1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Is GPS Really Falling Out of the Sky?

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by ggood, May 22, 2009.

  1. ggood

    ggood Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2004
    2,436
    517
    0
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Advanced
    I, Cringely Blog Archive WAAS Up? - Cringely on technology

    "The Government Accountability Office, a Federal watchdog agency, reported on May 7th that the Global Positioning System of satellites used for navigation and many other business and scientific purposes as well as for proving that your teenage son was actually driving down the Interstate at 100 miles-per-hour last Thursday night when he claimed to be bowling, well that satellite system is in danger of becoming unusable because satellites are not being replaced quickly enough by the U.S. Air Force.

    Only it isn’t true."
     
  2. snead_c

    snead_c Jam Ma's Car

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2008
    667
    58
    0
    Location:
    Hendersonville
    Vehicle:
    2013 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    That's an interesting link. I wonder what ( why) Cringley drives...;)
     
  3. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2006
    5,963
    1,981
    0
    Location:
    Edmonton Alberta
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    They aren't going to "fall out of the sky" for a very long time, due to their higher orbit. They are, however, failing as they get old. Note that the GPS system is a -MILITARY- GPS system, never intended to be used by civilians. Which is why the military isn't really interested in spending their "shortage of funds" on a system to support civilian ops. The poor guys have hardly -any- money after all. ;)
     
  4. ggood

    ggood Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2004
    2,436
    517
    0
    Location:
    Houston, TX
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Advanced
    Yeah, my headline was just meant to be attention grabbing. :D
     
  5. FL_Prius_Driver

    FL_Prius_Driver Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2007
    4,319
    1,527
    0
    Location:
    Tampa Bay
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    I
    Not true. The C/A code was fully intended to be totally civilian used and employed. This is clearly layed out in the original specifications and justification to congress, much like the "Defense Interstate Highway System" was originally proposed as dual use. There are two aspects not accounted for in the original design however;
    1) A GPS receiver would cost less than a couple of bucks
    2) The military freedom to turn off or degrade the system when and where desired for military use has gone away completely (just like the military ability to clear the Interstate for defense use only).

    Having spent too many years of my life working on the dang thing, I certainly don't waste time listening to BS about the system being on the fritz. Since it is used for FAA navigation and ATC purposes, if there was a real problem, the airlines and FAA would be yelling (quite rightly) louldly about it.
     
  6. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Since I almost always drive alone, and cannot read a map while driving, I'm glad to hear that the GPS system is not about to stop working. As a gadget freak, I like my Nuvi.
     
  7. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2006
    5,963
    1,981
    0
    Location:
    Edmonton Alberta
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    Yeah, Jill -usually- knows better than I where to turn.
     
  8. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Even when I know the way, it's nice to see exactly where the turn is coming up. And at night I cannot read the street signs. And at some streets, the signs are not visible. And then when I'm going somewhere unfamiliar, I could find it easily walking with a map. But driving, forget it.
     
  9. darelldd

    darelldd Prius is our Gas Guzzler

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2006
    6,057
    389
    0
    Location:
    Northern CA
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    Just a bit OT... you guys with Nuvi's... and TTS: Does some of the speach get clipped? Of course I expect the robotic nature of the voice, but sometimes whole syllables are removed, and even replaying them comes back the same way. Other times, the entire word or phrase is spoken without interruption. I've always wondered if mine is working properly, but have never compared to another. This is my first TTS unit, though I've had Garmins since they were introduced in the automotive market.
     
  10. Tech_Guy

    Tech_Guy Class Clown

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2007
    868
    123
    0
    Location:
    Silicon Valley, CA --- Land of Fruits & Nuts
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    I know exactly what you are talking about. My Nuvi does the same thing. However the latest system software v4.8 (available for free via the Garmin WebUpdater) seems to solve most of the the speech problems.

    Keith
     
  11. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2006
    19,011
    4,081
    50
    Location:
    Grass Valley, CA.
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Never noticed it myself. I always do the updates though and add the additional voice packs. I love my lil Aussie girl telling me what to do. :)
     
  12. darelldd

    darelldd Prius is our Gas Guzzler

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2006
    6,057
    389
    0
    Location:
    Northern CA
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    Yay Tech Guy!

    First thing on the list is "fixed stuttering!" Yay! I guess "stuttering" was a good way to put it. I too am very good with the updates, but missed this one I guess. Long ago, Garmin used to send out a note when an update was available for your unit. They stopped doing that some time back, so you just blindly have to check - unless somebody knows a trick for that as well!

    Eventually Garmin usually gets it all right with updates. Just takes a bit.
     
  13. Texas911

    Texas911 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2007
    405
    18
    0
    Location:
    Houston, Texas USA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    V
    GPS is so part of the fabric of our lives now, and the world has the good ole USA to thank, not to mention our tax dollars.
     
  14. samiam

    samiam Antipodean Prius Poster

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2007
    2,442
    29
    14
    Location:
    Enn Zed
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    I too spent a considerable chunk of my previous career on the development of the GPS system, from initial development through to the Block IIR SVs.
    (out of curiosity, which portion did you work on FL_P_D?)

    FL_P_D is correct, it was always intended for civilian use as well as military. Also correct that the periodic rumours of its demise are typically exaggerated. Having said that, the GAO report is pretty frightening reading (it is publicly available on line -- just Google GAO-09-325).

    Basically the acquisition programme for the Block IIF satellites was well and truly hosed up due to one of the periodic "great reform" movements that plague the aerospace acquisition world. This one was called Total System Performance Responsibility (TSPR). Ha ha.

    The programme was poorly managed, acquisition of the generation of satellites that follows IIF (called IIIA) as well as the ground system upgrades required to make full use of them (called the Next Generation Operational Control Segment) have been set back and left with a schedule that would have been hugely optimistic even when the programme office was rolling in cash.

    From what I know of the system, the GAO report, which I usually take with grains of salt, may have it about right in this case. They are recommending "that the Secretary of Defense appoint a single authority to oversee the development of the GPS system, including DOD space, ground control, and user equipment assets, to ensure that the program is well executed and resourced and that potential disruptions are minimized."

    Not bad as recommendations go. Interestingly, Space Command supports the GAO's recommendation.
     
    3 people like this.
  15. darelldd

    darelldd Prius is our Gas Guzzler

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2006
    6,057
    389
    0
    Location:
    Northern CA
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    Samiam -

    Gosh, it gives me the warm-fuzzies when somebody responds to a thread with actual *gasp* knowledge of the subject. ;) Well done.
     
  16. samiam

    samiam Antipodean Prius Poster

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2007
    2,442
    29
    14
    Location:
    Enn Zed
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    [​IMG]

    Cheers Darell.
     
  17. qbee42

    qbee42 My other car is a boat

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2006
    18,058
    3,074
    7
    Location:
    Northern Michigan
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    You never have to worry about that happening with me.

    Tom
     
    1 person likes this.
  18. darelldd

    darelldd Prius is our Gas Guzzler

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2006
    6,057
    389
    0
    Location:
    Northern CA
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    It is good to have constants in life to cling to.