Featured Vancouver EV owner shares cautionary tale after car deemed ‘total loss’ (Another case in Post #50)

I saw that YouTube but like seeing a crashed car on the shoulder, just keep on keeping on.

Bob Wilson

 

No

And no.
both of you are taking an issue with a specific model car and expanding it to any car with a similar drive train.

My insurance is basically the same as it would be for an internal combustion vehicle.
And also happens to be less than what you’re paying for your Avalon insurance.
I don’t know why that is, but it is an indicator that insurance prices are not always as out of whack as you think they are.

The very early Model S reported a non-warranty cost of a battery pack in the $30,000 range .

This was with very low production vehicle (at the time) with battery tech that is 10 years older than currently.

I’m guessing their issues with labor, parts, and possibly know how that are all adding to those cost.

But I have never heard of anyone paying close to that .
I’ve also never heard of such a small incident compromising the battery pack. This is not due to it being an electric car, this is a result of poor engineering. .
I’ve also never heard of such a small incident compromising the battery pack. This is not due to it being a electric car, this is a result of poor engineering.

 

You must not ever watch any of Rich Rebuilds videos:

Although admittedly, in the end an independent repair shop was able to do the fix for a fraction of the price. But I'm not sure that's an option for everyone. I don't know of any independent repair shops anywhere nearby that work on EV's. That may change some day, but it's not the landscape we have to work with today.

You're also talking about a rather new car that doesn't have a lot of history yet. Teslas and other EV's may turn out to be great cars with lots of life in them. Or they may be giant cellphones that the batteries go out and you throw away the whole car long before you would an ICEV.

Only time will tell, and insurance will adjust depending on how things go as far as damage costs concern.

 

“both of you are taking an issue with a specific model car and expanding it to any car with a similar drive train.“
That’s why there was a question mark. You don’t know what I was thinking or writing. I stick to what I said as ok.

Very good pictures showing the cooling is on the bottom, where they said it’s dented, and ruptured. The batteries are not much above either. Issue clarified.

 

Here's another video. Look at the emails starting at 6:43. Those are a lot of people, many with barely over 100,000 miles, that all have a some $20,000 repair bill estimate from Tesla:

 

i can imagine the hue and cry from horse and buggy owners when automobiles started to become popular
there are and always will be naysayers to new technology. people happily stuck in the past and unwilling to change. that's their right, and also to protest change if it makes them feel better.

 

I'm not saying it's time to protest. After all, I would love to own an EV. But we also need to look at the whole picture, which I don't think we have the whole picture yet.

One person, their EV battery lasts 400,000 miles, another, only 120,000. So you throw in a used EV battery since a new one costs the same as the value of your car, which could go out who knows when.

Remember, I'm looking at this as a used car buyer. Do I buy another used EV, and what are the chances it'll backfire like the Leaf did?

 

Exactly!

• first Prius - 2003 used with 48,000 miles
• first EV - 2014 BMW i3-REx, carries a range extender engine/generator

With any new technology, there will be a 'learning curve'. It is best to avoid having to pay the 'new car' depreciation. If it doesn't work out, sell or trade it in for something that meets your requirements.

Bob Wilson

 

It’s the maiden voyage stage. The batteries are bigger and bigger where do they go? Plug in makes more sense to me, party of one.

 

I just mentioned a $30k battery replacement. You then counter with $20k replacements??
My point is, this $60k replacement is way out of the ordinary.
As for independent shops, we have at least two in our metro area (Minneapolis). They have great reputations and have helped lots of people.

I’m curious, how much was your Avalon? How much have the quoted repairs been (regardless of if you got the repair or not)?

Insurance companies live and die by properly managing risk.
When their is a new product on the market, they overcharge, not under.

 

we have the whole picture as a present snapshot in time. we never have the whole picture on anything in life. everyone makes their choices based on their present level of knowledge.
i wouldn't presume to advise you, or anyone else. i'm happy with some of my choices, and i learn from others.
there's too much angst about ev's in my opinion, but i think the problem is social media.
like so many things in life, it has its positives and negatives. sorting them is everyone's work.

 

it did to me too, back in 2012. now i'm much more comfortable with my ev, after 11 years of learning and tech advancements.

 

I definitely agree with that! $60k is way out of the ordinary, and it's either a dealer charging way too much or that particular car is the problem with way too expensive parts. Yes, $20k or so seems to be around the going rate, although Rich mentions some that were quoted less, as little as $11k.

That said, to me it wouldn't make any difference if it were a $60k repair or a $20k repair since I don't see myself buying an EV for more than $20k, and a $20k repair would be the end of driving. I'd take the car to the bank and call bankruptcy. Or just keep paying for a car I can't drive while walking everywhere until I get it paid off, unless I can sell it with a bad battery for more than the loan amount, which I doubt would happen.

It cost me a little over $15k used with 52k miles on it and was around 5-years-old (2013MY bought in July of 2018). 5.5 years later, it now has 140k miles. I had one accident with a deer that I repaired myself and didn't ask for a quote from anyone as I didn't want to pay the full $1,000 deductible for a $200 headlight. I've had no mechanical problems, other than a malfunctioning infotainment center, which I haven't gotten quoted because it was repaired not long before when the previous owner had it according to the stack of repair receipts I was given.

Our budget is about $600 total per month for a car (fuel, insurance, payments, repairs, etc). That's about 1/6 of our take home pay.

 

Not just an EV. Son drove over a ladder dropped off a truck at 65 MPH and drove home. Prius prime was declared total loss.

 

There is so much garbage on the roads!

Bob Wilson

 

Including many of the drivers

 

Both Bolts have full coverage, $500 deductible, for $2000. And NJ insurance is high. The interesting part is that the price has pretty much consistant for the last ten years.

 

Our new bolt and hycam cost the same and have similar premiums

 

I completely understand that it is out of your price range.
My issue, was taking an outlying data point and generalizing that across all EVs.

Please accept my apologies, I thought your infotainment had broken once you bought the car. Congrats on having such a low cost of ownership.
The average early Model S was around $75k. Paying the same 3.3% ($400/$15,000) monthly would be about $2,500. As a percentage, it wouldn’t take long to save up for the battery replacement cost.

Once again though, this isn’t so much an EV issue as a poor engineering/design problem.

 

Yes, but I've never had it quoted to get it fixed. So it's still broken. I did ask a local shop, but they said they don't work on Toyotas, or at least not that kind of part on Toyotas. But I figure that whatever the price it's not worth it. The map data is old anyway, I also installed my Yaesu FT-857D amateur radio transceiver in the Avalon that can listen to FM, AM, shortwave, you name it, etc. And I figure that if the part went out twice in 5 or 6 year, because the paperworks says it went out and was replaced when the previous owner had it, that it is just going to go out again if replaced. So what's the point?

Thanks! This is the most expensive car I've ever owned though. I had a $250 1993 Mazda 323, then a $600 1985 VW Golf non-turbo diesel. I'm not quite sure why I allowed myself to get rid of them.

Before those two cars I also had two Toyota's a 1984 Toyota Corolla which was lost in a crash (not my fault), and a 1985 Toyota Camry that ended up with a dead transmission, so I sold it for what I could. I can't remember the exact pricing, but the Corolla was under $1,000, I remember that much. I want to say the Camry was around $1,200. Neither of those cars turned out to be economical due to the short time I owned them.

From there I went for a time without any car, just using my bicycle, until I decided to get married, so I got the Mazda 323. The Golf lasted us 7 years and the 323 lasted some 5 years before that, and I'm not sure why I let them go. They both ran just fine when I gave them away (I didn't sell either).

But then it came to the point that, yes, people kept complaining about our ol' car that spewed out huge clouds of black smoke and that did 0 to 60 in about 7 minutes. So I thought that since we were making more money we could afford a newer car. I first went with that used Nissan Leaf for $9,000, but a year later we traded it for the 2013 Avalon Hybrid. I never had a car payment before these cars. I've never had a car before that I couldn't fix something on it either (like the radio, of all things!). But that's not to say I regret getting a nicer car. Not spewing out billowing clouds of black smoke is a nice.

Yes, and I'm generally optimistic about EV's. Making a part that costs $60,000 and then making it so it damages very easily is a poor design.

As for other EV's that need a battery replacing (mainly Teslas, since others I don't think are doing as great of a job as Tesla) I wonder what causes a battery to go bad and if there's a way to have a history of that vehicle. Maybe it's lots of DC quick charging that hurts the battery. Maybe those are cars that the previous owners charged to 100% every time, or they let it get down under 20% on most occasions.

It's kind of like what makes a gasoline car tick. For someone who buys used, like me: For someone who's rebuilt engines, like me: there are things that I know hurt an engine (or a transmission). Having the service records for the Avalon helped me chose it because I saw all the oil changes (and other maintenance items) were done on time. But I didn't have that for the Prius, and it ended up having galled cylinders and needs an engine block.

Having a certain knowledge of what used cars are good cars, what things to look for, what you need to see in the maintenance records, etc. can keep a used car buyer out of trouble. Or you end up like some friends of mine that bought a used Ford Escape with less than 100,000 miles and 3 months later needed a $9,000 transmission replacement. I suppose it will end up the same with EV's.

But right now, I'm not sure what makes an EV tick. I'm not sure what used EV's will have a good track record and be dependible. I hope some day that I'll have the knowledge, and that knowledge will make me more confident in buying a used EV (when used EV's are at a price point I can afford with whatever my income is then).