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SARS-CoV-2 Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Discussion in 'Environmental Discussion' started by tochatihu, Jan 26, 2020.

  1. 3PriusMike

    3PriusMike Prius owner since 2000, Tesla M3 2018

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    Maybe is is an uptick in the use of plastics, especially in bottled water.
    Or the increase in the number of wind turbines.
    Or the use of faux leather in car seats.

    You can make up almost anything to explain it...the difficult task is in actually isolating a particular cause and effect.

    Mike
     
  2. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    One can learn a lot about recent histories of cancers here

    Cancer Over Time

    and about known causative factors here

    Global Cancer Observatory

    ==
    My problem with "thing 123 causes cancer' or (for that matter) "thing 456 cures cancer' is that they act as distractions. Not to say they should not be explored, but explorations ought to be done by appropriate study designs. Internet hyperventilation just don't cut it.

    ==
    Proving a negative seems to be widely misunderstood. Appropriate study designs would be large and well controlled. Result will be cast in terms of statistical probability. This will be unsatisfying for people who do not or prefer not to understand statistics. If the topic is human health, experiments also require extensive layers of approval. So it can surely be done, within limits, but only by very dedicated (and funded) folks.
     
  3. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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  4. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i began my vitamin d saga a couple years ago when a new practice did a test which my old practice claimed insurance wouldn't pay for.
    the testing came back 'low' according to the lab. but when i started researching normal levels, all i found was a lot of confusion and controversy over a 20 year old study done by a vitamin d proponent or something like that.
    i had to take a big dose for awhile, and now a daily small dose. my d is quite high now, but my doc claims you can't take too much, which some authorities claim is not true.
    i hope this new study proves useful.
     
  5. Mr.Vanvandenburg

    Mr.Vanvandenburg Senior Member

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    Humans are animals too. Personally I am starting to think not even better ones.

    My mothers cancer doc said don’t get overweight when I asked what is the best thing to avoid cancer.

    I got my second shingles shot, all done. It was rough, exhaustion, aches, and it took three days to finish it’s job.
     
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  6. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Haven't had to start supplements but when it comes to vitamin D, the vitamin D loaded powdered milk & sunshine (+ sunscreen) has been quite effective .... so far

    2015-03-17%2016.43.05.jpg
    .
     
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  7. Classic Car Guy

    Classic Car Guy Active Member

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  8. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    By "a lot" I take it you mean significantly more than would be otherwise expected, and by "for no apparent reason" you mean they definitely had this one thing in common and nowhere else to look for explanations?

    And you know all this? Can you go through the steps of how you came to know all this?

    Maybe someone who has watched that can hit the key points, like, where/when in Congress (a committee hearing? what committee? and so on), what was said, who took it off and how and what's there now instead?
     
  9. Classic Car Guy

    Classic Car Guy Active Member

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    I think you got it the opposite. It must be the covid jab for you top be in denial, upset and spending all your life behind the computer. Well I have to go. Life awaits. Don't say I didn't warn anyone. :LOL:
     
  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    hit and run, makes sense i guess when you fly by your gut instead of your brain.

    it amazes me how all the anti vaxxers 'know a lot of people who have died for no apparent reason', and i don't know any. (n)
     
    #6711 bisco, May 5, 2024
    Last edited: May 5, 2024
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  11. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    is that video trying to make it look like he is testifying to congress? who is the guy next to him wearing the cape?:ROFLMAO:
     
  12. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Doesn't sound like Classic knows personally a lot of people who have died for no apparent reason.

    Just knows [that] a lot of people have died for no apparent reason.

    If they were all people Classic knew, it would be very sad, but at least it would be clearer where Classic's knowledge came from.
     
  13. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    What of it? Who is that guy? To what group is he speaking? Where are the links to the document he is talking about, so we can read it ourselves?

    Actually, I found the document myself, though won't link it just yet because that is your job right now. If I could find it, and the tables he used (in just a couple minutes), then you can too.

    He seems very seriously pissed off that the vaccine wasn't 100% effective as some people tried to portray it. And he makes some serious errors in portraying what the report says.

    And "63.5% of people fully vaccinated were dying in England" is a very false statement betraying that he seriously misunderstood what that chart actually showed. I challenge you to go find that particular chart and explain to us what it really shows. (Note that the significance of that type of result was discussed and covered in the other threads long ago.)

    Remember also that the Delta variant significantly changed our understanding of this virus and the vaccines. That doesn't make vaccination a lie.

    Watching that clip, what I see is mostly some really pissed-off unnamed guy at an unnamed event and location, misunderstanding Biden's statements about the vaccines, and misreading some charts in an unreferenced document. This isn't news, or 'science', it is just pot-stirring.
     
  14. Classic Car Guy

    Classic Car Guy Active Member

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    Unnamed guy? That's Senator Ron Johnson in Congress investigating Covid in front of the board official representatives of Google, Youtube, Twitter, Facebook all under oath. They just admitted and that its a YES they hid all the information from the public that the follow-up covid jabs Does Not Work. You are lying to yourself if you cannot even see it.
    The answer is NO I will not challenge anyone. Because I have a job which is far more important than putting my time and at the end of the day which falls in nothing but a "discussion". If there are individuals angry in this room, Its the three of you. Look I just said what I said and that's all up to you whether you want to take it or leave it.

    Biden_destroyer.jpeg
     
    #6715 Classic Car Guy, May 5, 2024
    Last edited: May 5, 2024
  15. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Where in your linked clip is any of this identified? Show me.

    He takes some numbers from Table 5, pointing out that 1,613 fully vaccinated people (of both age groups) died from the Delta variant over this time period. He represents this as "63.5% of people fully vaccinated were dying in England ..." . But another line in the same chart shows 157,400 fully vaccinated people were identified as getting the Delta variant.

    Do some basic arithmetic: even if you count just the vaccinated people who actually caught the Delta variant, not all the people who were actually vaccinated, the deaths amounted to ( 1,613 / 157,400 ) = 1.02%, not 63.5% that he stated. And overwhelmingly senior citizens (age >=50).

    Did it not bother you that he said: "593 cases of mainly Delta, 2542 deaths ..."? As stated, that means a lot more deaths than actual cases. Or a death rate of over 400%. But he misread. Exercise to reader: go find how he misread the chart.

    I.e. you are not going to defend this very blatant mis-representation that you attribute to Ron Johnson. You are just doing a hit-and-run sh*t stirring.

    FWIW, other readers can find the report that Johnson(?) misrepresents at:

    https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/614459a2d3bf7f05aa5f9301/Technical_Briefing_23_21_09_16.pdf

    His 2,542 and 1,613 numbers came from the last line of Table 5. His 593 figure appears to be a misread of line 3, column 1.

    Other reports in the series at:

    Investigation of SARS-CoV-2 variants: technical briefings - GOV.UK
     
    #6716 fuzzy1, May 6, 2024
    Last edited: May 6, 2024
  16. Classic Car Guy

    Classic Car Guy Active Member

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    Who's honest.. You and The BiG Guy?:ROFLMAO:
    Nighthie!
     
  17. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Seems to me that we have here before walked these paths. Global COVID deaths were to to 5.5 million according to WHO, or almost 15 million excess deaths by

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-022-05522-2

    It seems unlikely that all will agree on a number.

    Many vaccines decreased mortality and (survivors) case severity, and a link to an overview of that may be provided by readers. Perhaps it already was. Many pages ago. COVID was in enough humans and able to mutate away from vaccine -> immune systems skills. This added to imperfection of global vaccinations, besides low uptake in some countries. TL;DR imperfect global vaccination HELPED.

    It seems very fortunate that we are in no position to estimate what global fatalities would have been, or global hospital case overloading would have been, absent vaccinations (and antivirals). There were some who advocated 'let herd immunity develop' "naturally" (without forceful medical interventions). I do not know if Sen. Ron Johnson was among them. Don't really care.

    MUCH more important is the future in which another zoonotic virus will jump to humans. Assume otherwise at great peril. In response to that we may make mRNA vaccines even better and faster, with better global distribution and uptake. Limit deaths and allow hospital sn health care workers to do other things besides.

    OR, COVID FUD may may tie our hands. Viruses do not WANT they only DO. But if they could want, they would want that. So that they can do.

    People acting as if they are on team virus perplex me most mightily.
     
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  18. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    Again and again and more times after that.....

    ALL STOP!!
    Ignition OFF!
    Chauk the tires!

    I stopped reading after that.....
    I already presume to know what the CCP would have us to believe about all of the numbers and the things.
    When an alleged 'peer reviewed' [crowd sourced] entity cannot agree about the cause of a 5-6 year old virus when we know much more about the Ft Riley flu of over a century ago, then my validity rating for the source is adjusted appropriately.....

    Perhaps in the fullness of time....
     
  19. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    Dropping in with fud and not defending it sounds like flaming
     
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