake pedal back with the left foot while driving

    Assistant: no assistant because people are too expensive nowadays

    plan for tonight: open up that 8 mm bleeder valve and let MORE fluid come out

    Maybe I did not let enough come out

    Yes, i will watch that video and see if there is a solution
     
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  8. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    Ok yes I watched the youtube video, the two tasks I did not do:

    1. put the car in invalid mode, I do not see how this would matter

    2. They bled all four sides, I only bled the front left (where I was tinkering in that area)

    Could it be that I have to go and bleed all four valves because:

    I created a vacuum in the system with the way I did it originally, and that vacuum is spread to all the lines

    So when I bled the front left, it still was not enough because the vacuum spread to the whole system, and now I need to bleed all of them

    Plan for tonight:

    Get under the car, open up all four valves on all four wheels without hitting the brake pedal

    Let enough fluid from all four sides come out

    Maybe that will equalize the system to not have the brake engaged as the default state...
     
  9. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    There’s a relevant link in my signature too, on this. If you’re on a phone turn it landscape to see signature.

    Not sure how critical invalid mode is, but I would think Toyota had a good reason for it. You can get onto it without special tools. One gotcha: parking brake must be set. If you turn a wheel while in the mode it’ll kick you out too.

    In the link I believe I show Toyotas recommended order for doing the brakes, and it varies from the video.

    Also, I didn’t use any suction, just a tube with proper bleed bolt attachment, and a big mayo jar with hole drilled in lid, to hold the tube in place. The video shows very well the technique for front brakes.

    my link also has repair manual excerpts.
     
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  10. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    I see the link and read the first few posts:

    the plan for tonight: get the car in invalid mode (dont forget to set parking brake)

    Then start from the front right, and go counter clockwise

    Open each valve until you see fluid come out (not just a bit, alot)

    Since I do not have helper, I will push the brake and pump it up, then go get under the car and open up the valve, do each one, then I'll report back tomorrow
     
  11. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    There should be a spring that pulls the pedal back. Look for it and
    replace it if needed.
    Check auto stores for a bleeder hose with a one way valve on it. That way
    you can pump the pedal a few times, then open the bleeder valve, and go back and
    pump the pedal a few times, then close the valve, pump the pedal, open the bleeder.
    And raise the container above the caliper, so no air will get sucked back into the caliper.
     
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  12. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    Yes, I am comprehending

    The spring that pushes the pedal back is fine

    The way it is acting, I feel like some air would help (i know it wouldnt)

    it feels the normal state for it is engaged

    I'll try to do the 4 wheel bleeding like instructed by mendel, but if that doesnt work I will escalate the response

    I think I might have damaged the caliper when engaging the brake when it was not on the rotor

    First thing first, I do the bleed on the 4 wheels, then i report back
     
  13. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    You could always put a bungy cord on the pedal and seat headrest to help pull it back...
     
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  14. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    You're instructing to do this idea when bleeding the brakes?

    but the pedal goes back to its natural state (non engaged) when it is released

    I will not speculate or think anything else until:

    I at least go through the proper bleeding method,

    then if that fails, i entertain and do another idea
     
  15. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    ????? Post 47: ..."I am having to manually pull the brake pedal back with the left foot while driving."
    Did I miss read that? Or did you miss type it?

     
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  16. bettergolf

    bettergolf Active Member

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    "Then start from the front right, and go counter clockwise"

    Since my younger days I was taught brakes should be bled in order of farthest wheel from master cylinder first, next farthest second and so on.
     
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  17. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    That's what the Repair Manual says, only it takes them four near-identical instructions, with the only exception being in each being "front", "rear", "LH" (left hand) and "RH" (right hand). A dang picture would be worth about the 1000 words it takes them.

    That's how I did it, worked out fine, firm brakes at the end. I think it really helps to have an assistant on the front. The video shows an inset of the guy pushing the brake pedal, and the object is to start pushing the pedal, quickly open/close the bleed bolt, before the pedal bottoms out.

    If you can get someone to help with the pedal pushes, it's a big plus.
     
    #57 Mendel Leisk, Dec 20, 2023
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2023
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  18. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    Oh I see what you mean, ok I will explain my observations:

    When I am bleeding the brake: the pedal goes back to normal position

    During driving: I slow down to a stop light, at this point, pedal down a bit, engaging the brakes a bit, then when I have to go forward, thats when i will use the left foot to completely disengage the brake

    Finally now, I am about to go under the car and try to get this resolved

    The past few times bleeding the brakes, I could NOT get them to stick while testing in small area

    Then the next day, when I go out and do high speed/hard stopping, then the sticking comes back...

    Thanks for the advice and yalls kindness
     
  19. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    Yes I am listening, and if after I get it under it and try one more time by myself, then I will have someone bleed the brakes while I go under it and open the valves
     
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  20. georgefrank

    georgefrank Junior Member

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    Most people when bleeding the brakes, are looking to get air out of the lines

    That symptom: I have to hit the brakes really hard and it feels squishy even with the pedal fully down

    My situation feels the opposite, it feels like its default position is engaged

    I'll stay in touch and go try to solve it for a couple hours

    My first task:

    Get under it, open each valve (in order of what we established) until I see fluid coming out, without hitting the brake pedal

    Then go out on test run and see if she still sticking

    If still sticking: pump the brakes, get under it and then open each valve...