The Denial Industry

Steven Miloy is the king of this garbage! I'd almost be willing to lump him in with Bjorn Lomberg as well.

 

There is no doubt that there has been a rise in temperature, however, there is still debate as to the root cause of this. Certainly pollution and human overpopulation is not helping matters, but what is the root cause and where should global efforts be concentrated? Those are the questions to answer.

 

blah blah blah... just as fake as the IPCC

 

Unfortunately for us, the rest of the scientific community sees the effects of climate change on a daily basis so your point is moot. Glacial melt and rapid ocean acidification cannot be ignored no matter how much you pay a think tank to spin the data.

 

you think this happens because people own cars? give me a break! The earthe does whatever it wants to, with or without you owning a hummer OR a prius...

Climate change is nothing but a marketing machine.

 

If ignorance is bliss, you must be very happy.

 

Do you know how our atmoshpere was created and maintained? Can you explain the global carbon cycle and the amounts of carbon that is added and taken out of the system annually? I'm trying to get a better understanding of how you can know these things yet be so dismissive of nearly every scientist that has looked into this sort of thing.

 

Explain to me the fact that it was considerably hotter on this planet hundreds of years ago.

Explain ice ages...

Explain the fact the north america is experiencing the coldest winter in 50 years.

Buy a prius if you like the car and you want to save your pennies at the pump.. not for any other reason.

 

Exactly how bad does it have to get before I can say "Told you so."?

Try using the search and reading the other threads that have been done to death. All of your above questions have been answered and then some.

 

#1 Which period are speaking of specifically and I will try my best to explain it to you.

#2 Can you clarify "Exlain Ice Ages"? I can give you various criteria that would explain why ice ages occured in the past and will continue to occur but I want to know; are you asking about earth orbit and tilt angles (like Milankovitch cycles) or are you refering to atmospheric gas composition due to volcanism, meteor impacts, vegetative die-off etc.? Are you expecting me to say that these conditions were not natural? or in some cases cyclical like Milankovitch cycles? I can give you lot of information on how the earth can swing between periods of extreme heat and high CO2/CH4 levels and extreme cold (snowball earth) with low CO2/CH4 levels. Here is some basic reading on the subject:

Milankovitch Theory from NOAA

Milankovitch Theory from Wiki (explains it better and even has some arguments)

Snowball Earth (direct website. Very detailed but biased)

Snowball Earth (Wiki article which explains how the earth can break in and out of glaciation cycles)

*note* the Snowball Earth idea is hotly debated but my point in referencing them is it provides examples of how ice ages can be affected by GHG accumulations as well as ocean chemical compostition.


#3 Global warming does not state that everywhere on the planet will see warmer temps all of the time. The weather patterns will be wamer globally yet some areas may get cooler while others get substantially warmer. Weather will change sufficiently enough to cause vegetative differences due to increased temps and a change in rainfall patterns. I.E. In California it is believed that we will see wetter winters and drier summers with much less snowpack. This would create a severe water shortage throughout the central valley regions and southern California in particular unless storage units (reservoirs) were created all over the place and imparting their own type of ecological/ infrastrucural problems. Can you point me to the paper that your conclusion is based on (that we are experiencing the coldest winter in 50 years)? I'd like to see the exact details of this analysis.

This is a great website (OZCoasts & OZEstuaries) for a wide range of information on global climate change, ecological systems, and oceanic chemistry (CO2 cycles, ocean acidification etc.) Here are some quick links for you from this site: If the links do not work simply hit F5 (on the linked site) a couple times and they will.

Global Warming

Ocean Acidification

I really like how this picture provides a great example of how ocean acidification can affect calcifying organisms. These organisms provide the basis for nearly all ocean life and in many cases provide a large portion of our oxygen and carbon sequestion.

Figure 3. a, b, d, e, Emiliania huxleyi ; and c, f, Gephyrocapsa oceanica collected from cultures incubated at [CO2] ≈ 12 µ mol l -1 ( a – c ) and at [CO2] ≈ 30–33 µ mol l -1 ( d – f ), corresponding to p CO2 levels of about 300 p.p.m.v. and 780–850 p.p.m.v., respectively. Scale bars represent 1 µ m. Note the difference in the coccolith structure (including distinct malformations) and in the degree of calcification of cells grown at normal and elevated CO2 levels. Pictures are selected from a large set of SEM photographs to depict the general trend in coccolith calcification. As the culture medium was super-saturated with respect to calcium carbonate under all experimental conditions, post-formation calcite dissolution is not expected to have occurred. Reprinted by permission from Macmillan Publishers Ltd: Nature, Riebesell et al. 2000 [5]

 

Yes, we all fully understand that the earth starts and finishes just off the east and west coasts of the USA, the ocean is only there to make the sunsets look great and to stop the sun setting the trees on fire when it sets. Oh it's also handy for fishing in.

 

I don't respond to cut and pastes from Wikipedia yadda yadda... how weak...

 

You did not answer one of my questions (the point being so I could answer your questions) or even refute a point. I added Wikipedia links so you would easily understand the data as opposed to formally citing sources of which you likely could not access (scientific journals). Nothing was copied and pasted from Wikipedia except a link. The copied and pasted parts came from a NOAA source (which I linked) and Figure 3. Can from OZCoasts and the original paper by Reibesell et al. 2000.

So now would you like to show the rest of the class how ignorant of the subject you are or would you rather continue to belittle my post?

I have 20 peer-reviewed papers on ocean acidification sitting in front of me that I can refer you to if you'd rather take the high road and go learn something.

List or 7 to get you started:

1) Archer D. 2006. Positive feedbacks from the carbon cycle. http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2006/05/positive-feedbacks-from-the-carbon-cycle/
2) Dayton PK. 1990. Polar Oceanography, Part B: Chemistry, Biology and Geology. 631–-685.
3) Granum E, Raven JA, Leegood RC. 2005. How do marine diatoms fix 10 billion tonnes of inorganic carbon per year? Canadian Journal of Botany 83:898-908
4) Katz ME, Pak DK, Dickens GR, Miller KG. 1999. The source and fate of massive carbon input during the latest Paleocene Thermal maximum. Science 286:1531-3
5) Orr JC, Fabry VJ, Aumont O, Bopp L, Doney SC, Feely R, Gnanadesikan A, Gruber N, Ishida I, Joos F, et al. 2005. Anthropogenic ocean acidification over the twenty-first century and its impact on calcifying organisms. Nature 437:681-6
6) Pelejero C., Calvo, E., McCulloch MT., Marshall JF., Gagan MK., Lough JM., Opdyke BN. 2005. Preindustrial to Modern Interdecadal Variability in Coral Reef pH. Science 309:2204-07
7) Riebesell U, Zondervan I, Rost B, Tortell PD, Zeebe RE, Morel MM. 2000. Reduced calcification of marine plankton in response to increased atmospheric CO2. Nature 407:364-7

 

You dont get it... there's no way that you can prove that any of this BS is tied to people driving cars. That's a fact.

"Man Made" global warming is a THEORY -and more recently a MARKETING TOOL.

There's nothing to debate because you know what I'm saying is correct. You can cut and paste a million links from Wikipedia and it wont change the fact that you're nothing more than part of a marketing campaign.

"Don't believe the hype".

 

You've succumbed to marketing yourself. Check out:
Smoke Mirrors and Hot Air

 

Ok, I'm done with you. You obviously do not have the education nor the care to understand such things. Be well.

 

Oh... that MUST be it

 

I suppose you're right. He'd have to establish that cars or the making or use of cars somehow did something that impacted the earths energy budget, made an evil warmifying gas or something. If the earths atmosphere was able to change to retain greater or lesser amounts of heat at different times he might have a chance I suppose. It's a good thing nothing we do can ever make any difference.