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Don't fly American if you have any health issues...

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by apriusfan, Feb 25, 2008.

  1. apriusfan

    apriusfan New Member

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    This little gem was too much to pass up: Relatives angry over death on airliner - News - MSNBC.com

    I don't want to jump to conclusions, but... if the doctor(s) who were on the plane confirm the malfunction/empty status of the O2 bottles, American is facing some non-trivial liability.
     
  2. Neicy

    Neicy Member

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    As well they should. No excuse for 2 empty O2 bottles AND a malfunctioning defibrillator.
     
  3. apriusfan

    apriusfan New Member

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    It seems that American is wanting to blame the flight attendants for checking the status of the O2 bottles. I wonder how you check the status of the O2 bottles? Not meaning to be flippant, but how do you truly check the fill status? The gauge could be malfunctioning; how would a flight attendant know that the gauge was working or not? Sample the contents? Or????

    Disclosure: I am at present very down on airlines and health hazards that the airlines seem to be propagating - I am almost certain to have been exposed to a really nasty flu bug on a recent airplane ride that I took for business. Reading about how the O2 bottles (that are supposed to be part of the medical kit on the plane) were apparently empty was too much.

    Maybe, just maybe, deregulation has gone amuck.
     
  4. JimboK

    JimboK One owner, low mileage

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    A malfunctioning gauge is certainly a possibility, but in my 34 years in emergency medical services, I don't recall ever seeing one unless it was physically damaged (which would be self-evident). Regardless, a gauge would be -- indeed, should be -- checked easily enough by replacing a tank that reads low. If a new, freshly unsealed tank shows the same reading, one can safely conclude the gauge is bad.

    Whether the tank or the gauge (and assuming all the facts as reported are accurate), there is no excuse. There should be a process in place for regularly checking tanks, replacing those found low, and reporting problems like a bad gauge.
     
  5. hyo silver

    hyo silver Awaaaaay

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    So many people complain about getting sick on a flight, I'm amazed nothing is done about it. Would it be that difficult to install an ultraviolet light in the air circulation system to kill the germs and mould, and maybe change the filters once in a while?
     
  6. apriusfan

    apriusfan New Member

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    I guess the question comes down to American's inspection protocol and whether flight attendants are qualified to inspect the medical kit on the airplane (I certainly wouldn't have them inspect the engines for problems). If the O2 bottles were in fact empty, it would seem that the flight attendants are not qualified to do the inspections (or, at least not the ones on the flight at issue). Regardless, if the O2 bottles were in fact empty, American has one big problem on its hands. I wonder how many empty O2 bottles are on other American airplanes?
     
  7. apriusfan

    apriusfan New Member

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    But it would seem that the UV light requires power to operate and power generation increases fuel consumption.
     
  8. Rae Vynn

    Rae Vynn Artist In Residence

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    Catching a "bug" on a flight is very easy, as the air is very dehydrating. Dried out mucus membranes (like the ones lining your sinus) allow germs/virii to pass through very easily--much more easily than you would experience "on the ground".

    What you can do: Drink water. Lots of it. Every chance you get. Pass up on soda and alcohol (and coffee, darn it) while flying. Have a fruit juice if the boredom factor gets to be too much.

    You can also moisturize your sinuses while flying, using a nasal spray that contains saline (no chemicals... not looking to get you hooked here. Plus, the nasal 'decongestants' destroy your membrane's ability to function, too) or a water-based lubricant, like KY jelly.

    I use Emergen'C and Airborne a LOT... especially when flying. I'll dump a packet into the little glasses of water they bring me.

    Oh, and wash your hands. The germs off the restroom doors, the armrests of the seats, etc., have an easier time in the dry air. Wash them when you use the restroom, and when you get off the flight, go to the restroom and wash your hands again.

    If you have a lot of problems with getting sick on flights, consider investing in a neti pot, and use it when you land/arrive at your hotel/home.

    YMMV
     
  9. jammin012

    jammin012 The man behind The Man

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    As it's turing out American had 6 full bottles onboard. The doc taking care of the patient chose not to use the bottle as intended but to hand pump the O2.

    If the doc's in charge American is at no fault.

    Bill O'Reily told me so.
     
  10. apriusfan

    apriusfan New Member

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    Interesting how the story is evolving. Originally, there were supposed to be 8 O2 bottles on the plane. Now 6 full ones? Perhaps that is not inconsistent (especially if O'Reily said so): 6 full bottles + 2 empty bottles = 8 total bottles. It is unfortunate for American if that is in fact the circumstance, because the 2 empty bottles were used in the failed attempt to administer oxygen in the incident.

    Also, the doc being present does not relieve American of liability for having 2 empty bottles of oxygen on hand. This is not about a majority of full bottles being on hand - every one of the O2 bottles must be full and the dispensing valve on every bottle must be in working condition per specification for the valve.

    I am still waiting to hear from the doctor that attempted to revive the passenger.
     
  11. IsrAmeriPrius

    IsrAmeriPrius Progressive Member

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    The airline presented its side today:

    Airline disputes cousin's story of death
    [excerpts]
    I happen to have some inside connections at AA. According to internal communications, the passenger was administered bottled oxygen and the defibrillator worked as intended.
    The plane in question was an Airbus A300. There are twelve oxygen bottles on board. Even if two were empty, which is HIGHLY unlikely, there were ten more. The defibrillator is practically foolproof. It is checked prior to each flight by the purser and, usually, one or more additional crew members. If it is not working the battery is immediately changed or they get a replacement unit.

    It is extremely unfortunate someone died in flight. However, keep in mind that blaming the crew and the airline is a tempting way to win the law suit lottery.

    Pay attention to the detail of the cousin's story. They did CPR after the oxygen supposedly 'didn't work'. That right there tells you the storyteller is medically naive; you don't use oxygen on a person who isn't breathing, first you do CPR.

    Then take into consideration that with two doctors and two nurses on board, the pilot did not divert to Miami; the medical professionals clearly advised the cockpit that there was no reason to land. The lady was already dead, beyond any help.

    Add that the coroner ruled death by natural causes and the doctors and nurses made no statements to back up the decedent's family's.

    What we have is the media circus centered on a medically ignorant, distressed, grieving, hysterical family member, in denial, who is accusing the airline. Absolutely no one else has corroborated his version of the events.
     
  12. Godiva

    Godiva AmeriKan Citizen

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    Was Westland/Hallmark beef also on the menu?
     
  13. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
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    Death is sad, but the story, even as stated by the family, suggests an acute event that no amount of oxygen or any defibrillator would have resulted in a positive outcome. Bad things happen, but that doesn't mean someone's at fault. An airplane is not an ER and a level of care cannot be expected to come anywhere close to that level...What use do you think a pediatrician is really going to be there?
     
  14. Wildkow

    Wildkow New Member

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    The defib's are programmed not to give a shock IF a heartbeat is present.

    Wildkow
     
  15. fred

    fred New Member

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    and of course the press did not report it accurately nor in full as ususal. they do not have to be held accountable to anyone. they just seem to be the non elected pervayors of what they want us to believe.
     
  16. JimboK

    JimboK One owner, low mileage

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    Taking Wildkow's comment a bit further ...

    Not all cardiac arrest patients are in ventricular fibrillation, and of those that are, VF may not be "coarse" enough for an automated external defibrillator to recognize it. To avoid shocking a rhythm that shouldn't be shocked, the AED's decision-making algorithm, by design, ignores organized heart rhythms and "fine" VF that actually is more likely to be a non-shockable rhythm.

    As AEDs become more common in public places, it's important for everyone to realize that there will be many instances where an AED appropriately refuses to shock what it senses as a non-shockable rhythm.
     
  17. IsrAmeriPrius

    IsrAmeriPrius Progressive Member

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    From American Airlines employees newswire:
     
  18. IsrAmeriPrius

    IsrAmeriPrius Progressive Member

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    Additional details.

    The Dallas Morning News:
    Star-Telegram:
     
  19. apriusfan

    apriusfan New Member

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    You might have a point. Back in the early days of deregulation, American was famous for counting the number lettuce leaves in the salads of the in-flight meals as a cost-cutting measure. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to learn that the beef came from Westland/Hallmark - the price would quite likely be right....
     
  20. IsrAmeriPrius

    IsrAmeriPrius Progressive Member

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    Lest we forget that in the 1980's, Robert L. Crandall, then the head of American Airlines, came up with the idea of removing an olive from each dinner salad served on board. He figured that the passengers would never notice or complain and that the airline could save some money. He was right, to the tune of $40,000 a year.