Do you know what Honda Insight owners are talking about recently?

If you are happy to strip back on luxury features for fuel economy I have the answer from Honda.

Specifications | Today 50 2009 | Honda

 

Already have, multiple times, but you are one of the slow kids in the class. I've seen your same line of drivel uttered here many times by several others who similarly miss the forest for the trees. It's not a new argument and it certainly isn't a very convincing one. The market has done a pretty good job in refuting it.

You've made a bunch of bold statements that are verifiably false.

 

I heard about this thread from someone who mentioned this on the InsightCentral.net forum.

I own a 2010 Honda Insight EX and I got 49.8 real mpg during my last tank fill up. That's with the AC on most of the time going the speed limit or 5-10 mph faster with about 80% highway driving. The reading on the dashboad MID display said 52.5 mpg. There are some Insight owners who are getting better mileage than me. Overall, figured I got 48 mpg so far since I first bought the car 4 months ago.

I considered the 2009 and 2010 Toyota Prius. I already own a 2006 Toyota Highlander. I decided against it because I didn't like the dashboard. Most of the instrumentation is in the middle of the dashboard. Also, I would have paid a lot more for the Prius. I would of wanted almost every feature they offered and Toyota charges extra for a lot things. This would have brought the price over 30 grand.

I have to admit the Honda Insight 2010 does have some shortcomings, but so does the Prius. However, for the most part I'm satisfied with my car. It's not some stripped down car what other people on this thread have suggested. I have navigation, cruise control, traction control and an AM/FM CD player with USB and IPod connectivety. Also, it has Eco-Assist which tells you when you're driving efficiently. I've also added accessories like fog lights. It's got mixed reviews with some car critics rating the Insight over the Prius like Car and Driver. Likewise, the other people like the Prius more.

Hey what's important that you are happy with car. Both Prius and Insight owners are saving a lot on gas compared to people who are driving other cars. Although we may disagree a little on what the better hybrid is.

 

"I would of wanted almost every feature they offered and Toyota charges extra for a lot things. This would have brought the price over 30 grand."

Did you order your Insight with EVERY feature that Honda offered? Doesn't sound like it.

I am glad you are pleased with your Honda Insight purchase.

To get some of the facts straight, I am not a hypermiler by any means. I AVERAGE 55.5 mpg since June 12, when I got my 2010 Prius IV. Previoiusly, in my 2005 Prius, I got around 53-55 mpg in the non-winter months. Once again, I am not a hypermiler. I drive in an ordinary way in ordinary ridiculous Chicago area traffic.

While 49 mpg is great (and who wouldn't want to get that type of mileage), it does not compare to the Prius.

The Prius is a larger vehicle. And yes, it costs more than the Insight. I paid around $24,000 for a Prius IV with leather and NO Nav. I got the features I wanted and didn't pay for the features I didn't want or need.

I test drove the Insight, just to see what it was like, prior to purchasing my Prius. I felt cramped (and I am not a big person...I'm only 5'6"). The interior appeared cheap and some options that were available in the Prius weren't even an afterthought in the Insight. And, as short as I am, I bumped my head every single time I got out of the Insight.

The Insight is STILL a ICE with battery assist. The Prius' main method of mobility is an electric engine with ICE assist. Big, huge difference there.

I, too, am glad you are happy with your purchase. Either vehicle is a step in the right direction for reducing our consumption of oil/gasoline and reducing harmful emissions into the environment.

But, I personally couldn't see myself driving the Insight and I love my second Prius.

 

Radio,I am an Insight owner, twice over. I own both a first and second generation Insight. I am not a pissed owner at all. In fact, I think BOTH vehicles are respectful in their own areas. I ultimately chose the second generation Insight because of cost (not that I can not afford the Prius) and my previous dealings with Toyota on previously owned vehicles. I agree the Prius has a lot of very nice offerings which are not offered on the Insight (ie: leather, solar panels, LED headlamps, interior cooling fans, etc.), however at a very inflated price. I am currently getting 56+ MPG on the highway with the A/C ON the Econo mode at 60 mph on the second generation Insight. Toyota, or Honda, can not even come close to the mileage of the first generation Insight. On the first generation, I am getting 78 MPG city and 116.6 MPG on the highway! Granted it is no speed demon nor Mercedes, but efficiency was the goal ... as all of us who own these hybrids. I could only wish the American manufactures would get "hybrid serious" at a reasonable cost.Mike

 

I got about half of the interior accessories Honda offered like all-weather mats, cargo cover and cargo tray. For the exterior, I had the dealer install fog lights, door edge guards, body side moulding, splash guards, rear bumper applique and wheel locks.

I also had the windows tinted by professionals who specializes in that kind of thing. The navigation was already included when I bought the car.

But if I bought a Prius, I probably would have bought more stuff, since Toyota likes to sell accessories in packages, even if you don't need something in the package. This would have cost a lot more than the Insight. I do like the solar polared climate control, which is in the solar package, I believe. But I heard it just powers the fan and the solar panels doesn't recharge while you're driving. And I like the fact the Prius has a rear camera. Does the Prius offer parking sensors also as an accessory?

The Prius is larger, hence weighs more. As a result, it doesn't go much faster than the Insight, even though the Prius has a more powerful engine.

But I would have to admit the Prius does beat the Insight by a lot in city mpg. On the highway, it's almost about the same.

 

Oh... I noticed something that someone had posted about Insight owners being upset that they couldn't afford a Prius.

I could have bought a Prius V with all the options easily, but I liked the Insight better. Not only does the dashboard make more sense in the Insight. Some people have mentioned to me that the Insight looks better and sportier than the Prius. However the exterior of the 3rd generation Prius is an improvement over it's predecessors.


In addition, after test driving both cars (2010 Insight vs. 2009 Prius), I felt the braking and handling was better on the Insight.

 

... and not always to Prius' advantage, due to the extra mechanical -> electric -> inverter/battery -> electric -> mechanical energy conversions.

I'd call it a stretch demote Prius's prime mover to an 'assist'. Overall the electric motors and ICE are equally important, though the relative weighting varies with speed.

 

As a blissfully happy Insight-I MT owner, I'd like to say thanks for all the nice comments about the Insight-I scattered in here. In the summer it routinely gives 95-100mpg highway trips, winter mileage drops to right around 80mpg, current lifetime average is 83mpg for nearly 50k miles (would have been higher without my unfortunate "learning period").

Luggage space has never been a problem, for me anyway. In addition to the space under the hatch, there is a useful cooler-sized cubby under the "floor" of the hatch space. It's tempting to just put ice directly in there, but probably not a good idea.

The Insight-I's dash display is particularly helpful, as it constantly shows everything that needs to be monitored for good mpg right in the driver's line of sight: speedo (digital, far better than analog), instantaneous mpg, average mpg (lifetime, trip 1, trip 2, or segment), battery SOC, and battery assist/regen. My impression is that neither the Insight-II nor the Prius-III offers this info simultaneously without toggling?

Incidentally, calculated mpg agrees very closely with the displayed mpg: 83.08 calculated vs 83.6 display for LMPG.

From the sideline in all the above back-and-forth, it strikes me that the Prius-III and the Insight-II are are built for slightly different "missions" (just as the Insight-I is built for a completely different "mission" - carrying 1 or 2 people rather than 4 - than either of them). So the real questions are:
(1) rather than compare them to each other, how well does each accomplish its own design goals?
(2) how well do these "missions" fit with the current economic situation (which will determine how well each will sell)?
If cash is tight, the slightly lower price of the Insight-II might steer customers to it. If not so tight, the larger size and additional options of the Prius-III might prevail, as they seem to be doing at the moment. Cash for clunkers, gas prices, and aging of current fleet will also impact sales.

 

Why compare the Prius to the Insight?

I wanted to like the Insight. But, I could not see it as a family car. Rear seat is too tight. Cargo room is too tight. Since I bought the Prius, our minivan has not been on any of our road trips. Prius has been on 4, for a total of about 1200 of may 2300 miles. Why? My daughter has enough room, and we can store our luggage in the back. My daughter would be cramped in the back of the Insight, and I do not think the typical 3-4 suitcases and other crap would fit (my wife is a lousy packer).

As I get 53 on the roadtrips, my net reduction in fuel costs are:

Net savings is 1200/20 - 1200/53 =60 - 22 = 38 gallons saved.

Now, comparing the overall to my Subaru (which averaged 18 MPG):
2300/18 - 2300/53 = 128-43=85 gallons saved, or $221 dollars. ($110 dollars per month).

Car payment differs by $70 per month...

 

I think the problem I have is that driving an Insight is like eating at McDonalds and driving a Prius is like eating at a fine restaurant. All the "data" may be the same (same MPG, or keeping with this horrible analogy, you get full of food at both places), but one will give you diarrhea and the other will leave you with a good feeling inside

 

I could give a completely unbiased opinion on this issue but for one simple fact...




...I think Toyota is better than Honda. Did I say that out loud?

G'day to all the Insight owners who have made their way to Prius Chat to contribute to this friendly debate. I actually love that Honda is making a car that is competing with Toyota in the Hybrid arena. I wish more manufacturers would make as serious an effort.

I wonder when the Insight will make it onto the Aussie market? We need it to drive down the price of the Prius on the Aussie market. $40k for a base Prius is too much! I'd personally like to see a stripped version to broaden market appeal.

 

Wow, so I guess that makes driving my Insight-I like eating at Craigie on Main in Cambridge, MA?? Yum!!!

P.S. If you use the "Reply" button at the lower left rather than the "Reply" button at lower right you won't quote the previous posting unnecessarily.

 

Hmmm.. Prius owner here and I eat at Bartley's Burgers!

To each his own. I didn't like the Insight for reasons mentioned ad naseum. For what ever reason someone buys a car, it's a big investment and they should be happy with it. I'm glad you're happy too!

 

I'm well aware of which button I hit. I was specifically writing to you. I guess they call it a "Hon-duhhhhhh" for a reason.

 

Welcome Insight drivers.

I drive a Prius. For the majority of the time/miles it fits my perceived
needs well. It is not the perfect car, even for me, never mind the
whole car driving/buying public. My reality is I'm stuck with this car
for 3 or 4 more years while I wait for the EV that fits my needs. The
up-side is I'm getting great mileage, and this car is a continuing
pleasure and ongoing challenge to understand and drive well.

I come late to this thread because I feel that I have nothing at stake
in the subject of the discussion. I do believe there is value in looking at
the underlying weakness in the way the discussion is proceeding.

What car a person buys should be an intensely personal decision,
driven by the specific realities that the one, single individual has to
live with/in. So, I feel I have no reason to be defensive.

There are at least two threads on this forum about new Prius buyers
who found much to their dismay that the Prius did not really meet
their real world needs and sold it after a short time. Maybe they were
mesmerized by the leading edge technology, maybe the new model
advertising blitz, maybe just the realization that for short daily
commuting the FE isn't as good as high FE, ICE only cars like the Yaris
and Fit.

I'd like to congratulate the Insight drivers who have come up to tell
their story. I have no compelling reason to read them, but read
them I have. In them I see people who found the car they believe fills
their needs... for the most part anyway. Good on you and happy
driving.

The Prius and the Insight are like the wolf and the coyote. Each is at
the top of it's food chain. Each has it's niche in a larger environment,
but they don't compete directly. Within their specific niche they can
have long successful individual and species lives. These two cars are
brothers/sisters, or at least cousins, all in the family as it were.

I will admit to falling prey times to the many rhetorical/logical
fallacies in my postings. One of them is the fallacy of appealing to a
widely held belief for validity. Here on PRIUSchat we widely believe
that the Prius is the best car to buy. The same is most likely true for
the Insight on Insight boards. The discomforting result is that like it
or not, many times our arguments are based on shaky grounds and
there is lots of room for opposing views which does not rely on an
underlying fallacy.

See this for more on this particular fallacy: Fallacy: Appeal to Belief

Go here for a more complete listing of fallacies: Fallacies

Whether Prius and Insight drivers bought their cars to get good/great
fuel efficiency, or reduce emissions, or reduce dependance on foreign
originating oil, all three come as a package. The unintended benefits
are all beneficial.

 

I paid a lot cheaper than $200 for the cargo cover and also paid less for the cargo mat and the floor mats, because I bought online. I even saved money on the Honda Care plan by buying it on eBay. Saved about $175 and I got an extra year (7 years and 120,000 miles), compared to the dealer I bought the car from. Could you buy an extended warranty on the Internet cheaper than the dealer for the Toyota Prius? Maybe or maybe not, that's why I'm asking.

Actually, I heard from someone the difference is $800 with cargo cover in both cars.