genuine curiosity: why do all you like the Prius so much (i promise, not a troll thread.)

I agree with donee.
The Prius is not a "toy" car, it is a daily driver. It's great for long trips, for commuting, for hauling groceries, etc.
Generally, most motorheads that I know have both a daily driver and a toy car (or bike).
You drive your daily driver for all the normal, utility stuff, and you drive the toy on weekends, to shows, etc. That way, you are saving a LOT of gas, you reduce the risk of damage to your toy (parking dings, speeding tickets, high mileage, upholstery wear, need to wash/wax).

 

Can one "ignore" a user's posts in Priuschat??

I'd (and I'd guess I'm not alone) prefer not to waste my time clicking on posts generated from a 12-year-old troll wannabe.

... Brad

 

OP: I am enthused by brain and not brawn. Not trying to put you down, just trying to answer your question. E.g, a car with more power due to a larger engine would not interest me a bit; a car with more power and a smaller engine would get me reading how it was done; while a car with a smaller engine, more power, less emissions and higher MPG would be on my shoppping list.

For general performance spec, I appreciate the following in approximate descending importance:
No emissions
The highest MPG possible.
Quiet, both inside and outside. The perfect motor makes no noise at all.
Good handling. My standard that I compare to is our Subaru Outback.
Torque

 

Okay, to answer my own question ... it is possible:

Just go to your CONTROL PANEL ("User CP" option on the top of the page). Then go to your IGNORE LIST and add trolls like the OP to your list.

... Brad

 

1 supercharged Studebaker / 5 Porsche's / 2 supercharged Buick's and one gorgeous real Sting Ray (64) later I can say the Prius is also fun to drive but in a different manner. I am no longer young, dumb & full of cum. (hey they make pills for it) but my priorities have definately changed from when I was 22. Being retired I put a lot more importance on gas mileage. 50+ mpg even with the gas prices down makes it a lot easier to travel around and see the country. 2 weekends ago 4 people in the Prius with 3 suitcases on a 800 mile trip (one way) to the Biltmore in North Carolina I averaged 47mpg. That is what makes the Prius so important to me. FREEDOM to go when and where my wife and I want to go any time we want without spending gobs of money on gasoline. Not to mention the reliability of the car itself. But to better answer your original question refer above to my second sentenance and maybe you will understand why a little better.

 

Then I guess an Audi A4 is not the car to have...
Much too civilized car in my opinion...
You should go for an older one, when there was no driving aids, no ABS and maybe for a 2 wheel drive car...
One audi i keep in my mind is the fabulous Group B Audi Quattro S1

 

Not a fan of Audi's to be honest. I'd rather have a 1995 Mazda Miata with a turbo. Small, in stock form they can get 35mpg if driven nicely and they handle like nothing else for $5,000. Throw in a 5.0 Mustang V8 swap and you have a 250hp 2500 pounds roadster for around $15,000.

O, and for the record, I am 19 and bought my Prius on my own with my own credit and make the payments. I traded in a 2005 Toyota Tundra Regular Cab V8 that I had built for desert pre-running. I like that I now have a backseat and a trunk area.

 

I come to the Prius after a life of driving European performance cars. I love to drive, and I love to drive hard. I've had a series of Porsche 911's, BMW 2002tiis, Austin Healys, the odd MG, a couple of GTI VW's etc. I love the Prius for the fuel mileage, the whizz bang factor, and most importantly, because it is the right thing to do.

Do I think I am saving the world driving the Prius? No. Does it knock my socks off performance like the 911turbo? No. But it is the right thing to do. By being an "early adopter" it helps set the tone, both for others to see, as well as to push the envelope of acceptable technology.

It is pretty cool, when you are driving coast to coast, (as we have several times in the Prius) to compete with your spouse to see who can get the better average. It is fun to learn and teach yourself new tricks to get another .1mpg out of the car.

In short it is a great driving experience. Does the Prius have it's shortcomings? You bet, but have you ever ridden in the back seat of a 911?
Great experience, just different.

Icarus

 

+1

Making more power by increasing the engine size is easy. It is also easy to turbo charge a small engine to make more power but that increases emission and power delivery delay. It is difficult to make more power and MPG from a smaller engine and at the same time, lower the emission and power delivery hesitation.

If I may use JFK's quote and apply it here. We choose to support continual improvement of HSD not because they are easy, but because they are hard.

 

Ohhhh THANK YOU! THANK YOU! THANK YOU!

 

most here seem to have 2 cars.. i have 1.. just my prius

after adding on aftermarket rims, rear suspension brace, and 2" hitch bracket.. the back end of the car is finally stiff enough to play.. so i can sent it around corners at 50mpg+ on winding roads and all the back end will do is follow the front in a gentle slide.. 65+ on winding roads engages the vehicle skid control in just about every turn.

this is fast enough to keep up with just about any car going over highway 9... i've had motorcycles give me a thumbs up, sports cars, audi drivers.. even a lotus driver was proud of the way i throw my car into corners..

it all depends on what the car is set up to do... granted, i would love to get better rims that match my car... (proper weight and offset)..

i love the powertrain because i can minipulate it pretty well keeping the car at the edge of it's capabilities yet never breaking the wheels free too much due to excess acceleration... sure it would help in the strait aways to have a traditional transmission.. but.. honestly.. i'm pulling RWD techniques and accelerating from mid corner.. so i catch up to most cars. ( very familiar with this road)

what it all comes down to is this.. my ex has an 86 944 4 cylinder non turbo porsche. she gets worse gas mileage and i can pull away from here in every scenerio (slowly).... mainly because i can push my car farther due to me having traction controls and vehicle skid control. family car vs old school exotic... not bad for my econo car.

 

The first thing to realize is though Prius owners share a common vehicle, we come here by many different routes. So take this as one of many answers:

ECONOMY OF OWNERSHIP

Due to an accident, I had to replace a perfectly fine, 1991 Camry, my commuting car in 2005. So after looking at all of our requirements, it came down to:

• New Scion xB
• Used Prius, 2003 model

I got a good deal on Ebay and in the first year, we came in about $50 of break-even with the Scion xB. Most recently, I have $6k to pay off on this car and the Kelly Blue Book value is over $8k. In short, it looks like Prius depreciation has been very kind to Prius owners.

EMERGENCY POWER

I already had a 1 kW inverter that we used with our 2001 Echo to provide emergency power during outages. However, we could only draw about 300 W when the Echo was idling. My first modification was to mount the inverter in my Prius and it provides a reliable, 1 kW during power ourages. This has worked in both the summer and winter so we could say in our home.

VEHICLE STUDIES

The Prius has been one of the most studied vehicles by the Department of Energy and Department of Transportation. The application of so many new and challenging technologies in a vehicle that individuals can own gives us a road map into advanced technology. In particular, use Google and search for:

• Department of Energy Prius
• .gov Prius

Then if you go into the SAE papers, you can find even more. In short, hybrid electric technology, applied hybrid electric technology, has left the lab and is on the streets. There were no hybrid electrics on the streets 12 years ago but there were diesels and turbo chargers.

I have spent nearly $100 on SAE and other technical papers, about $100 more than I'd spent on technical papers in the past. This happened because the Prius has awakened my latent engineering curiosity so I want to learn more.

CROSS COUNTRY PERFORMANCE

I've had multiple long distance trips of 650-800 miles in a single day and found the ride, even with 50 psi tires, did not 'beat me up.' I set the cruise control, tune my satellite radio and just cruise 10-16 hours without a problem and at better than 52 MPG. So when I arrive, I haven't blown my trip money on gasoline and I'm not too tired to do stuff.

This happens because in efficient cruise, 65 mph, the Prius engine does not make a lot of noise and vibration. The seat is comfortable and I just listen to the tunes as the miles go by.

OPPORTUNITIES FOR ENHANCEMENTS

It turns out there are many interesting aspects of the Prius to challenge a technologists.

TRANSAXLE LUBRICATION

I've had the pleasure of making a three year study of Prius transaxle lubrication. This includes instrumentation to map transaxle lubricant temperature. It has led to an on-going study of how our transaxle lubricants age.

MILEAGE STUDIES

Starting with my drive to pickup the Prius and return home, I began mapping MPG vs MPH:

This eventually led to a drag model from Ken@Japan that I was able to use for a more sophisticated MPG vs MPG model:


I've also learned how to plan my commuting route for maximum MPG:


This past month, I stumbled across a subtle aspect of the Prius control laws, a 40-45 second window, that appears to give a significant improvement in my cold weather Prius mileage.

ATKINSON ENGINE ENERGY STUDIES

The Prius uses an engine cycle that has a lower compression ratio, 8-to-1, compared to expansion ratio, 13-to-1. This lets our 87 octane engines achieve brake specific fuel consumption higher than ordinary Otto engines and approaching that of diesels. But this has opened an opportunity to study this engine cycle "in the field" and not just a dynometer:

So this has led to more detailed energy studies including gasoline testing:


NiMH BATTERY TECHNOLOGY

A work still in progress, I'm learning a lot about how our NiMH batteries work.

ADVANCED CVT TRANSAXLE STUDY

The operation of the CVT transaxle is simply amazing. There is a rumor that someone in GM technical management said the Toyota transaxle was unacceptable because it required advanced mathematics to describe. I understand his sentiment and why the beauty of the CVT transaxle is so difficult to master.

WHOLE SYSTEM STUDIES

We know that the Prius is sensitive to cold. So some of us have experimented with spoofing to get hybrid electric operation sooner in cold weather.

Also, it is important to know what happens at all speed ranges:

You'll notice my older, 2003 Prius, is getting about 22 MPG at 100 mph.

WHEEL AND TIRE STUDIES

I'm testing larger diameter tires as well as documenting how to get a 4-wheel alignment. Also, it takes corners like it is on rails and strip off the tailgate vehicles with ease (and amusement.)

Fuel Economy

This past year, the Department of Energy has begun gathering user mileage reports of all makes and models. What we are finding is that many inflated mileage claims of diesels and TDI diesel advocates do not show up in either the EPA number or the user reported mileage.

CONCLUSIONS

My 2003 Prius, the older version, continues to delight with subtle technologies not found in ordinary vehicles. It continues to return good value for the money. Comfortable, quiet and smooth, it is a great ride for someone who wants to get there without being frantic about it. It has made my ride interesting.

Bob Wilson

 

I love driving my car. This is my first vehicle. I have driven a couple of other cars owned by my friends, and I like mine way better. But, none of them were new cars, so I cannot really compare.

I might love driving other kinds of vehicles, but I haven't tried. Who knows, I might end up loving your car better than mine other than the increase in the fuel bill. I might like driving a Hummer too.

The point is, is that I cannot explain why I love to drive a Prius to you. If you really want to know, you should rent one for a day and go on a 3-4 hour drive. May be you will love it too.

 

bwilson4web/Bob,

:thumb: :hail: :first:

And here I thought driving Amapola was simply fun.

 

Prius is a highly tuned purposely built car. The best performance mod one can do to a Prius is to upgrade the driver. We all know what performance means to you. How about a new concept of the 21st century? Performance = MPG / Emission. High MPG divided by low emission gives you very high performance. Diesel may give you high MPG but also high emission; hence the overall performance is not as good as a full hybrid.

These are mods that I have done (after upgrading my driving habits):

- BT Tech Stiffening Plate
- Upgraded Rims and tires
- Installed woodtrim interior
- Installed B-Quiet Ultimate
- Installed EV Button
- Blocking the Grills (for the winter)
- Dynoscan with Palm to monitor details
- Other small things like brighter headlamps / interior LEDs / Fumoto valve / Tint / etc...

Stopping at a light in complete silence with no vibration is something that can't be compared to anything else. A smooth jet-like acceleration and instant power response (due to electrification) produces very relaxing zen-like experience. Mechanical belt-cone-band CVT can't do this.

Enthusiastic driving experience is one thing but enthusiastic ownership experience is a completely different thing. I have a few questions for you:

1) Do you lease or own your A4?
2) Do you maintain your A4 by yourself?
3) Do you pay to operate your A4?

For me, the whole package is not just the driving experience. It is also the ownership experience that affects me as well as the social/ecology/political responsibility that affects all of us.

Prius is the easiest car to maintain (that I know of). First, there isn't much to maintain. Changing oil and air filters... then tires at around 50k... then coolant/anti-freeze and spark plug at around 120k. That's it! Changing transaxle oil is optional as it is not in the manual.

I started my interest when I was 25 years old. I bought one when I was 29 years old. I am now 32 and I am not looking for another car without HSD.

A few videos recorded by John1701a sparked my interest. This and this one.

I then discovered Graham's site and understood the design flaw of the Otto cycle engines. I was surprised to find out it only takes 15HP to maintain 60MPH. I became more and more intrigue by how the Power Split Device worked -- how and why Prius has just a single speed and never shift gear -- Prius is always in low and high gear at the same time because it is always in the right gear.

And then there is detailed information from Toyota. I found out that HSD is series-parallel hybrid... combination of Civic Hybrid and the Chevy Volt. HSD utilized the best of both hybrid types. This information was available back in 2003.. 4 years before everyone heard of the Volt.

I spend countless hours on forums in wars with anti-hybrids. In a yahoo group, I became aware of the free book titled "The Prius that Shook the World" the dealers were giving out. I just had to pay for shipping. That book enlightened me what Toyota went through to design, test, manufacture and mass produce to sell it in just 3 years. The electronic copy is available here.

After I got my own Prius, I made videos of every little things I find interesting and unique about Prius and post them online. The goal is to spark interest the same way I did back in 2003. Here are some videos that I made.

Short and interesting videos :

Long videos showing 70+ MPG in everyday traffic:
[ame=http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5629875641973044508&hl=en]I-495 LIE Traffic Congestion Utopia (70 MPG in Prius)[/ame]
[ame=http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3823585124965059408&hl=en]Relocate home with Prius and got 70 MPG (2/2)[/ame]
[ame=http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1484126312924696454&hl=en]Safely follow a truck on the highway with Prius: 65 - 85 MPG[/ame]

 

Wait...so driving behind an 18wheeler does what??

 

usbseawolf2000,

You get 'em too:

:thumb: :hail: :first: :cheer2:

How do I nominate this thread for Topic of the Month? Hey, the lucky
winner receives a $25 gift certificate at the PriusChat Shop. He'll love it,
I'm sure.

It's not for the truculence of the OP, but rather the masterfulness of many of
the responses.

 

It's called drafting.
There is a negative air pressure zone behind large vehicles that reduces drag, thus improving MPG.

You have to balance the amount of drafting vs the safety factor of close following. You need stopping distance. Very important to have an escape route in case of emergency. Hitting the back of a truck will wreck your day.

 

Prius began as a vehicle that was quite far from typical. Early buyers (some present at PC) had a variety of reasons to get in. Including fuel economy (cost), pollution emissions, and new technology. We really didn't know whether it was a good gamble.

Years passed, Prius changed and the fleet grew. Many early questions about reliability were answered. It is not an immortal vehicle but the failure rate of unusual systems has not been punishingly high. The low maint costs and high resales have contributed to it being among the lowest cents-per-mile vehicle available in the US.

It still draws tech types, cheapskates and those who I would refer to as carbon-conscious. It remains on the edge of vehicle technology (not actually a good thing) but therefore has created something of a group identity. That is both a cause and an effect of PriusChat and other internet discussions.

I think the Prius phenom does baffle some people not affected by it. Some no doubt feel that the role of auto is to get bigger faster and more luxurious. I see this as a social function and in many ways uninteresting.

Others I believe view the auto as a tool accomplish (mostly utilitarian) tasks and are draw to efficiency cleanliness and perhaps just a touch of luxury. Prius remains one of the few vehicles to hit those targets well.

 

Unfortunately, one unforseen effect of the Prius is it got "politicized". Too many opinions were formed due to media manipulation rather than first hand experience. This is still true.