1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Federal Budget Deficit is Large......

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by malorn, Feb 18, 2008.

  1. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    The federal budget is out of control and the deficit in Bush's budget is $400 billion. The US trade deficit with the world was double that in 2007. Yes double. That is how China, Japan etal can loan us our money back to fund the budget deficit.
     
  2. TonyPSchaefer

    TonyPSchaefer Your Friendly Moderator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2004
    14,816
    2,498
    66
    Location:
    Far-North Chicagoland
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Advanced
    I'm assuming this is personal opinion?
     
  3. EJFB1029

    EJFB1029 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2008
    4,726
    206
    0
    Location:
    Corpus Christi, Republic of Texas
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Bush has destroyed the country's ability to recover, he has created a debt that will hinder the country's future. We have a National Debt that is dependent on foreign countries to buy the bonds, a National Debt that keeps growing due to a created war of occupation, and a National Debt that keeps growing due to the worst president in US history.
     
  4. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    U.S. National Debt Clock
    budget deficit link
    FTD - Congressional Highlights
    US trade Deficit of Goods in 2007
    In adjusted dollars the trade deficit with Japan is $1,915,941,000,000 since only 1985.

    The US Trade deficit with the world since 1985 is $8,231,884,000,000 since only 1985 in adjusted dollars.

    Those deficits are in trillions of dollars. It is amazing the correlation between trade deficit and budget deficit.
     
  5. qbee42

    qbee42 My other car is a boat

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2006
    18,058
    3,074
    7
    Location:
    Northern Michigan
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    It's not "our" money that they are loaning back. It's their money that we gave to them in trade. They didn't steal it from us; no one made us do it. You can scream and complain about the fairness of their tactics and protectionist markets, but at the end of the day we willingly hand over the money to buy their goods. We either have to change our ways or wait for global economics to level the playing field (which might not be much fun for us).

    Tom
     
  6. nerfer

    nerfer A young senior member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2006
    2,507
    236
    28
    Location:
    Chicagoland, IL, USA, Earth
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Hmm, you're concerned about the trade deficit. You know the single largest item we import is petroleum, which at 9.8 million barrels/day is now 55% of our trade imbalance, and climbing? URL, URL

    I'd rather be sending my money to Japan than to Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, Angola, Nigeria (among the top 6 oil importers).
     
  7. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    First of all your data is wrong,
    http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/Press-Release/current_press_release/exh9.pdf

    Deficit is $815,582,000,000 petroleum share is $293,532,000,000. Isn't that 36% even with oil at $90/barrel?
     
  8. patrickindallas

    patrickindallas Shire rat

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    676
    36
    0
    Location:
    Vancouver, WA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Quick!!!:eek:

    1. Go through your house and throw out absolutely everything that was not entirely manufactured in the US of A.

    2. Put it all by the curb (under a tarp, if you don't mind).

    3. PM me your address.

    4. I'll be over to pick it up later.:)

    We live in a global market now.

    Your little bit of naïveté has grown a bit long in the tooth.
     
  9. burritos

    burritos Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2006
    4,946
    252
    0
    Location:
    California
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    Huh what? Did you say the house is on fire? F it, we're all gonna continue to sit on the couch, stuff our pie holes with potato chips and switch the remote control between survivor and american idol.
     
  10. patrickindallas

    patrickindallas Shire rat

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2007
    676
    36
    0
    Location:
    Vancouver, WA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
  11. Marlin

    Marlin New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2005
    1,407
    10
    0
    Location:
    Bucks County, PA
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    You need to cast your net a little wider. Bush doesn't actually create the budget, or the debt for that matter. Congess does. Granted, the Bush administration suggests a budget to Congress, and Bush holds some influence in Congress, and some of Bush's actions, such as the Iraq War, require money from the budget to be spent, but Bush doesn't actually create or pass the budget. This year it will be the Democrat controlled Senate and House that will create and pass the budget. Not one penny will be spent that hasn't been blessed by the Democrats (and Republicans) in Congress.

    So, if you direct all your anger about the budget at Bush, then your aim is off. You're ignoring the people who actually wield the budgeting power. The ones who will still be in office 8 months from now.
     
  12. MarinJohn

    MarinJohn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2004
    3,945
    304
    0
    And to think we had a large budget surplus only 7 years ago! I say, tax the passive income higher than earned income, no 'special treatment for capital gains, and make a huge inheritance tax on estates over some large amount (1,000,000,000?). People who then begin to shelter money overseas? Rescind their US citizenship and freeze their assets. Corporations claim to be nothing more than individual citizens so tax them at the same rates on GROSS income. There is a diabolical reason for these deficits. It ties the hands of presidents who want to do good for the majority of the population, like rebuild schools, roads, hospitals etc.. We need TWO budgets. One for when Rs are in power and one for when Ds are in power. That way you cut the diabolical thinkers off at the knees.
     
  13. boulder_bum

    boulder_bum Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2007
    1,371
    38
    0
    Location:
    Castle Rock, CO
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    I'm actually very frustrated with the budget deficit and trade imbalance.

    The United States as a country is sort of like a sub-prime borrower getting an interest only ARM for a house they couldn't afford. It's going to blow up in our face in a big way in the coming decades.

    The sort of phenomenon we see now were never inevitable, they're just the result of corrupt, short-sighted "leaders" adjusting policy to favor the social elite. Be it massive tax cuts on the rich or the destruction of trade barriers which allow corporations to close shop in America and run sweatshops in China, we've seen our country slowly dismantled for the profit of a few.

    If you think the trillion dollars flowing out of our country is scary, just wait until China grows thirsty for the dwindling supply of oil that is America's lifeline (thanks to government policy favoring oil and auto companies). Maybe China will get a chance to use all the equipment they're buying up in their explosive military build-up we financed with our trade dollars and debt.
     
  14. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    In one respect, everyone wants to bring their goods and sell them in the USA. Just a one way street with way too many countries. Global market connotates every one buing and selling not just one country buying for years and years and years.
     
  15. burritos

    burritos Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2006
    4,946
    252
    0
    Location:
    California
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    Who's stoopider? The borrower who borrows more than he can afford? or the lender who lends to this idiot borrower who obviously is going to default on the loan?

    And WHEN(not if) we default, what's China gonna do, send Vinny over here and bust some skulls? Nope. Nothing will happen.

    They'll certainly have a lot of financial leverage and the deck stacked in their favor to replace us as the next world power. Hell they are already laying the groundwork to do so ala resource extraction in Africa:

    China's Influence in Africa: Implications for the United States

    Good for them. Let's become the next outdated british empire. They are doing just fine without all the empire bs.
     
  16. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    The leaders are either corrupt and/or don't understand the consequences of these policies. If people are continually told the trade deficit does not matter, eventually they will believe exactly that. Honestly I am amazed how many folks on here have no understanding of the trade deficit, how it happens, what it means, and what the consequences will be.

    I have to admit, that I was misinformed about much of the deficit and the issues surrounding it and its effects until i really started investigating for myself.
     
  17. Godiva

    Godiva AmeriKan Citizen

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2005
    10,339
    14
    0
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Saudi Arabia was ranked #4 in Parade's top ten world dictators.

    Japan didn't even make the list.

    Who would I rather do business with?

    And.....it's all BUSH's fault. Let us all, please, remember the leadership of the GOP for the next 16 years at the very least. It will take us that long to clean up the mess.

    Malorn is getting monotonous.
     
  18. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Hi Godiva, I certainly am also in favor of getting away from OPEC dependency(and all of the negative consequences) asap. I also agree that Republican policies are in most cases worse for us when it comes to trade than those of Democrats. On the other hand NAFTA happened while clinton was President and I find it more than a coincidence that he had so many ties to the Chinese during his terms and now we have an absolutely staggerning trade deficit with the Chinese. Bush is still under the assumption that our trade policies are helping us economically, at least Clinton knew he was selling his soul.

    As far as my growing monotonous, I will stop when someone in Washington gets a clue. I could retire today and never have to work again, but I am very worried about my children and subsequent generations.
     
  19. nerfer

    nerfer A young senior member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2006
    2,507
    236
    28
    Location:
    Chicagoland, IL, USA, Earth
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    You are correct, I don't know where my first link got the numbers that were used. By December though, it had increased to about 45% of the trade deficit, so 55% is non-petroleum as of the last monthly report.

    Still, petroleum is our largest single import by dollars. I agree, our trade deficit is definitely something to be concerned about, but we see different targets.
     
  20. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    4,281
    59
    0
    Location:
    "Somewhere in Flyover Country"
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Both components of the trade deficit need to be handled. The US needs to institute an energy policy that provides major incentives for ways to conserve and implement alternative energy into all new construction, retrofitting into existing buildings and continues to imporve upon existing alternative energy technologies and searches for new alternative energy supplies.
    The government also needs to make all trade policies 100% reciprical when it comes to tariffs, impediments to markets, unfair trade practices including "dumping" and institute a puntitive tariff on goods which receive the benefit of foreign govenment support(shipping, low interest loans etc).