Toyota's labor rate for a Prius tech?

**** why did i pay over 4 grand for a course to find out that mechanics (oh WAIT ITS TECHNICANS NOW!!! ) still get NO respect for their line of work. All you hear me screaming down the hallways is, "we get no smart respect" because damn its the truth, we got puzzles to deal with and if we mess one part of the puzzle wrong, we have to go back all the way back to where you messed up and do it right, unlike other tradesman which have it way easier and get paid more or the same for that matter.

Wow this si like the 3rd career choice I made that I don't want to go back on because i've done it so many times, there was a very good quote that was given to me in my learning to become a tech...

"if your smart enough to be in this trade, your smart enough NOT TO"

smart ouch for a guy like me, i honestly have no choice but to continue doing the jobs that are hard and are underpaid however...

here in bc techs get paid 30 bucks minimum, and more if they are respected, when i was helping out a tech for work term i was helping him reeling in 12-18 hours days daily... and it was 4 on and 3 off work shifts, with 10 hours days and 30 minutes just for lunch. (you could take two 15 minute breaks but since everyone is flat rate its just not recommeneded)

another also said to me, " the human body contains 20000 or so moving parts that hasn't changed since the beggining of humans with the exception of new dieaseses so doctors somewhat has a consistant pattern to deal with, however a car which may contain the same number of parts, changes every day with every new release and its up to us to stay on top else if you want the customer slamming down your throat. OH BUT WAIT TECHS AT A DEALERSHIP has a buffer between the customer and the tech so hey they can do the lousy work all the want because it'll sell more services!!!"

don't even get me started on working old pieces of junk that has rust and bolts breaking down on you **** the worse part is fixing other people's stupid shit when they **** up the job previously and I have to deal with it while the customer thinks it was my fuckup to begin with.

argh what a joke, the worse part is i went to school to get a downgrade in wage, because being an apprentence (actually some guys get fucked around in dealerships before they get their apparenceship!! Which is why i'm going to the shop that rebuilt my prius...) is about proving yourself before you can even get your red seal (which is ASE master tech equilviant), so shitty pay through hard work before seeing some cash on the table. Ha some cash...

its definately just a 3rd party career for now, depending on how it goes it could be a perminant trade or just something for less than 10 years.

don't even get me started on money i have to put down (tools) to even start making money .....


NO RESPECT I TELL YA

 

Toyota gets $90 an hour in my neck of the woods.
I was shocked to see Volkswagen is now getting $100 an hour, and the dopes that work there still cannot follow the manufacture service recommendations.
(They adjusted my headlights, why? Who knows, they were fine before VW touched them. I had to argue with the service writer, and finally break out my owners manual to show them just where the head light adjustments should be. I told them to put them back to factory specs, and that I was not paying to have this done. They readjusted the headlights, at no charge. I filed a complaint with VW, that the dealership has no frigging clue how they are required to maintain a VW Eurovan!)

 

Phil, many, many years ago (Moby DIck was a minnow!) I worked in the automotive trade. I plied my skills on American cars, and found there was little money to be made working on them. So I went to a shop and learned to work on Foreign cars. Money was a little better, but the customers where bigger A-holes! They always wanted their service completed on their time lines, no matter how long the job was going to take. When they got the bills, they normally complained on how much it cost to keep a foreign car. You could explain to them for hours, how much more the parts cost, and that you had to go to schools to learn certain systems on these cars. They just didn't care.
Funny repair story:
I had taken a second job at Sears working nights to help make ends meet back in the '70's. I did what ever came along, but this day I was working the exhaust line. I got done with a front to back job, put the car in the lot and turned in my paperwork. A short while later the manager approached me. "The customer has a complaint about the last car you did." "Yeah, what is it?" "The clamps and hangers weren't part of estimate!" "Yeah, so, he needs them." "Well, he doesn't want to pay for them." "So?" "Pull the car in and take them off." "Are you kidding?" "No!" So I pull the car back in, take off all the clamps and hangers, put the car down, and tell the customer he can pull his own car out of the shop.
(Not Sears policy, but I wasn't moving the car.) The customer no sooner gets past the exit door and the whole system comes down, falling all over the parking lot. I laughed, shook my head and knew he'd be back in bitching. Yup, he walked back into the shop. I told him to pack the parts in the trunk, bring the car around and talk to the service manager. To shorten the story,
stupid paid for the clamps and hangers and the labor (which was free before) to have them put back on!

Nope, you don't get any respect in that line of work.

But the same is often true when you bring your car in for service or a repair and tell them what's wrong. The look at you with "How do you know?" written on their foreheads! Hey, I've been under, over, and nice person deep in too many cars to count, I think I have a clue!

 

sorry bud could have told you that. have you seen my "you wanna know why there are no honest mechanics" thread? that's not uncommon.

ie, you can be one of the dumbasses who works on cars, or the guy who actually fixes cars and is way undervalued and way undercompensated...

for the record, DH went back to school after being the undervalued, underappreciated type for so long. his experience in diagnostics plus this education will take him much farther elsewhere- without 18 hour days 6 days a week to bring home a couple hundred bucks.

again, universal... you'll catch the blame for the cumulative mistakes of everyone who's worked on the car before you... and rust up north usually ends up adding an hour to any undercar job.

we just had to replace part of a transmission housing (fortunately it was replaceable) thanks to some idiot who overtightened a differential plug. the thing was pouring tranny fluid out a crack in the housing.

if you're lucky that will change after 5 years.
do yourself a favor and find a shop with base pay + commission. they're rare but out there. flat rate either screws you over, or turns you into an donkey who sucks up all the paying jobs and leaves the young guys out in the cold. it's a self perpetuating mess.

chain shops, some alignment shops, will help you to get started before jumping into the cold world of flat rate.

yep, that first $20k in tools is the hardest to swallow... a year's income out the door just to start making money. it took us a few years to get even on tools alone but fortunately we only had to pay for 2 of the 10 ASE tests DH has taken.

sorry things are going so rough for ya.


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everyone else... consider this a peek into the world of fixing cars. clueless idiots deserve no sympathy, but the hardworking types who are just trying to put food on the table are worked too hard and not paid for the overtime either.

if you find a good tech, be nice to the guy.

 

So, the bottom line is: good hobby, poor career choice...

 

yes indeed. if you like having money and spending time with your family.

it's not *all* bad... some limited-scope repair shops pay base rate and percent commission. we lived pretty well when DH worked in a place like that. but it's not as mentally challenging and so he wasn't as satisfied with his work.

this is why he belongs in school for something more...

 

It all sounds pretty sad. It's work that someone loves doing. Yet, besides the relatively low pay, it sounds as if the typical working conditions that a mechanic/tech faces may make the job itself unenjoyable.

With so many government agencies using fleets of Prius and other cars, I'm wondering if being a mechanic/tech with a government agency (to the extent such jobs exist) would be better than being a mechanic/tech in the private sector. If such government jobs exist, I'm thinking that the pay, benefits and working conditions must be a lot better than the private sector.

 

Wow, there's a lot of angry people in this thread. Maybe I'm still too new to this line of work, I still love it. I went through Toyota's T-Ten program and I've been with the same dealership since. I started out part time doing oil changes and PDI's. I've been the shop foreman now for the last four years. Yes, this line of work has it's fair share of sh*t to shovel but what job doesn't? The gratification I get when I solve a problem or the look on one of my technician's faces when they fix a vehicle that they weren't sure they could makes it worth it. Our techs are well paid for our area. Plus we give education incentives for training and ASE certifications. We have a small crew (6 including myself) but we have very loyal customers. It has taken many years to build our customer base but our biggest advantage is our continuous effort to break the stereotype of repair facilities/dealerships. Trust is hard to come by in this field and the first step is honesty. We don't try to BS our customers. We've been known to "down sell" work. A customer will come in with a repair they want(front pads on a Prius perhaps) and instead of blindly doing it we'll inspect the vehicle and advise the customer if they really don't need it before we do any work.

Admittedly for the amount of knowledge a Master Tech has to acquire I do feel the pay is not what it should be. I like the earlier reference to the human body never changing and automobiles constant state of change. I've used that comparison before myself. Toyota's wiring diagrams these days are as thick as the repair manuals of ten years ago just for example.

I just really enjoy the bond between my co-workers and our customers and I hate that in this industry this view is in the minority.

 

Hi Paul,

Thanks for providing a different perspective. Its not always easy to find an honest service organization and I am sure that your customers appreciate your business practices.

I'm interested in learning more about the economics of the car repair business:

• What is the hourly labor rate in your area, and what proportion of that does the technician get?
• Galaxee made earlier reference to the need for her DH to purchase $20K in tools. Is that required in all cases? It would seem that many of those tools are for specialty jobs and infrequently used.
• Is it reasonable for techs to specialize so that they don't have to acquire and pay for a full set of tools?
• What tools will the dealership pay for, vs. tools that the tech must pay for?

A further question: Suppose your customer comes in with a thorny intermittent problem. It could be as simple as an HID headlight not working, or as complex as uncontrolled acceleration.

The customer cannot demonstrate the problem to the service writer but asserts with great emotional force that the problem exists. How would your service dept handle that customer?

 

I've tried VW, Porsche-Audi, Toyota, Peugeot, and Subaru, along with a handful of independent shops that specialized in German makes. Enjoyed working on all of them (well, maybe not the French cars so much) but finally started teaching Automotive Technology. After 7 years of that, I realized that my employers were strictly business oriented and did not really give a sh*t if the majority of their students could actually do more than tires and general maintenance after graduation. I finally saw the light and got a gub'ment job for a police dept on a small, exclusive FL barrier island. Pay and benefits are better than anywhere I have seen in the private sector and no more pressure to perform. 2 of us maintain around 50 vehicles work on everything from video systems to robots and firearms. Crown Vics are the easiest vehicles to maintain and once a year we get to outfit 4 new cars with the very latest in electronics and video systems. We do have 1 Camry and are discussing adding a few Prii to our Parking Control fleet.

 

that's a great thing that some shops do- as i mentioned earlier, we only paid for 2 of DH's 10 ASE certifications. the dealership offered to pay for other things like EPA certifications and such for refrigerant, that he just never got around to taking.

that's wonderful that your employer will allow that.

DH was constantly fearing for his job security (he worked at a very large dealership), because he did not upsell jobs that did not need to be done. of course, it did not help the paycheck either. he would educate the unknowing customers but was happy to over-service someone's car if they absolutely insisted and understood it was not necessary.

and he did not receive any compensation for educating his customers, of course. he especially spent a lot of time on this with the local hybrid owners. and there are a lot of them...

don't get me wrong. DH was very happy fixing cars, and he would not have left if not for the extreme situation he was in. but again, the long hours and long weeks and incredible demand that was placed upon him was not worth the money. we found he could go back to school for 1.5 years and make more than he did as an experienced tech to start. no investment except tuition, books, and time. no heavy lifting. no 100% commission that dries up from january-march. a far lower risk of hurting himself, etc.

i'm glad there are people like you out there who are very happy at your job and do good work. we need people like that. it also looks like your service department is a good, trustworthy employer.

 

i know you addressed this to paul, but i'll give you DH's answer.

most techs buy well over $50k in tools, and purchase more as they become well versed in different types of service.
as tight as things were for us most of the time, we spent just under $30k in professional tools. (his coworkers thought he was horribly deprived.) i would guess that in his entire tenure of car-fixing jobs, we probably spent just over $40k but that's over 10 or so years.

you always need a basic set and a toolbox to keep them secure. we're still talking many thousands of dollars to get up and off the ground.

"specialized" in the industry typically means general repair vs transmission shops vs alignment shops. in general repair, everything gets thrown at you so you need a little bit of everything.

you can get away without some types of specialized tools, but most of the time they make the jobs go much quicker. flat rate makes it essential to have the tools that give you the edge on time.

the dealership pays for many toyota sst's. but techs are wholly responsible for having their own tools.

if you glance through classified ads for mechanics, you will often see "MUST HAVE TOOLS" in the requirements.

it's a sign of commitment to the field, also. the guys who are just starting out who haven't bought tools yet are often not taken seriously at all until they've got a basic set.

DH has 3 toolboxes. one is about 5'wx3'dx6'h. the others are smaller and more portable- along the lines of 3'wx2'dx3'h.

 

Thanks, Galaxee. I had no idea that such a substantial tool investment was required.

As a DIY hobbyist, my guess is that I might have spent ~$2K or less on tools over the past 30 years, but I am only doing simple jobs, not trying to rebuild an engine or transmission...

 

most mechanics have at least 2 rollaways.... good ones run $4000 and up

 

On the aviation maintenance side the story is quite the same, you either go through 2 years of college or slog your time in the military to get schooling or experience, then spend $1000-$2000 to take the FAA A&P (Airframe and Powerplant) certification tests. Then you gotta spend at least $5,000 for a starter aviation mechanic tool kit, just to get a job starting at $17-$20 per hour... I know some senior aircraft mechs with 20+ years in the job, who have over $20,000 worth of tools and get paid what, maybe $30 per hour...? Like someone said, being a mechanic is a great hobby, but a bad career choice!

 

damn! back before intense physical work was excluded from what hubby could do, he had considered becoming an aviation mechanic when cars got old. i see it's not much better there.

i find myself more and more glad he's back in school now.

 

Hey Paul, it's great that you are doing well there and love your job. But the older you get, you will think " Why am I doing this?" I have many times. But when I talk to a customer and explain what his/her car needs and why or how it operates ( mostly Prius owners ) that makes it worth while. Just wish the pay met the qualifications to do it. Many other occupations have just as much training ( or less ) and have no enormous outlay for tools and pay much more. Plus having more benefits and less working hours makes one wonder why we do it.
Yes, I have a lot of tools and my box alone, top and bottom, cost me 8k about 6-8 years ago. Add in all the tools in it plus new ones needed yearly, not to forget the broken/lost tools also and you have a fortune invested. Work week begins at 5am when I get up and home by 6pm if I am lucky. Leaves little time for family or hobbies. Pay up and down, depending on the economy, which is hurting us really hard right now. But what is a tech to do that has been in this line of work for a while? Just stick it out till retirement unless you are young enough to change. But if you want a challenging occupation with some customer interaction, this is the place for you. Just don't count on getting rich doing it, .

 

the holiday maintenance season was a huge bust last year from what i heard- the guys at the shop were complaining bitterly about that when DH went in for parts... has it gotten any better since?

dealers around here are cleaning house in the service departments, we know that much.

 

look i was obvoiusly very pissed off when i wrote that article...

its usually not about the money, (well maybe I sometimes wonder) however, I just hope its enough to live a comfortable life.

I guess i will soon find out when I start working on salvage priuses in the summer, if my honestly will have a role in the work I do repairing them and then flipping them...

thanks for all the comments, been very insightful, i guess if the things get going tough i'll just end up driving any hybrid truck for a living, i heard some companies give perks for hypermiling!

 

Since everyone seems in agreement that auto mechanics must spend big $$$ on tools, I wonder if the guy who drives the Snap-on or Matco truck makes a good living selling those tools to the mechanics...