sanctimonious: Feigning piety or righteousness:

Just a few additional comments (I suppose I've made enough already, but I can't help but respond to this).

First, I thought you had made the heroic decision to live in an urban environment where you don't need a car. Why the change?

Second, Economics shouldn't be your only consideration. You've made other choices where you've valued something to so great an extent you've spent additional dollars to get it. If you value the environment so much (and I'm certain you do as much or more so than I), why not reflect this in your auto purchase?

Third, If economics are that significant a factor in your purchase, and you want to do something for the environment, why not purchase a used car? It will cost you less, and you'll certainly be able to buy a used car that gets similar or better mileage than the Matrix.

Now, let me stop numbering these comments and add words without making them part of a prioritized list.

When you admit to your hypocrisy, you've stepped out farther than most of us. I have a very good friend who says this: "When I say I am an environmentalist, I admit I am a hypocrite." This may be overkill, as your statement likely was intended, but it still is true. It is this way in many things in life. Most of us do not want to shun the entirety of society and our economic system, so we make choices and compromises. I encourage you to take your dreams, your desires, your knowledge and your fire for environmental causes and temper them with a bit of humility and a concern for others' values.

I say to my children: "It isn't all about you." When they look at me with crinkled brows, I laugh and think that they will understand soon enough. When I say this to an adult, I hope for a different response.

 

Kind of scary, but I have to agrre with you F8L. Bring on the wrecking ball!

Some of the farmers are guilty for selling out, then farming the margins and wet lands!

Here is an article that shouldn't suprise any one. ConsumerMan: Buying organics on a budget - ConsumerMan - MSNBC.com

Hydroponics just doesn't taste the same as food grown in good old dirt.

 

Thankfully the ranchers and farmers I work with are not the sell-out types unless push comes to shove. Part of my job is to help keep them farming/ranching without having to sell-out because of economic reasons. This is good for the community, the environment (better than development anyway), and good for the rancher/farmer. Obviously part of the deal is they change some of their practices to more environmentally friendly ways.

 

Well, count me out, then. I bought a Prius to spend less on gas. I got it for $4500 below invoice last year. It had nothing to do with the environment ... and had more to do with giving less $$ to the Middle East. I wish that I could do more against global jihad, but at least it's a start. I also with that there was more I could do about putting an end to ridiculous domestic terrorism groups who kill university researchers and firebomb housing developments, but that discussion is for another day.

I also bicycle about 15,000 miles a year ... so don't even start with your waiving the flag of my being an Earth-hater. I just didn't buy my Priss to save the Earth. If you want to rip me about that, why don't you try to keep up with me on my next 600km bike ride and tell me all about it, my friend.

How fricking boring and tired this discussion is.

 

It's worked out well for me since 2003. I've now owned over a dozen Toyota hybrids. All have realized substantial resale value well above initial purchase price counting Fed/State credits and deductions. From #5 on, they've been "free", bought from prior sales net profit.

Portland, OR, has a central planning bureau mandating packed urban densities from, in part, an artificial urban growth boundary. The plan was environmentally and revenue derived, there's open space almost everywhere in Oregon that remains untouched despite owner's development wishes. The upside (I guess) is crowded buses and light rail. Our air quality is almost always categorized as EPA "Good" and has been for years, nothing changed there.

What did change is real estate values. It's not uncommon to see million dollar+ 1,200 sq. ft. condos (or $1K/sq. ft. typically) for sale downtown. Single family homes have appreciated well above national median, and the downturn in home prices lasted only a few months
and was relatively shallow, a few percent, but has already rebounded. As a real estate investor I'm pleased, but recognize that most people can't afford a downtown condo so they move to the 'burbs and commute, defeating the purpose of the plan. However, property tax revenue has increased substantially, as planned.

Oh, as for cars, I just leased a Scion xD for my niece's college graduation present. Newly redesigned, roomy, economical, fun to drive, light, maneuverable and should hold value.

 

That was pretty damn funny.

God is not perfect when it comes to kittens either though. I've heard on the internet that everytime you masturbate God kills a kitten.

 

Dayum! What a comeback!

 

I am a conservative to the right of repubs for sure. Leave me alone or get shot at liberal. I drive a Prii because I like it. I buy less gas because I dont like the prices and want to stay solvent. I hate the rag head terrorist types who sell us the gas also.

I pay a lot of taxes to keep young men overseas killing islamic raghead terrorists. I like that. Its a good investment in my opinion.

I could really give a ripe red rosy **** what a left coast holier than anyone else turd like you thinks about anything. It isnt people who buy Prii who are the villians here, it's people like you that love to start a fight.

The internet has a work for you and your kind. *troll*

Feel free to visit Iraq anytime you want to talk about carbon footprint. Have a soldier show you a carbonized foot of a jihadist!

 

I used to drive a Land Rover Discovery (~14mpg) and a Subaru WRX (~18mpg). Gas prices were never really an issue for me, but I finally decided that I could no longer afford the environmental and global political costs associated with driving those vehicles. I decided to buy a Prius as it was the best thing I could find that was workable in my current situation. I think I deserve some credit for making a positive change in my lifestyle regardless of what else I do or don't do. I applaud anyone attempting to make similar changes, and have little tolerance of anyone who attempts to trivialize or deride those efforts. I can respect those that recognize the implications of their actions, but are not in a position to currently change. I have no tolerance for individuals or organizations who deliberately attempt to misinform and confuse those attempting to make positive changes.

If that makes me sanctimonious, so be it. Sanctimonious hypocrite is a step up from the gas guzzling, consumerist, yuppie that I used to be.

Rob

 

Great post Rob.

 

In the same vein (btw, we traded in our Range Rover & Explorer for the Prius & 400h) we began using CFL's over 10yrs ago. Compared to today's CFL offerings? They were crap. They were much more costly, unreliable, poor color, prone to fail, and hummed. If everyone (refering to buying the 1st Gen of CFL's) said screw it, the older ones would have never provided seed money to develope the newer/better ones ... that have less humm, better color, cost, and reliability.

Now our family is struggling to fund an install of photo electric panels. Hopefully, the EV's will be just around the corner, so we'll be able to charge an EV car off the energy we can generate. The EV's that are just around will likely be crap, compared to the ones 10 years down the road. But some of us take the plunge simply to get the ball rolling. Right now ... even though PV panels will be 'better' down the road, in 10yrs.

Some will call us Pius? Some will call us stupid. Whatever

 

Now THAT'S what I'm talkin' about!

 

Tweev,

I assume you're being sincere, but I must admit you do come across a bit naive (at least to me). Until you have children of your own, you cannot fathom what it is like. Don't make yourself look like a fool by lecturing others on something about which you obviously don't have a clue. Just a brotherly reminder. Carry on, my friend.

 

I have to agree with you zenMachine ! We woke up to conservation about 5 years ago when my then 3 1/2 yr old was diagnosed with a rare cancer. We made some serious life changes regarding Chems, etc and still have it hanging over our heads. Most for the better!

As for the comment about getting off foreign oil I couldn't agree more. The way Iran is rearing it's ugly head you would think in was the 70's all over.

Least with the Russians we were = when it came to MAD! People that would strap a nuc on their backs thinking it's glorious make me nervous.

 

It's called reality check my friend, no racial pun intended from this point of view! And that's why America is such a great place to live. A person can agree to disagree with out getting your head lopped off, or your privates sewed up.

Then what your saying is, your parents made a big mistake or your an accident. Do you get my point.

 

You could also help the environment by choosing to stop eating entirely. Maybe subsist on a diet of rain water and wild mushrooms? How about not heating or lighting your house? It's much more environmentally friendly to use blankets and sweaters instead of using the heat.
You can make all sorts of suggestions, but each person will draw the line of "what is enough to help the environment" right next to "what I feel like doing".

You ride a bike to work, so that defines what you think reasonable people should do to help the environment. Why don't you walk to work instead? You'd save the resources used to create the bike and the gas used to ship it. If you walk to work, why don't you carry somebody who usually drives a car?

Regardless of anyone's value judgements, the best way to help the environment is through technology. America will eventually move towards non-polluting sources of power (nuclear, wind, solar, etc) and these power sources will supply the energy for electric cars on the highway of the future. We're probably 20-30 years away from that utopia, but we're heading in the right direction.

 

Enough, Well put!