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Too late? Transmission Fluid Change 170k miles, New Prius Owner

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by Daniel Sullivan, Jun 26, 2023.

  1. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan New Member

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    Hi Everyone!

    I looked for a similar forum to my question and couldn't find an answer so I decided to open a forum.

    TLDR: Bought my first Prius! 2010 with 169,000 miles on it, I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think transmission fluid has ever been changed. Should I have it changed? Or just live with the transmission fluid as is, and maybe get a used car warranty incase the transmission breaks?

    Previous owner changed engine oil every 3,000 miles, car seems to be in pretty good condition, and has a new water pump. My only concern was the battery since it hasn't been changed, but it isn't issuing any codes. My engine seized on my last car so I got the best prius I could as quickly as possible. Under more optimal circumstances I would've taken my time and waited for the best one to pull the trigger on. Paid $7,850 before tax & fees. CarFax and everything looked great, but after I bought the car I realized I didn't look to see if there had been transmission fluid changes. To my dismay when I looked back at the service history it doesn't look like the transmission fluid has ever been changed which seems weird for an owner who would change the engine oil every 3,000 miles. I'll try calling the shops who maintained the prius to see if they have any record of it, but if they had a record they probably would've put it into the carfax along with the oil changes.

    Quick note on the battery, I'm averaging roughly 42mpg (mostly city mileage, uber eats) trying to mostly drive in the eco "zone" but sometimes I have to push it into power since it has trouble accelerating up hills or in pinch situations. The battery seems to charge and discharge more quickly than it should. I've read about the Project Lithium batteries (which would be my preference) but they're out of stock. But maybe I don't have to change the battery yet, maybe I just do some reconditioning on it. I'm not sure, I'm also a bit wary about switching to Lithium since it's less "tested" than NiMH. Not 100% what to do there, but I also need to do more research. I think the primary concern right now should be the transmission. Since I am driving Uber Eats in the Dallas heat, I know I'm putting a lot more strain on my battery than a "normal" user... so it still is definitely something I will have to handle soon.

    Thanks for all of your help in advance! I already freaking LOVE my prius and stoked to be a prius owner! I was nervous at first, mostly about the seats, since my mom had a Gen2 and I only remember the seats being horribly uncomfortable, but I think they fixed that issue in Gen3!
     
    #1 Daniel Sullivan, Jun 26, 2023
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2023
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    Never too late, what about the egr circuit?

    I would relax about the battery until you get a code, but start shopping now
     
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  3. CR94

    CR94 Senior Member

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    Transmission problems due to not changing the fluid are rare on these cars. Changing it is probably good, but other maintenance items are more urgent, if neglected---engine coolant, and checking EGR status, for just two examples.
     
  4. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan New Member

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    Honestly never even heard about the EGR circuit until now. I'll have to look into it more, I took it for a pre-purchase vehicle inspection and the mechanic said everything looked good. The only warning light that's on is the TPMS, I've filled the tires once, and then went back to check a couple times and they were fine, so I'll need to get that checked out. Had a friend said take it to a Toyota dealership and they'll recalibrate the sensors for free, I also think Discount Tire would probably do this. Hoping I don't have to replace those sensors.

    The reason I was asking is because I've heard that if you don't replace the transmission fluid on time, sometimes it's better to just never change it if it's gone too many miles without being changed in the past.

    The water pump was changed at 155,000 miles so I'm guessing all the coolant had to be replaced then as well. Looking at the CarFax service history doesn't show coolant replaced anywhere else though. I know CarFax service history isn't always comprehensive since a lot of shops don't report so some of this is guess work. I'll have to look into how to check EGR status. History also says at 165k miles engine oil/fluid leak checked... Don't know what that was though, the inspection I had done said there were no leaks so maybe it was fixed. I saw in another forum an anecdote about a Taxi company with a ton of prii where they never changed transmission fluid and also never had any transmissions breakdown with 300k+ miles on their prii.
     
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  5. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    Changing the fluid is something you can do. 4 jack stands and a jack to get it up
    in the air, and level. Very important. It's just a drain and refill. A 10mm hex head
    and a 1/2 breaker bar, alway break the FILLER plug BEFORE the drain plug!
    Then a hose and a funnel to pour the 4 quarts of Toyota WS fluid in.

    If you get he Prolong system and run it though the whole cycles it should bring new
    life into the hybrid battery. It certainly worked for me.

    It would be a good idea to clean the whole EGR system, which includes the intake manifold's
    4 small inport holes for the egr gasses. Spark plugs are due also, if they haven't already been done.

    carfax is a 50/50 guess. I've read too many not so good stories about them.

    I love my 2010 Prius with 305, 5XX miles in it!

     
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  6. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    It's never to change the transmission fluid on the Prius transmission. The warning on late transmission fluid changes has to do with automatic transmission using friction material that is worn with detritus in the fluid, There are no bands or clutches in the Prius CVT,

    The only detritus in a Prius CVT is metal worn off the the gears which does not affect the efficiency of the transmission but results in more unwanted wear.
     
  7. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    Transmission isn't going to break, don't worry about it.

    Fluid change won't hurt, but don't freak out that it hasn't already happened.

    A Prius is far more gentle to its transmission fluid than most cars, so it can last far longer without penalty.

    As far as your battery goes? I probably wouldn't spend any money on reconditioning a 2010 battery at this point, just use up what's left and save your pennies for the next one. You could get some nice easy years out of it without ever needing to spend that money, but be ready all the same.
     
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  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    here's one video, there are many, and many threads here. make sure you do the intake manifold ports at the same time, they can clog and nothing else works even if clean.

    watch
     
  9. Doug McC

    Doug McC Active Member

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    Don’t be too concerned about Carfax not showing some maintenance item. I maintained my F250 meticulously (through Ford Dealerships) and some of the items didn’t show up on carfax even from the best dealerships.
     
  10. Priipriii

    Priipriii Member

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    Hey OP, congrats on the prius.

    But heres a cool thing you should know about any hybrid car with a eCVT transmission. They will NEVER break from not changing transmission fluid, ever. The only reason that happens to regular transmissions is because there needs to be grip to catch different gears. Hence they use clutch pads and they wear out faster from gritty transmission fluid and changing it can slush the grit around and cause it to slip.

    Even worse, CVT transmissions which have a belt. That belt is delicate and made of numerous metal plates in a band. They constantly pull and any shaving particles in the fluid can cause destruction. Mostly due to overheating, but its inevitable for those transmissions to go out because metal belts can only pull for so long before they get warped on the microscopicle level till they snap or cant pull no more.

    ECVT is all magnet. Electromagnetism. Like your blender, washing machine, powertools, fans, ebikes, etc. Dirty fluid or clean fluid, it doesnt matter. Its only purpose is to dissipate heat away to the radiator. As long as it HAS fluid, thats all that matters. If not, youll burn out the copper wires, as with any electric motor thats been overheated. But the prius has a fuse to prevent too much electricity from killing it like that.

    My car had 300k+ miles and fluid was never changed. I changed it myself eventually, and its not the easiest thing because you drain and then fill from the overfill plug which is sideways. So youll need a long tube and a funnel or syringe. I put regular auto transmission fluid, whichever i found to be the cheapest. Doesnt matter, even engine oil will work, but i wouldnt try it. The viscosity does make a difference and so does the heat soaking properties. Id worry about if your headgasket is fine before anything else.
     
  11. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Change the transaxle fluid. If the brake fluids never been changed I’d look into that as well. Check EGR too: if it’s never been touched pretty a slam dunk it’ll be socked in with carbon.

    more info in my signature.
     
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  12. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan New Member

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    Thank you! Awesome, sounds like I shouldn't be concerned either way. I was also worried that maybe the fluid had been changed but they used the wrong fluid, I've seen a few posts about using the wrong (not Toyota branded) transmission fluid could be bad for it so I was also a bit worried about that. Sounds like it's kind of optional either way, so not the most urgent thing I need to work on.

    Thank you! The transaxle fluid is new to me, so I'll check on that for sure. A couple people also mentioned the EGR so I'll also look at that. I'm hoping these can be done at home, because I don't know how to find a good hybrid mechanic since everything seems a lot different than a normal car, and I don't really want to pay Toyota Dealership prices. Checking the brakes was on my list, I've heard a couple minor screeches but I don't know if they're the brakes or not. I had a pre-purchase vehicle inspection done, I assumed he looked at the brakes but now that I think about it I didn't mention it and neither did he. I'll add checking the brake fluid. I think I also need to get the tire sensors reset since the TPMS won't go off, even after I fill the tires. Other than that I think I'll be good. I do want to get the windows tinted partially for privacy but partially because it's really hot in Dallas right now... Thanks again for your help!
     
  13. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan New Member

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    That's good to know, thank you! There are a couple other things that I was a bit concerned I didn't see on there, like brake replacements but I don't think Prius have "normal" brakes so I wouldn't have a clue.
     
  14. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    It’s doable. :)
     
  15. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    The ATF-WS fluid in there is a lubricant. It does have to keep the gears and bearings from wearing out. It also gets poured over the electric windings for the two motors to cool those off. It carries that heat to the aluminum case, where the heat gets transferred to the pink coolant, which takes it to the radiator.

    The ATF-WS has to be a good lubricant, and it also has to not eat the insulating varnish on the electric windings. If the varnish gets damaged, a small short can start somewhere, and progress to a bigger motor burnout.

    There isn't anywhere the Prius could have a fuse to stop that from happening: because the rotors are made with permanent magnets, once there is any short in the copper windings anywhere, there is a current loop right inside the motor itself any time the rotor turns. There's nothing for it but to replace the stator (or the whole transaxle). Gen 1 cars used to need that now and then. It seems to happen less in the later generations.

    Some have suspected that if the ATF-WS is very old and chemically degraded, it could be more aggressive to the insulating varnish, which would be a reason for changing it. I don't know if that's really a thing or not. I changed mine.
     
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  16. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    Sure, run 90w gear lube in the Prius transmission. It doesn't matter.... because it's not there car.
    It does NEED the correct fliud. It keeps the electric motors turning correctly, lubs the bearings,
    protect the electric wiring around and in the motors.
    It does break down over time and miles. Since it's very good fliud, it will last a long time.
    WHY would you want to risk YOUR transmission with cheat incorrect fluid????
    The fluid is not that expensive, just get the correct fluid, and amount, and don't worry about it
    for 50,000 miles or so... (y)
     
  17. Priipriii

    Priipriii Member

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    Ah i did not know that, thank you for the explanation. I have seen a few pictures of broken hybrid transmissions and they are all some variation of the copper windings burnt to brown. I believe earlier generation models. Not sure if this was caused by old or insufficient fluid or not, but hybrids generally tend to be problem free when it comes to transmissions. Hence the reputation on their longetivity and also the lack of transmission breaking posts.

    Also to the other guy, i dont actually advise to put straight oil lol. Im only exaggerating to move the point home how undestructable these transmissions are. But i have used cheap ATF on my car and on the front it claims works on toyota hybrids in the small print. The car itself is cheap so im not too bothered if i break my car because thats an opportunity for me to go to the junkyard and get another transmission to replace with. Every junkyard i been to, the transmission is always still intact lol, only the engine and cat are missing which again further concretes the idea that these things wont fail for me
     
  18. Georgina Rudkus

    Georgina Rudkus Senior Member

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    Transmission fluid needs to circulate to carry away heat as it functions 90w fluid will flow very slowly compared to WS. As such heat will be retained and heat causes premature breakdown of the insulation in the copper coils of the motors and degradation of the electronic components in the inverter. The life of the entire transmission and inverter is therefore shortened.
     
  19. Daniel Sullivan

    Daniel Sullivan New Member

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    I just realized that the transaxle is the same thing as the transmission...

    I'm going to change the transmission fluid, since it seems like even if it has never been changed it's not similar to other transmissions that I might do more harm than good. Brakes are down to 4mm so when I change those in the next month or so I'll also have them change the brake fluid. I'll check the EGR system to see if it needs maintenance.

    I've put about 1500 miles on my Prius already, and I know I'm definitely going to have a Prius for life. Because of work I might need a truck or off-road capable vehicle as well, but I'll always have a Prius in the family, my favorite car I've ever had.

    I'm still trying to decide if I go Lithium or just do battery reconditioning, it's hot as hell in Dallas and I notice I lose about 20% MPG (from 47-48 down to about 40) just trying to keep the car cool enough, and even with that I notice a huge difference in battery performance (much weaker acceleration, and dies within a minute) when it's hot as balls out vs at night. I know Lithium has better performance when it's really hot, and also can blast A/C for a half hour without ICE turning on (at least from what I've read) - but It's a pricier upgrade so I might just ride out the summer and think about it next year. I'm expecting/hoping to be able to put 130k+ (and get over 300k) miles on this Prius, and don't really want to buy a Lithium battery if I'm not going to get the full life out of it. I know they guarantee 30k or something, but I can't find info about how many miles the Lithium batteries last. Definitely don't want to have to replace the battery twice, but also don't want to replace it too late and not get the full "life" out of the battery before I have to get rid of it. Or maybe I just keep both batteries and when it's time to move to another Prius, but the NiMH back in, and keep the Lithium for the next car. Idk, kinda just thinking out loud.

    Doesn't help that my car is black, and doesn't have any tint. I'm thinking that's another thing I'll do. Also the paint is in the early stages of sun damage, there's a few spots about the size of an iphone where the clear coat is bubbling off, so either I sand and respray some 2k, or I just wrap it white which is what I think I'll do since that'll help with the Dallas sun. Headlights are getting pretty blurry so I'll get that done too.
     
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  20. AnthonyCaine

    AnthonyCaine New Member

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    So, how did it go? Did the fluid smell burnt? Did gears start slipping?

    My 2012 Prius almost have 170k miles on it and I've never even thought of the transmission fluid until now and I'm about to move CO to AZ towing a small load and panicking.