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Lots of lights, sometimes P0a93

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by PriusPaddler, Jan 31, 2024.

  1. PriusPaddler

    PriusPaddler Member

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    09 Prius with 307k miles.

    August 2021 - replaced inverter pump with Autozone part (P0a93 code)

    April 2023 - replaced again with a new Autozone part (same P0a93 fault code)

    May 2023 - replaced coolant control valve with OReillys part. P1121 code.

    Fall 2023 - replaced coolant control valve for second time (Toyota part this time) P1121 code

    Winter 2023, started using oil and I didn't know it. Ran very low before red triangle came on and I added oil (likely at 4-5000 miles since change). Tech set maintenance reqd to 5k but I usually only go 3k.

    Winter 2023, new front brakes and rotors and axle.

    All seemed well. Drove maybe 5000 miles since any issues (oil changes at 3k).

    Two days ago it was very warm in MN. 50 degrees. Drove over 100 miles doing life and suddenly on highway:

    Red triangle
    Yellow exclamation mark
    VSC light
    ABS light
    and yes CEL, but that's always on due to P0420 for my cat.

    codes were P0420 (expected) and P0a93 (again!)

    When i've had the inverter pump problem before, I clear codes, let things cool down, and try to drive home. I was forty miles away at this time.

    I cleared the codes and sat for close to an hour. I checked the oil and it was just below the low mark with about five hundred miles till oil change was due. I drove one mile to a convenience store and added two quarts of oil.

    Eventually I drove home with no further red triangle And no return of the p0a93. But all the other lights keep coming on.

    (!)
    VSC
    ABS
    and CEL

    So...? Did my autozone inverter pump fail again for the second time?

    Do I have something else going on? That's not throwing a code that I can read?

    Why didn't the inverter pump code come back when the lights came back on?

    Shall I change out the inverter pump yet again?
     
  2. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    I don't think so if you open the door of your car with the car on and get out open the hood put your hand behind the headlight on the left side you should feel your inverter pump pulsing maybe making a little vibrating noise that's basically all it does You need to get a good code reader so you can read all of the codes properly AutoZone may not be getting them all. Generally for the coolant stuff like that usually the little car on the MFD that's green turns red The ABS VSC in the exclamation point I don't generally think should be on for the inverter pump or the coolant control valve just saying I don't think that's the way it's been in any of our four usually when the water business is acting up especially the inverter pump the green car on the multifunction display will turn red and you can't read part of the top line of that display. So maybe get the codes red with another scanner my Innova 3120 I think reads the important stuff including abs. There are others that will do that well also That's a fairly cheap scanner like $40 most of the newer scanners that are in the fairly cheap market will read most of the codes that are important but if you can get a hold of somebody that has an autel or Toyoda tech. Then that would be good
     
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  3. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    Where you live in Minneapolis is cold as it normally is I could drive my Prius with an inverter pump not working for probably the whole winner without any problems without it cutting back the charging or anything I can do it in North Carolina so I know I can do it in Minneapolis so I wouldn't run around changing inverter pumps just because not till you find out that's what needs to really happen again If you open the top of the reservoir for the inverter you should see the water vibrating a little bit and if you put your hand on the pump you can feel that vibration that's really kind of all it does It's a mag drive pump that doesn't really make any pressure or anything
     
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  4. PriusPaddler

    PriusPaddler Member

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    Well I am not sure what threw the p0a93 that I saw (and took screenshot) this week, but you are right... there is more.

    Autozone reader shows

    U0123 Lost communication with yaw rate sensor module

    U0124 Lost communication with lateral acceleration sensor module

    U0126 Lost communication with steering angle sensor module


    So, I will search pc archives for those. Can I still drive?

    I will check for the Inverter pump motion this afternoon. Good idea... But might it be possible for it to work intermittently? What else would cause P0a93?
     
  5. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Get a dealer part, no more autozone
     
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  6. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    Yep in Minneapolis you should be cold enough to be driving without any issues unless you're trying to run a hundred miles an hour everywhere I can unplug my inverter pump here in North Carolina where I live and drive all day until it gets above 70° outside then it's not happy I have done this many times before.
     
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  7. PriusPaddler

    PriusPaddler Member

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    Would it matter that the night everything lit up, I had 700lbs of people in the car and 250lbs of mulch? plus maybe 25lb dog, couple gallons of washer fluid, and miscellaneous backpacks, a suitcase, and winter coats and boots?

    Maybe the heaviest load or close to it...

    Made it home from autozone 14 miles with no lights this time. I did NOT pick up the part, on your advice.
     
  8. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    I mean if you're trying to run a race overloaded like that the car is not going to be happy but just driving from the store back to your property or whatever the heck you were doing shouldn't be huge issues unless you're trying to climb extreme inclines or God knows I tow a trailer with my Prius I've taken it up to Virginia to pick up a zero turn lawn mower and bring it back That's like 400 mile round trip without any problems we're not trying to run break next speeds but cruise along 55 65 without any problem. And the Prius is not really made for any towing.
     
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  9. PriusPaddler

    PriusPaddler Member

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    Wow! Well as a UNC Tar Heel myself, I commend your spirit of adventure!! I've hauled a full size refrigerator to the hazardous waste drop-off myself, but that was only 6 miles at low speeds.

    The load I had this week didn't feel heavy, just bulky and the dog had nowhere to go.

    The dash lit up shortly after accelerating onto the highway. Might have reached cruising speed of 65mph or so.

    Those U-codes still don't show on my reader so I guess I need to upgrade that. No idea when they appeared, but still doesn't explain the P0a93, and that doesn't explain the lights staying on when it didn't throw that code again.

    Gonna sleep on it, upgrade my reader, and keep gathering clues.

    I ran a 10 mile errand this evening with no dash lights coming on. Aaaargh!
     
  10. mr_guy_mann

    mr_guy_mann Senior Member

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    P0A93 is set when the inverter "gets too hot". While it's ALMOST always a faulty inverter pump, it could be something else in the inverter cooling system. Maybe a pinched hose somewhere, or dirt - leaves restricting airflow through the bottom third of the radiator, etc.

    First things first. Power the car on. Take the cap off the inverter coolant tank. Do you see coolant swirling around inside? Is it "turbulent" or sluggish? Is the pump quiet or whining?

    Many people on the forums have had problems with aftermarket pumps. I only use and recommend OE from the dealer - did it once and no problems.

    You need to bleed the system. I use a clear tube from the bleeder fitting back to the tank - open it while the car is on and let it flow until bubbles stop. (Can take several minutes).

    Old Gen2's can get coolant deposits in the system. On a couple cars I had to remove the drain plug and some hose connections to use a garden for flushing the crud out.



    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
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  11. PriusPaddler

    PriusPaddler Member

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    I have learned my lesson about parts for sure! I should find a decent place to buy Toyota parts in my area.

    Thank you for the ideas.
     
  12. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    I don't even have a factory inverter pump in my generation too or the inverter pump goes I use a completely different pump because these seem to be problematic whenever they seem to be so I just got rid of that pump and put something else there It's just a 12 volt circulating pump there are millions of options if you really wanted to go that route working on hot tubs and spas I'm used to working on circulator pumps pretty regularly I also have a wood home heating system that involves these things called taco pumps No they're not Mexican pumps anyway all you've got to do is get water to slowly flow through the inverter circuit not much to that Why so many companies or whoever have trouble making a mag drive circulator pump like this pancake thing in the Prius I will never understand If you slice a Toyota factory inverter pump open and do the same thing to the non Toyota branded all the parts inside the pump are almost identical looking I can't see any cheap circuitry or inferior anything at least not by close visual and looking with a lupe. So I'm not sure exactly why the copies the fakes or whatever don't work like the original same with the main water pump in the generation 3 if you break them down and look inside of them You can't really see anything so it must be an individual electronic components which I have no time or gumption to do any testing on I just put a pump there that I know has a good track record and that's that and for most people spending $136 on the factory pump is probably the smart way to go so that you can eliminate that part of your troubleshooting for a while seems most of these things last 200,000 mi so the one you put on you'll be out of the car before you do it again generally speaking most people don't keep anything as long as I do never practically
     
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  13. PriusPaddler

    PriusPaddler Member

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    Well my new reader isn't here yet. Today I drove 60 miles round trip highway and 6 miles round trip suburb.

    NO dash lights (except cat-related CEL) and no new codes on my old reader which doesn't read ABS codes.

    No sign of the P0a93 again. Almost 50 degrees here.

    So, I'm gonna get the new reader maybe tomorrow in the mail and see what I can see.

    It might be too much to hope that it all was just a horrible mistake.
     
  14. PriusPaddler

    PriusPaddler Member

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    OK - here's the update.

    1) after clearing the P0A93 code the night it happened, that has not recurred. I had never gotten the red triangle since any previous problem, so I believe this was triggered that night.
    2) I got the new reader that reads ABS codes and I could read the same three codes that Autozone was able to read. Since my reader would have never shown those to me, I have no idea when they were thrown. So I cleared them (I assume my old code reader would never have seen them OR cleared them).
    3) I've now driven over 500 miles and NO P0A93 and NO more ABS codes and no more crazy dash lights.

    So - what the heck??? Do I need to be nervous to drive long road trips now? Could it have been the overload and accelerate to highway speed? Could the brake ABS codes have been thrown during service visit when I got new brakes, a wheel bearing, and an axle recently and just wasn't re-set?

    I won't look a gift horse in the mouth, but I hate an unexplained problem that might recur unexpectedly in the middle of nowhere some day...
     
  15. mr_guy_mann

    mr_guy_mann Senior Member

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    So what code reader (scantool) do you have? At this point, does the inverter pump work and is it running quietly?

    Some people have had inoperative pumps but never got a P0A93 for months while driving locally in cooler climates (winter).

    I suppose if your scantool has data for the Hybrid Control ecu, you could read inverter temperature?

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
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  16. PriusPaddler

    PriusPaddler Member

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    I got the Innova 5110. I still am not sure how to maximize the use of it, but can do the basics. I don't think it's capable of reading the inverter temperature. But I did add the ABS capabilities to my repertoire - I hadn't even known they existed before this issue.

    THANK YOU for reminding me to check the pump. We've been setting daily high temp records this week, but it's still not up to 60 degrees so probably not impacting the need for the pump. Will it still run in relatively cool weather? It's raining and windy now, but I will add it to my list and get it done shortly.
     
  17. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

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    At ~$77 the Innova 5110 is just a very rudimentary reader. According to the spec it can only read/erase engine codes, read/erase ABS codes, and display emissions/SMOG check readiness.
     
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  18. mr_guy_mann

    mr_guy_mann Senior Member

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    The inverter pump should run anytime the car is ON, either in "ready" mode or "ignition power on" mode (power button x2 with no foot on brake).

    Here's a thread that reviews several scantool apps and devices. Some can scan all systems on a Gen2 Prius for codes, data, and more.

    https://priuschat.com/index.php?posts/3290690

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
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  19. PriusPaddler

    PriusPaddler Member

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    Well, that's what I get for dawdling... Today, after about 60 miles of errands, and about 30 minutes of idling while waiting for a child to finish work, the lights came screaming on again:

    Red triangle
    (!)
    VSC
    ABS
    CEL (always on due to cat)

    This happened while NOT overloaded, but again just after coming up to speed on a hwy (70mph).

    I pulled over and checked codes:

    P0a93
    P0420 (expected, but Innova says it's a serious error)
    C1310 (abs code, new, I've never seen this before but never monitored abs codes at all anyway)

    I drove about 2 miles, noticed I could NOT engage cruise control. Decided to make SURE I had oil. Pulled over again and turned car off and checked oil. It was tolerable (changed about 1500 miles ago).

    I turned car on again and all lights went away except the red triangle (and CEL).

    I drove about 7 miles home, cruise control now worked. Stayed 30-50mph.

    Sat in driveway at idle and finally remembered to check for "turbulence" in coolant. NONE. Had been checking coolant levels and it's right between high and low. But there is NO movement when I look down in there with car in READY mode.

    It wasn't even 40 degrees here today, but it was super sunny. Still, you wouldn't think the inverter would overheat in Minnesota in February. Yet - the code says that and the coolant is not circulating...

    Is that coolant tank ONLY for the inverter coolant? (unrelated coolant control valve changed before Xmas)

    Do I get rid of the SECOND autozone inverter pump and pony up for a Toyota one?

    Only other thing I can think of to do is see if I can find someone with a better code reader/scanner and see if there might be something else going on.

    AAAARGH.
     
  20. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    C1310 is a code from the brake system to tell you that there are trouble codes in the hybrid system.

    So now you've got a scan tool, it seems, that is able to show you brake system codes, but still not the hybrid system code(s) that brake code is telling you about.
     
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