Featured Dead “robots” pack the Chicago Supercharger stations

I don’t believe anyone has suggested any of your bullet points.
Misrepresenting the ‘other side’ of the argument is not helpful.

People are pointing out risks in cold weather, not certainties.
12V batteries do fail at a higher rate in the cold.
Sprinkler pipes can freeze. The example given specifically mentioned a system not freezing, much less freezing weekly as you mentioned. But nobody said they always do.

My EVs have been the best winter cars I have ever had (and yes, one was a Leaf). Living in Minnesota is one of the many reasons I will never own an ICE vehicle again.
That doesn’t mean I think EVs are well suited for all people.

S#!& happens, and some people didn’t know how to mitigate those risks/issues.
That statement applies to EVs, ICE vehicles, sprinkler water pipes, and many other things.

The above means improvements are needed. It does not mean the technology isn’t ready for wide adoption (in and of itself).

 

So all the dead robots, (laughter), coasted to the spots on zero charge and can’t move out?

Today on Fox Business News the reason for the big story is confirmed. They went after “Biden’s EV insanity, ” as the headline, using the same Chicago scenes. No mincing words there about the agenda. EV wars, keep the faithful worked up and in the group. They didn’t say President in the headline to the story. That title is reserved for another who isn’t President, not the one who is.

 

My experience is that a 12 V battery has one cell die first. This reduces the voltage from a perfect 12.85 VDC to typically 11.8-11.9 VDC. It still has enough energy to start the ICE in temperate temperatures, +55F. But as the engine gets colder sitting over night, the internal friction increases demanding more energy than the marginal battery can deliver.

Jumping the battery can get the car running and it will continue to start and run as long as the ICE is warm enough. But let it get cold, another jump is needed. Furthermore, a failing cell seldom gets better but sometimes adding water and cleaning the terminals can make it less bad. At least long enough for the next paycheck.

Bob Wilson

 

Nominal voltage of lead-acid is 2V, yet the 12V systems in a car run at higher voltages than that. It is normal practice to use nominal voltage for a battery's specs, and we don't have a reason for Tesla to not use it here.

The nominal voltage of LFP adds up to 16V with five cells. Fully charged it will reach 18V.

 

Good news, the Tesla Cybertruck is a 48 VDC, low voltage system. My first car had a 6 VDC electrical system and battery. My yard tools use 80 VDC batteries.

Bob Wilson

 

Notice how it Is President Trump and seldom former President Trump.

 

Not sure if it’s safe to say yes on the internet. Especially in court cases when the name is not on the case. I would think there would be an objection for Obama or Biden if their lawyers said President instead of the legal first name. A strong objection.

I regularly see 11.9 in the morning. I found a red light glowing under the dash behind the obd port yesterday. That must be the lojack or the Terminator is in there. Maybe it is supposed to be there. I could see it in the gap over the knee air bag.

 

Many auto parts and service centers can load test the 12 VDC battery to give an indication of health. But my experience has been they last 4-6 years in Alabama and Washington DC.

Bob Wilson

 

I don't know if I'm misrepresenting the other side or not. But I get the feeling a lot of people assume things that happen in the cold that aren't as prevalent as they seem to make them appear.

There are many reasons why I would like an EV and the cold weather and usual short trips is one of them. My engine hardly ever gets up to 120 °F, and much less an actual running temp of 175 °F or more. It was nice to have the option for the Leaf to precondition. I can't idle my Avalon without leaving it unlocked as everything I've tried will not allow it, and Toyota's solution is to install a remote start kit for $$$. It was also very nice in the Leaf having a heated steering wheel and heated seats both front and back. I also loved the twin sun visors in the Leaf, so when driving on curvy roads I could have one down in front of me and the other on the side. That's much better than having to flap a single sun visor back and forth at every twist and turn in the road.

For the record, 12V lead acid batteries do not "fail" at a higher rate in the cold. Well, I guess it depends on what you qualify as failing. Overall, 12V batteries last longer in colder climates. And in the cold, it's not that they fail because of the cold, but that the cold adds to the sagging voltage of an already old battery. Cranking amps drop due to the cold on any battery, and having barely enough in the summer means you won't have enough in the winter. Of course it depends on the perpective of the driver. Winter comes, car won't start, one blames the cold making the battery "fail." The other realizes that the battery was old and needed to be replaced soon anyway, and that if he warms that old battery or he knows that the next few days it's supposed to be warmer then he'll be able to get a few more starts out of it, maybe another summer's worth.

And again I don't like the comparison because the situation is not the same. If your 12V battery is old, it needs to be replaced. That's the way it works and has been working since Ford came out with the Model T. When I drove my Leaf at -17 to -15 °F and started climbing a small hill and the battery percentage dropped like the counter on a bomb 30 miles out of town, it wasn't going to be a matter just popping into my local parts store and handing over a couple hundred dollars and saying "Ya, I should have replaced it back when it started cranking slow this past fall."

If dozens of people are having problems driving their EV's to the places they need to go because "it's cold" then something needs to change. Either they're not charging them up at home and relying too much on public charging, or they didn't get a big enough battery for the kind of driving they do, or something else just isn't right (they're not following how the Noriwegians do it).

That was my point. Why rate a charging system by maximum voltage and then use half the capacity??? 5 x LFP cells makes more sense. Although I wouldn't put it past Tesla to do something like rate their auxiliary batteries by maximum voltages just because they can. I mean, Elon isn't truthful about everything. e.g. A Cybertruck towing a Porsche 911 cannot complete a 1/4 race faster than a Porsche 911.

 

Because batteries aren't charging systems. With self discharging a fully charged battery won't be so for long sitting on a shelf. Using nominal voltage is just saying it should be at least this amount in that case.

Tesla could be using the full voltage of the cells for the label. They aren't doing anyone a service, including themselves in doing so.

 

The dealer I bought the car used from put in a new battery less than a year ago. I guess the original was dying on the lot. I am pretty certain the lojack is making things worse than normal. I have a load test thing I bought from Amazon, haven’t really used it yet, will try it. I hope I don’t need another battery. That would be #3 on a 3.5 year old car. During my ownership I couldn’t really do much more than I am to maintain the battery.

 

Writing about cars dying out in Chicago in the winter, my relatives laughed when I didn’t know what Heet was. Now with some alcohol in the gas to absorb moisture maybe Heet, containing methyl alcohol, isn’t sold in every corner store.
So if one doesn’t read the instructions, they learn the hard way is my take on the Chicago video clip.

 

Your 12V battery's friend.
NEW Schumacher Ship 'N Shore Speed Charge 12V Battery Charger SSC-1500A 10Amp | eBay

 

These kind of ebay sales come with no warranty, buyer is not the retail purchaser. I have a Solar 4 amp which works well. I am thinking about an Eveready from Walmart for $38 that is waterproof. I usually put the Solar up on the front tire, so getting along ok. Having the battery monitor has been invaluable at watching the soc and voltages.

 

Ok, let’s put it this way. AAA reports that the calls they receive for ‘dead batteries’ goes up in cold weather.
This may be due to users not taking appropriate steps to protect them, or just physics. But the result is, more drivers call AAA because their 12V battery ‘died’ in the winter than summer,

Why is my car battery dying? How the cold is affecting cars in the winter

 

That was just an example. Keep your battery maintained and you won't have surprises.

 

Yes, like I said, it does depend on your perspective. Does cold kill batteries or does the summer heat kill them and the cold of winter let you know?

If we're going to compare old 12V batteries dying because of the cold to new EV's, then there must be a lot of EV's that need to be replaced. That's my main point. Even if 12V batteries die from the cold, how does this have anything to do with EV drivers getting stranded from drivng their EV's?

 

It simply shows that drivers of either type of vehicle face challenges in the winter.

 

I suppose you're right. As someone who lives in a place where the roads may have snow pack and ice on them for several months, I cringe as so many people move in here without a clue as to how to drive and take care of a care in the cold. One guy showed up in an RV in the middle of the winter, with temps dropping down to -30 °F. You can guess how things went. People follow what the new tells them. They think all they need is AWD and perhaps some snow tires and that they can drive on ice as if it were pavement. One lady here sold her small FWD car and traded it for a large AWD SUV and was suprised at how inferior the SUV drove in the snow and on ice. If she would have asked me what the pros and cons of a large SUV are over a small FWD hatchback I could have told her. But people don't believe the guy that has lived here for 51 years and has been driving since he was 14, they believe the ads of trucks flying through snow as if it were some sort of race.

But life does throw you curve balls every once in a while even with things you know. I had no idea that the 12V battery in a hybrid Avalon was nearly unobtainable. I did have problems trying to keep it going during one winter, but because I couldn't get a replacement one at any of the three local parts stores.

With the Leaf it was something I had researched and thought would work. But I don't have that much experience with EV's and EV's are also pretty new. There's a lot of unknowns for me, although I learned a few things with the Leaf. It would be nice to have some pointers from someone with over 35 years experience driving an EV in the cold before buying an EV again.

 

I know it was just an example, just remarking on ebay because I tried to warranty something once and it was a no from the manufacturer. Writing comes out different than intent sometimes.
I would have to trickle charge all the time, every day, if I want to get my Prime battery to stay near 100%. My truck sits next to it and since I removed an aftermarket cruise control, it is at 100% after a week not used.